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4 stroke mufflers - 8/28/2008 5:06:38 PM   
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Posts: 338
Joined: 1/20/2003
From: mt.pleasant, PA, USA
Status: offline 		This has been a problem . over the 32 years I been in RC flying i have had every type and brand of 4 stroke engine. no matter what brand of engine, mufflers have been a frustrating problem. no matter how you install your muffler it will come lose and you will louse it this is directed at engine manufactures why can't you do a better muffler system

frustrated
       Post #: 1

RE: 4 stroke mufflers - 8/28/2008 6:34:09 PM   
IFlyEm35



Posts: 238
Joined: 11/25/2002
From: Sun Prairie, WI, USA
Status: offline 		I have run many O.S. 4 strokes and have just taken the silencer off. Also none of my Y.S. have mufflers.

(in reply to go vertical)
       Post #: 2

RE: 4 stroke mufflers - 8/28/2008 6:58:41 PM   
arobatx


 

Posts: 1792
Joined: 1/18/2006
From: Kalona, IA, USA
Status: offline 		On Glow 2 & 4 strokes, I haven't lost one. On gassers I have had them loosen just enough to break the seal, and get a little spit on the cylinder. I use red locktite on the threads, and Permatex Ultra Copper in place of the gaskets when applicable. The high heat breaks down the red just enough so that it is removeable without trouble, but leaves enough goo and stick in there to keep things in place.

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RE: 4 stroke mufflers - 8/28/2008 8:00:28 PM   
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Posts: 338
Joined: 1/20/2003
From: mt.pleasant, PA, USA
Status: offline 		i have tryed red locktite and permatex over the years i have tryed everything my point is that i think the engine companys should have a better exaust systems why havent they

(in reply to arobatx)
       Post #: 4

RE: 4 stroke mufflers - 8/29/2008 3:18:18 AM   
Truckracer


 

Posts: 628
Joined: 4/3/2004
From: Des Moines, IA, USA
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: go vertical

i have tryed red locktite and permatex over the years i have tryed everything my point is that i think the engine companys should have a better exaust systems why havent they


Hmmmmm ..... I've used quite a few 4 stroke engines and have never had a muffler come loose! And ...... I've been flying for a very long time. I'm betting your motor mounts are not quite as stiff as they could be .... maybe molded glass filled types? Switch to good quality, metal mounts and watch your muffler problems go away. Now if you are soft mounting your engines ..... you mufflers don't stand a chance of survival. Just my $.02 .....

(in reply to go vertical)
       Post #: 5

RE: 4 stroke mufflers - 8/29/2008 4:56:28 AM   
go vertical


 

Posts: 338
Joined: 1/20/2003
From: mt.pleasant, PA, USA
Status: offline 		truckracer

I expected your type of .02 I have done all typs of mount work from useing mounts manufactured by the engine co. to making my own on c n c machines the end still is the existing exaust systems are poorly enginerd and none of the co.'s seem to be working on a solution

(in reply to Truckracer)
       Post #: 6

RE: 4 stroke mufflers - 8/29/2008 5:37:54 AM   
Bass1



Posts: 1828
Joined: 12/26/2002
From: Va.Beach, VA, USA
Status: offline 		I just bite the bullet and purchase a good quality after market "pitts" muffler and have never had a problem with them. And as an added bonus , they just look better with less visible cowl "hackage"!

(in reply to go vertical)
       Post #: 7

RE: 4 stroke mufflers - 8/29/2008 2:26:09 PM   
arobatx


 

Posts: 1792
Joined: 1/18/2006
From: Kalona, IA, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: go vertical

truckracer

I expected your type of .02 I have done all typs of mount work from useing mounts manufactured by the engine co. to making my own on c n c machines the end still is the existing exaust systems are poorly enginerd and none of the co.'s seem to be working on a solution


It doesn't sound like anything we say will please you, unless we complain about the engineering and design of mufflers in general, along with you. I've seen others have similar problems, and that sucks. We certainly don't wish you or anyone bad luck on this. Many of us have operated wide ranges of engines for long periods of time problem free in respect to the mufflers, and cannot share your current perception. Since it sounds like you've dipped your fingers into the machining process, perhaps its time for you to put this thought into designing something more suitable, and sharing it with us?



