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RE: Candidate forum impressions - 9/28/2008 3:50:54 AM   
KidEpoxy



Posts: 3655
Joined: 10/14/2004
From: San Antonio, TX, USA
Status: offline 		Bob
quote:

Same ballpark as far as cost is concerned. And at least the membership knows where it was spent.

The $150k Loss is just the magazine,
which Muncie has made clear is one of $10/$36 options of PPP member literature.
So we put the $10 magazine 'subscription' into that for 1000 members and the AMA loss is $140k for the Parkie mag.

You say we know where it was spent:,
Bob, where is the other $20 of the PPP dues spent?
We could ask MarkS, but we already did... repeatedly.

Paying for the labor implementing the PPP?
Apparently not, the Free Labor Elves do the work.

Bob,
it appears you are upset that Hoss isnt telling you where $10k was spent.
Why not ask MarkS where the other $20k of PPP (non-magazine) was spent,
and compare the detail levels of the two guys accounting of expendatures.
if accounting of expenses is soooo important to you.

Mark says it was spent on mostly marketing & publication (labor?),
while Hoss says it was spent on turning 7 channels into 50.


Oh, and lets not just ignore the recurring theme in the Candidate forums (that is the topic)
that Hoss, the one labeled as ineefective leader, claims Unanimous EC support for his deal,
while Mark also got unanimous EC support, except for the EC guys that voted against his baby.
So just who is the one that will have a hard time working with others?

< Message edited by KidEpoxy -- 9/28/2008 3:54:37 AM >

_____________________________

Optional MA is part of AMA history, we can go optional AGAIN if we just say so

(in reply to The Toolman)
       Post #: 51

RE: Candidate forum impressions - 9/28/2008 3:57:48 AM   
combatpigg



Posts: 10317
Joined: 11/22/2003
From: arlington, WA, USA
Status: online 		Bob, $10,000 in 1981 was enough money to buy a Camaro or Mustang with a big block, that's all, definitely not a house. $125,000 today will still buy you a nice house in some parts of this country. $200,000 will buy a decent house in some nice areas. Your relative values comparison is not a good comparison.
The market to make the PPP anything more than just a pipe dream just isn't there.
Bob, in your daily travels do you see dozens of potential PPPers flying their planes?
I don't see any.....ever.

< Message edited by combatpigg -- 9/28/2008 3:58:50 AM >

_____________________________

Led Zeppelin is NOT "old fogie" music.

(in reply to Bob Mitchell)
       Post #: 52

RE: Candidate forum impressions - 9/28/2008 4:09:03 AM   
rcuman


 

Posts: 18
Joined: 12/3/2007
From: Dublin, GA, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: littlecrankshaf

Well now, what do you think?

Mark has respectfully answered some tough questions with out the need to qualify the persons asking. He has answered all queries and hasn’t any red Zeros in his reply column. Even though the PPP is sort of his baby he went on to illuminate the fact that is costing us considerably. I can truly respect that.

Horrace has failed to answer many questions mostly due to his personal prerequisites. He has many Zeros in his reply column. It is most unfortunate since I truly would like to rally behind him and ask him a few questions. I know it could never happen since Horrace will stick to his guns to the bitter end no matter what but if he somehow he could find the strength to acquiesce and consider something greater than his views I think he would be great asset for us.

As of now, my vote will have to go to Mark.



I believe there is prerequisite for the EVP to be able to work well with others. I sincerely believe that Mr. Cain is incapable of doing so mainly because if it ain't his way it is the highway. I could be wrong but I do not believe so in this case. I have gotten my ballot and already mailed it back. I had made my decision two weeks ago.

(in reply to littlecrankshaf)
       Post #: 53

RE: Candidate forum impressions - 9/28/2008 4:43:28 AM   
Bob Mitchell


 

Posts: 951
Joined: 3/23/2008
From: Lexington, KY, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: KidEpoxy
So how the money was spent isnt what you care about?

You just want to single out one of EC that voted unanimously on something
as a ringleader of a committee he wasnt on that might have done someting wrong?
But determining the truth of if there actually was wrongdoing is not what you care about?

There is only one person posting on this board that was involved in what happened. HE volunteered the information about the money. HE indicated that he did something that might be illegal. HE indicated that he resigned as DVP as a result. HE inddicated that he had no regrets. I can't ask anyone else here, and after breaking the ice, he's not talking. If I didn't care what happened I wouldn't have asked. And AGAIN, he is the one running for election as EVP. And he lists this incident as one of his key accomplishments.

Horrace rants about the EC doing things in secret and not keeping the membership informed. Yet this key accomplishment was done in secret, might have been illegal, and led him to resign. And now he wants the membership to put him back on the EC.

Why you and some of the others don't see this as an issue is interesting. It seems to me to be a case of defend Horrace at all costs. Do you not see that the EC doing something and keeping it secret and and doing something that has to be kept secret are of the same cloth?



_____________________________

Bob Mitchell AMA 903015
H9 Alpha 60/Evolution 61NT, Sig 4* 60/OS 75AX, H9 95" Skylane/OS 160 FX, Futaba 7C 2.4GHz

(in reply to KidEpoxy)
       Post #: 54

RE: Candidate forum impressions - 9/28/2008 4:54:18 AM   
combatpigg



Posts: 10317
Joined: 11/22/2003
From: arlington, WA, USA
Status: online 		Bob, did you read mongo's last comment?
What DO you know about this pivotal time in AMA history?
What do you know about all the players involved?
How did we go from Hoss having absolutely nothing to do with frequency procurement to this?
You must know a heck of a lot more about it than I do?

< Message edited by combatpigg -- 9/28/2008 4:58:33 AM >

_____________________________

Led Zeppelin is NOT "old fogie" music.

(in reply to Bob Mitchell)
       Post #: 55

RE: Candidate forum impressions - 9/28/2008 5:23:29 AM   
KidEpoxy



Posts: 3655
Joined: 10/14/2004
From: San Antonio, TX, USA
Status: offline 		< $10k 81 Freq discussion moved here >

< Message edited by KidEpoxy -- 9/28/2008 5:24:24 AM >

_____________________________

Optional MA is part of AMA history, we can go optional AGAIN if we just say so

(in reply to combatpigg)
       Post #: 56

RE: Candidate forum impressions - 9/28/2008 7:06:26 AM   
Bob Mitchell


 

Posts: 951
Joined: 3/23/2008
From: Lexington, KY, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: combatpigg

Bob, did you read mongo's last comment?


These:
"now, do yall really want him to just come out and say that the money was used to bribe FCC officials to get the Freq use plan moved from the bottom of some unending stack of soon to be done stuff and into the publish now pile?

do ya really think that is necessary for him to state? "

If so, then I couldn't respond in that forum. Ken has made that clear repeatedly. Follow up questions to Horrace, yes, but not cross talk between others.

CP, Horrace opened this door with his comments. I was truely shocked that he would post what he did; I'm talking about the posting itself, not the actions of the EC. Given his comments...the "no regrets", the statute of limitations, etc. I really had no idea of what he would reply, and at that point nothing would have surprised me.

quote:


What DO you know about this pivotal time in AMA history?
What do you know about all the players involved?
How did we go from Hoss having absolutely nothing to do with frequency procurement to this?
You must know a heck of a lot more about it than I do?


What I know is what Horrace posted. Nothing more.

You'll have to ask Red about the "nothing to do......" comment. I wasn't part of that, and didn't ask any questions about it. As far as I'm concerned the letter he posted is hearsay. I got to where I am based on Horrace's comments and nothing else. They were provocative and deserving of pointed follow up.


_____________________________

Bob Mitchell AMA 903015
H9 Alpha 60/Evolution 61NT, Sig 4* 60/OS 75AX, H9 95" Skylane/OS 160 FX, Futaba 7C 2.4GHz

(in reply to combatpigg)
       Post #: 57

RE: Candidate forum impressions - 9/28/2008 4:05:33 PM   
combatpigg



Posts: 10317
Joined: 11/22/2003
From: arlington, WA, USA
Status: online 		Once you guys get to the bottom of this one and get our $10,000 returned in exchange for the 50 channels back to Uncle Sam, what's next? Our soldiers who looted Hitler's compound in Burchesgarten would be a good one to look into, shame on those guys . Plus the purchase of Manhattan for a sack full of costume jewelry has been a huge skeleton in our closet, someone here needs to look into that one too.

But really, the crusaders for justice need to be concentrating on what we do have some control over and that would be the giant, sucking chest wound known as the PPP.
The money that has been tossed into it is an outrage, much more so than the per diem money that was doled out by the EC in 1981.
We've got a flat tire right here, right now, in 2008 with the PPP and you guys are worried about some old tail light.

_____________________________

Led Zeppelin is NOT "old fogie" music.

(in reply to Bob Mitchell)
       Post #: 58

RE: Candidate forum impressions - 9/28/2008 4:44:51 PM   
Muroc1



Posts: 467
Joined: 4/27/2008
From: , VA, USA
Status: offline 		Well I say one thing for sure, there never is a lack of drama here on RCU's AMA forum.

If this was a soap opera, we could all get rich.

Frank

_____________________________

Help Promote our Hobby (one pilot at a time): www.WAA-08.org

(in reply to combatpigg)
       Post #: 59

RE: Candidate forum impressions - 9/28/2008 5:19:47 PM   
Robotech



Posts: 1150
Joined: 1/17/2002
From: Pine Bluff, AR,
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: combatpigg

>>snip<<

But really, the crusaders for justice need to be concentrating on what we do have some control over and that would be the giant, sucking chest wound known as the PPP.
The money that has been tossed into it is an outrage, much more so than the per diem money that was doled out by the EC in 1981.
We've got a flat tire right here, right now, in 2008 with the PPP and you guys are worried about some old tail light.


