2-phase structural epoxy question  
View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Tower Hobbies
Enter up to 4 keywords or Tower stock numbers
Logged in as Guest



Users viewing this topic: none
  Printable Version
       



All Forums >> RC Airplanes >> Composites Fabrication And Repair >> 2-phase structural epoxy question Page: [1]

Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
2-phase structural epoxy question - 8/30/2008 8:18:30 PM   
Scorpion Racing



Posts: 202
Joined: 1/21/2006
From: Lake Wales, FL, USA
Status: offline 		Ok guys, this is something I have never used and have a question about. I have been using MGS 285 for molds and parts and was about to re-oder when I saw this stuff. It is called Poly Epoxy Structural epoxy system and the product description says:

quote:

Poly Epoxy is a true high-performance epoxy resin with unmatched tensile, compressive, and flex strengths. It also has unbeatable peel, shear, and fatigue resistance, as well as impact strength and fracture behavior. Its great for wings, canards, fuselages, tail feathers, and landing gear. Use it in molds or moldless construction. It parts easily and works beautifully in vacuum bagging. (Avoid silicone-treated peel ply.) It has TWO cure phases, while all other resins-epoxy, polyester, or vinylester-have just one. The two phases occur all by themselves during the curing process. The resulting bond is tougher and stronger than any other.


My question is, do you think this might be better for molds and Q500 airplanes than the MGS system? The MGS seems to be a great product to me, but I am always courious about other products available too. If anyone has any experience with this product (or a better one) please post about it.

Thanks in advance...


_____________________________

Scott Smith
ssmith@hansonwalter.com
       Post #: 1

RE: 2-phase structural epoxy question - 8/31/2008 12:39:52 AM   
dreadnaut



Posts: 667
Joined: 3/13/2004
From: Vista, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Sounds like they are claiming post-cure performance without needing high temp. Would be cool if true. I'll be watching.

(in reply to Scorpion Racing)
       Post #: 2

RE: 2-phase structural epoxy question - 8/31/2008 8:10:29 PM   
Scorpion Racing



Posts: 202
Joined: 1/21/2006
From: Lake Wales, FL, USA
Status: offline 		Thanks Dread, I should have given a link to it. I found it at http://www.aircraftspruce.com/menus/cm/epoxy.html . I usually order the MGS from Wicks (no haz-mat on the resin of fast hardner! ) but went to Aircaft Spruce to see what they had and found it there. I have been unable to locate a MSDS sheet or anyother information on it yet.

Anyone using something other than West System or MGS for epoxy molds with good sucess? I am about to build a complete set of molds for some limited production, and want to use what works best for the tools.

Thanks...

< Message edited by Scorpion Racing -- 8/31/2008 8:12:17 PM >


_____________________________

Scott Smith
ssmith@hansonwalter.com

(in reply to dreadnaut)
       Post #: 3

RE: 2-phase structural epoxy question - 9/1/2008 12:26:41 PM   
Ed Smith


 

Posts: 2875
Joined: 12/29/2001
From: Brantford, ON, CANADA
Status: offline
quote:

My question is, do you think this might be better for molds and Q500 airplanes than the MGS system? The MGS seems to be a great product to me, but I am always courious about other products available too.



I am a great believer in new ideas and new products, that is how I found MGS resins. However I do not believe in change for change sake. I have used MGS products for years and it has performed perfectly. I see no need to change. So ask the question, What will the new product do for me that MGS will not.

Ed S

(in reply to Scorpion Racing)
       Post #: 4

RE: 2-phase structural epoxy question - 9/1/2008 1:57:45 PM   
Scorpion Racing



Posts: 202
Joined: 1/21/2006
From: Lake Wales, FL, USA
Status: offline 		Thanks Ed, I plan on using MGS unless there is something better for the tool. The only reason I had for looking at this other stuff was that it said:
quote:

It also has unbeatable peel, shear, and fatigue resistance, as well as impact strength and fracture behavior.
I know the polyester molds are made with a special gel coating which is much harder than the parts, so I wondered if that was true with epoxy also. The mold I made for the test fuselage worked out perfect, and thanks to you and Randy Etken for all your assistance with it.

So I guess the only true question I have is, is there a product that is better suited for an epoxy mold than an MGS Resins/carbon powder/milled glass/carbosil slurry coating with a built up, layered glass reinforcement shell?

Thanks all...