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RE: 4 stroke mufflers - 8/29/2008 2:58:28 PM   
jagnweiner



Posts: 822
Joined: 2/18/2003
From: Bloomington, MN, USA
Status: offline 		I've been running 4 strokes for 6 years. 3 Saitos .65, .80 and .91 (both old and new mufflers) and 1 Magnum .80 and I've NEVER had a problem with one coming loose. All but one have been on cheap glass-filled mounts. On the other hand, I've seen multiple OS 4 strokes where the muffler header pipe has cracked and fallen off.

If you have that much trouble, why keep running 4 strokes?

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-Scott
WACO Brotherhood #61

(in reply to go vertical)
       Post #: 9

RE: 4 stroke mufflers - 8/29/2008 3:54:38 PM   
go vertical


 

Posts: 338
Joined: 1/20/2003
From: mt.pleasant, PA, USA
Status: offline 		ok here is the point i love the way 4 S engines run i have had a lot of success with them but it seems that they have made all kinds of improvments in the engines except in the exaust systems my point is WHY HAVEN'T THEY? could it be that every one is ok with haveing to replace lost mufflers at $30.00 a pop. i am frustrated that in 30 years there has been no improvement in this and that the modeling community seems ok with that

(in reply to jagnweiner)
       Post #: 10

RE: 4 stroke mufflers - 8/29/2008 4:06:57 PM   
arobatx


 

Posts: 1792
Joined: 1/18/2006
From: Kalona, IA, USA
Status: offline 		Out of curiosity, what improvements might you suggest?



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RE: 4 stroke mufflers - 8/29/2008 4:41:30 PM   
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Posts: 338
Joined: 1/20/2003
From: mt.pleasant, PA, USA
Status: offline 		well first let me state I am not an engineer but i feel that the threaded pipe method is poor . i am a motorcycle rider have been most of my life i have never lost or had an exaust system come louse we bolt round hearers with a flange on allmost every other engine why not our model engines I know that this type of change would require new casting of the head but they bring out new engines useing the same poor method

(in reply to arobatx)
       Post #: 12

RE: 4 stroke mufflers - 8/29/2008 6:02:19 PM   
arobatx


 

Posts: 1792
Joined: 1/18/2006
From: Kalona, IA, USA
Status: offline 		......I would miss the freedom of positioning the header in any direction, without the need for a gasket or sealant behind a flange with floating header inside.

For the threaded pipe type, this allows you to adjust the length of the header to muffler, perhaps to sneak inside of a cowl, or to get the hot muffler outside of one, which is nice. For the compression nut type, like the older YS running just the header, I love this. Freedom to move the header and point it any direction, and again snug it down and seal it up without the need for a gasket or sealant. The other reasons I liked running just the little header pipe, is that it is small, requires little cutting of the cowl, sounds awesome, and since the YS can really shake, it allows less suspended weight dangled far from the crank.

There are aftermarket exhaust manufacturers who make adapters to thread into the cylinder head, leaving a flange that can be bolted to, with sealant and/or gasket. I guess I have never felt restricted in my options, or ability to accomodate any install with confidence, using either OEM or available aftermarket items in respect to exhausts for our hobby engines. If there were one good exhaust solution for each engine manufactured that would suit all of us, I'd assume they'd be sending em out that way. I'd say we have it pretty good with the options we have available.

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RE: 4 stroke mufflers - 8/29/2008 7:08:29 PM   
eugene


 

Posts: 598
Joined: 6/5/2002
From: Indiana| USA, IN, USA
Status: online

Rossi 2cy used this system for years, connecting with a spring around the head....

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       Post #: 14

RE: 4 stroke mufflers - 8/29/2008 9:31:29 PM   
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Posts: 338
Joined: 1/20/2003
From: mt.pleasant, PA, USA
Status: offline 		arobatx
i am glad you are happy with what you have now I AM NOT different header shapes could give opitions for different muffler locations . it seems you are willing to buy after market mufflers now so why not with a better mounting method i have had ys os saito enya engines they are all great running engines but none are improving there exaust methods I am chalanging them to improve there engines I also know they won't pay any mind to me so I;m venting here

(in reply to eugene)