It's like Bill Gate's going 10K in the hole to buy the first version of D.O.S. from the original author. We know how that turned out. He even collaborated with an industry giant (IBM) to their mutual gain. Attempting to use first year expenses against first year returns is one of two things. A total lack of knowledge or a deliberate diversion from the topic at hand.

You tell us which.

(in reply to combatpigg)
       Post #: 60

RE: Candidate forum impressions - 9/28/2008 7:42:28 PM   
combatpigg



Posts: 10317
Joined: 11/22/2003
From: arlington, WA, USA
Status: online 		Bill Gates never went $10,000 in the hole for anything. His crib cost $10,000. He was a millionaire before he could say, "Ma-Ma".

PPP could have been adequately promoted for just the cost of the extra ink to have that option included in the AMA sign up form, with a couple of paragraphs to explain how it works. It didn't have to become the parasitic load that it is now.

Tell me something Robo, how many dozens of potential PPPers do you pass by on a daily basis in your travels? Let's pretend that you would answer that question truthfully and report back that you occasionally see 1 or 2, what makes you think that anything less than a bribe would get any of those guys to sign up just once?

I'm just trying to be realistic about this. If it was your $200,000 would you be singing the same tune?

In the meantime how is this ludicrous forensic investigation about Hoss coming along? You might get in touch with Chester Gould for some good tips about how to "collar" your man.

_____________________________

Led Zeppelin is NOT "old fogie" music.

(in reply to Robotech)
       Post #: 61

RE: Candidate forum impressions - 9/28/2008 7:52:53 PM   
Bob Mitchell


 

Posts: 951
Joined: 3/23/2008
From: Lexington, KY, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: combatpigg
But really, the crusaders for justice need to be concentrating on what we do have some control over and that would be the giant, sucking chest wound known as the PPP.
The money that has been tossed into it is an outrage, much more so than the per diem money that was doled out by the EC in 1981.
We've got a flat tire right here, right now, in 2008 with the PPP and you guys are worried about some old tail light.

You're smarter than than, CP.

THIS thread is about the candidates and their fitness for office. Posting about the candidates takes nothing away from any PPP discussions that have or are going on. If you want to complain about PPP then do so in a thread that is about that, rather than try to hijack this one.

Using your logic, there should be nothing discussed in the AMA forum except for PPP, and any attemtp to discuss other issues is a diversion from PPP. THat dog don't hunt.



_____________________________

Bob Mitchell AMA 903015
H9 Alpha 60/Evolution 61NT, Sig 4* 60/OS 75AX, H9 95" Skylane/OS 160 FX, Futaba 7C 2.4GHz

(in reply to combatpigg)
       Post #: 62

RE: Candidate forum impressions - 9/29/2008 3:25:57 PM   
Robotech



Posts: 1150
Joined: 1/17/2002
From: Pine Bluff, AR,
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: combatpigg

Bill Gates never went $10,000 in the hole for anything. His crib cost $10,000. He was a millionaire before he could say, "Ma-Ma".


Oh, My bad, then you're saying the AMA has not gone in the hole for the PPP program. They have millions in assets. Oh, OK.

quote:

PPP could have been adequately promoted for just the cost of the extra ink to have that option included in the AMA sign up form, with a couple of paragraphs to explain how it works. It didn't have to become the parasitic load that it is now.

Tell me something Robo, how many dozens of potential PPPers do you pass by on a daily basis in your travels? Let's pretend that you would answer that question truthfully and report back that you occasionally see 1 or 2, what makes you think that anything less than a bribe would get any of those guys to sign up just once?


As I have said in the past, I rarely if ever see potential PPPers. I do, however, see potential hobbiests. They eventually end up at our field and we welcome them and take them under our wings. They become fellow clubmates and friends. The sun comes out and lights up the blue skies and we all sing songs together as we fly our planes. Yeesh.

quote:

I'm just trying to be realistic about this. If it was your $200,000 would you be singing the same tune?


Well, $58 of it was mine before I gave it to the AMA to insure me, promote the hobby in general, and try to get more members.

quote:

In the meantime how is this ludicrous forensic investigation about Hoss coming along? You might get in touch with Chester Gould for some good tips about how to "collar" your man.


This one only deserves an answer so that others may not take your words as anything other than BS. I have responded to your silly statement over in the proper thread.

(in reply to combatpigg)
       Post #: 63

RE: Candidate forum impressions - 9/29/2008 3:48:32 PM   
KidEpoxy



Posts: 3655
Joined: 10/14/2004
From: San Antonio, TX, USA
Status: offline 		Speaking of silly,
now that the weekend is over,
we might see some action on the silly Red Zero threads in Mark's candidate forum.
If folks are concerned about the number of silly red zero questions, this might interest them.... or it might just be a huger waste of bandwith than when those questions were wasting just 1 candidates time. Lets watch & find out

_____________________________

Optional MA is part of AMA history, we can go optional AGAIN if we just say so

(in reply to Robotech)