_____________________________

Scott Smith
ssmith@hansonwalter.com

(in reply to Ed Smith)
       Post #: 5

RE: 2-phase structural epoxy question - 9/2/2008 3:00:53 AM   
sensei


 

Posts: 396
Joined: 7/16/2002
From: SAN ANTONIO, TX, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Scorpion Racing

Thanks Dread, I should have given a link to it. I found it at http://www.aircraftspruce.com/menus/cm/epoxy.html . I usually order the MGS from Wicks (no haz-mat on the resin of fast hardner! ) but went to Aircaft Spruce to see what they had and found it there. I have been unable to locate a MSDS sheet or anyother information on it yet.

Anyone using something other than West System or MGS for epoxy molds with good sucess? I am about to build a complete set of molds for some limited production, and want to use what works best for the tools.

Thanks...

I have been using HTR 250 & 302X face coat from Resin Services for years in high temp tool making application. Room temperature layup and ramping post cure to 275 F. This makes for a stable pre preg or wet layup production tool .

Bob

_____________________________

Fly It Like You Stole It!!!

(in reply to Scorpion Racing)
       Post #: 6

RE: 2-phase structural epoxy question - 9/2/2008 2:38:04 PM   
Scorpion Racing



Posts: 202
Joined: 1/21/2006
From: Lake Wales, FL, USA
Status: offline 		Thanks Bob, that 302x looks very interesting. If I used the 302x could I then build up the thickness with MGS and fiberglass, or do you need to use the 250 for that? Or, is there a different method to build up the tool for that type of surface coat? I like the hardness it has at a room temp cure, and the highly polishable properties seem promising too. Can you give me an idea of the cost for a gallon of what all I would need to use this product?

Thanks a lot!


_____________________________

Scott Smith
ssmith@hansonwalter.com

(in reply to sensei)
       Post #: 7

RE: 2-phase structural epoxy question - 9/3/2008 12:28:18 PM   
sensei


 

Posts: 396
Joined: 7/16/2002
From: SAN ANTONIO, TX, USA
Status: offline 		If I used the 302x could I then build up the thickness with MGS and fiberglass, or do you need to use the 250 for that? 302X and HTR 250 is a mached system so you would experimenting.

Is there a different method to build up the tool for that type of surface coat? Yes, you can use the face coat and HTR 250 with two or three plys of glass; then place 1/4 thick tooling dough on top of the layup. This tooling dough can be purchased from Decomp Composites, they are also the supplier of the 302X and htr 250.

I like the hardness it has at a room temp cure, and the highly polishable properties seem promising too. Keep in mind that face coat as a rule will not polish to a class A finish, it's more like a class B finish.

Can you give me an idea of the cost for a gallon of what all I would need to use this product? It would be best to get current pricing from Decomp because I almost always purchase in 5 to 55 gallon quantity’s

Bob

< Message edited by sensei -- 9/3/2008 12:30:58 PM >

_____________________________

Fly It Like You Stole It!!!

(in reply to Scorpion Racing)
       Post #: 8

RE: 2-phase structural epoxy question - 9/3/2008 6:21:42 PM   
Randy Etken



Posts: 258
Joined: 8/14/2002
From: Shakopee, MN, USA
Status: offline 		Hi Scott
I have been using 1099 surface coat from Fiber Glast. I mix in 10% Aluminum power and 10% Graphite power. I seem to work fairly well but I do get some small surface bubbles that have to be filled. Talked to Jerry Small at the Nats, he uses a product from Resin Service and after applied on plug, heats it to get rid of any bubbles.

Attachments
Click to see fullsize image.
Click for fullsize 		Click to see fullsize image.
Click for fullsize


_____________________________

Randy E.
I feel the need for speed. NCPL racing

(in reply to sensei)
       Post #: 9

RE: 2-phase structural epoxy question - 9/3/2008 9:39:08 PM   
Scorpion Racing



Posts: 202
Joined: 1/21/2006
From: Lake Wales, FL, USA
Status: offline 		Hey Randy!
I have looked at the 1099 before, but never tried it. I see it has a shore D # of 90 also, can you tell that it is much harder and durable than a resin/bonding agent mixture? All the surface coats and gel coats I have looked into are around 88-90 (MGS is also a 90 without any additives). So, I guess the MGS is about the same hardness without any additives, so the milled glass and carbon I add will bring it up from there to be slightly tougher than the surface coats.

Well, I guess I will stick with what has worked for me so far! Go MGS


_____________________________

Scott Smith
ssmith@hansonwalter.com

(in reply to Randy Etken)
       Post #: 10

Page:   [1]
All Forums >> RC Airplanes >> Composites Fabrication And Repair >> 2-phase structural epoxy question
Page: [1]





Jump to: