RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System

RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System
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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/18/2009 1:35 AM

Alex7403

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ORIGINAL: Brendan Lugo

quote:

ORIGINAL: rctom

quote:

ORIGINAL: MikeAndersonCA

Here's a charge jack follow up for Mike Mayberry: Just what are Hitec engineers trying to accomplish or prevent with the diode setup in the charge-jack circuit?

The transmitter has support for using a 2s lipo built into its programming. I suspect the diode is there to make sure you have to remove the battery from the radio before charging.

I had a customer call yesterday looking to replace a plane that had burned up from a Lipo fire. If that happened inside a transmitter it would make a giant mess, would destroy the transmitter and possibly burn down one or more structures.

For any manufacturer better safe than found negligent. Is it really that hard to pull the battery out to charge it?

TF

Ding ding ding! We have a winner.
It is there to help protect the transmitter/circuitry from having a battery over charged by a peak charger that fails to shut off. From a service stand point I have seen quite a few ''melt downs'' come across my bench because of this and the diode had been jumped in the radio. Granted, damage to the radio can still happen even with out it jumped but the severity of the damage has been way less and usually those radios can be fixed back up with out too much hassle. So in short, it's there to protect you and it's there to protect us.

So in order to field charge I need remove the battery from the transmitter? for me its twice a day… is that the best you can come up with?

For me field charging is essential and I’m charging 90% of the time from the car on my way to the field and second time at the field.

Just when I thought what a great radio Hitec auorora 9 can be to leave futaba and not to look back.

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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/18/2009 1:41 AM

Bob Pastorello

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Alex - ain't none of my business, and I'm not connected to Hitec or your decision - but I think it would be really short-sighted to eliminate the Aurora from your decision making because of a safety feature that all the other brands ALSO use. If it is really that important, then maybe your battery SHOULD have an extra lead attached, and you then only have to open the battery door and hook up your charger.

The features of this radio for me really outshine such a minor inconvenience.

But then again, I'm using a 2S 2500ma LiPo, and I remove it to charge it anyway. I only have to charge about every 36 hours of transmitter use. That's a LONG time of "power up" time, so it's no grief for me.

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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/18/2009 1:58 AM

BuschBarber

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I have been using LliPos in all my Tx's - JR 8103, JR 9303, Futaba 8AUPS, Futaba 9CAP - and in each case I remove the LiPo from the Tx - It is not a big deal and it keeps the Tx from being Toasted if the charger ever goes bad. I would have no problems removing the LiPo from an A9, to charge. That would not deter me from buying an A9. It sounds like a nice Radio System.

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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/18/2009 2:08 AM

OldRookie

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How many cycles are the battery plugs good for?
I remember seeing estimated life cycles for standard transmitter battery plugs, and it wasn't that many. Don't remember what it was right now.

Greg

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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/18/2009 3:27 AM

BuschBarber

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Are you talking about how many times you can Plug In and Unplug the battery cable? I can see where that might be an issue. Most LiPos come with Balancing Taps requiring you to at least open the Battery Compartment Door and plug the charger into the Balancing Tap, not the Charge Port on the outside of the Tx. I am not sure if the A9 LiPo comes with a Balancing Tap.

Ever since Digital ESV's and Cycling Chargers came out, I have either Jumped the Diode or pulled the battery from the Tx to avoid the limitations of the Diode. Newer Tx's like the 9303 use a different component to Protect the battery from improper Charge Polarity and still allow the use of a Digital ESV and Cycling Chargers.

With LiPos, you don't really need to Cycle them, although, my AstroFlight 109 and FMA 4S and 10S do have Cycling capabilities.

I have never had a failure of the Tx Battery Connector. I have had my XP9303's for two years.

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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/18/2009 3:32 AM

Alex7403

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Bob this is not short-sighted this is actually long sighted because as I know using a transmitter doesn't not end at its list of mixes but include much more aspects like quick charging for example.
I already have two entry level transmitters and felt like getting a high end this time so I really need to think if I want to compromise on no charging at the field.
For me if I'm not making 12 flights on a weekend day I'm not OK, further more I have an airplane living in my car for times I got off earlier and drive by the field and charging while driving, for this its not good that the quick charger is complicated.
So I really need to think what high end transmitter I want.

Question: for how many flights is one night long charge from a wall charger is enough?
I never had other batteries than Nicd in my Tx's and Rx's.

Thanks
Alex

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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/18/2009 3:46 AM

Alex7403

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BuschBarber, if I'm going on a high end radio system I dont want a half baked one with special needs and it doesn't matter how sexy its list of features looks like.
I have a malfunction now in my futaba 6EX 2.4 GHz with one R'x and I see how attached I'm to this system - so to buy a new Tx or to fix? its the same price.
I may decide on the A9 or I may not.

Alex

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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/18/2009 4:24 AM

BuschBarber

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I don't think using a LiPo Tx battery makes a system Half Baked, but you can always stick with NiMh or you can use Enyloop or A123 batteries.

I do not own an A9 and I do not represent any manufacturer of any RC product. I have been flying RC for 31 years and I have used many different radios over the years. I have seen and experienced first hand the advancements in RC technology and the benefits realised by the End User. I have purchased many Futaba and JR compatible Hitec Rx's and many Hitec servos over the years. The company is solid and their Service and Warranty is great.

The A9 sounds like a great alternative to the other major brands. It is nice to have this kind of competition in the marketplace as it helps keep the cost down and the features up.

I do most of my charging at the field. A Wall Charger is fine for NiCad and NiMh, but I prefer to use better quality chargers that anticipate the Peak and allow me to Cycle. These chargers also detect incorrect Polarity so I have never even blown a fuse in any of my Tx's. I struggled for years with NiMh batteries that I could not Fast Charge and would False Peak constantly. Slow charging was Long and Tedious. Leaving the Tx on the shelf for a week usually required Recharging again.

With LiPos, I don't have to charge my Tx batteries for weeks and then, it only takes an Hour to recharge.

Next spring, the new generation of LiPos will only take 15-30 minutes to recharge fully.

I will be exploring A123 cells and any other new battery technologies that are coming out.

I use LiPo Rx batteries in all my aircraft and the charge last a loooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooong time.

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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/18/2009 4:54 AM

OldRookie

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BuschBarber

Are you talking about how many times you can Plug In and Unplug the battery cable? I can see where that might be an issue. Most LiPos come with Balancing Taps requiring you to at least open the Battery Compartment Door and plug the charger into the Balancing Tap, not the Charge Port on the outside of the Tx. I am not sure if the A9 LiPo comes with a Balancing Tap.

If the battery has to be unplugged every charge the plugs can get loose. I have had this happen on my old Futaba 8UAFS. The best way to go is to have 2 wires coming out of the battery, one to the transmitter, the other for charge.

Too bad the A123 cells couldn't be used in this transmitter. The A123 pack would be 6.6V. I don't think this would be enough for this transmitter. 3 cells would be 9.9V...probably too much.

What is wrong with the 1300mAh pack that comes with the radio?

Greg

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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/18/2009 5:01 AM

Meyer1811

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Guys,

When I bought my A9 I also purchased an Enloop 2000 mA NiMH to use as my primary battery with the 1300 mA that came with the transmitter as a backup.

I flew with it on Sunday with the transmitter powered up flying for about 2 hours and according to the display I still had 80% capacity. Now I don't know what percentage the transmitter would quit working, but I tend to think that I could have gotten at least 6 hours of continual use.

I don't know how long the 12 flights mentioned above would have been I guess they are about 15 minutes each (unless flying a glider or Slow Stick). If that is the case then 12 flights would last 3 hours total.

I would consider putting in a LiPo or A123, but I have forgotten to turn off my DX7 a couple of times and run its batteries. That would have killed the LiPo.

From what I have read, the A9 would save me from doing that because the transmitter will shut off if the battery voltage drops below a specific point.

John

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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/18/2009 5:12 AM

Alex7403

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Can I put a Nicd battery into the A9 transmitter?
I'm thinking to charge it at the field with a simple charger from its charger plug without removing the battery like im doing now with Nicd 9.6v futaba radios.
this is the charger im using now for the Tx and Rx: http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXL311&P=7
Thanks
Alex

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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/18/2009 5:37 AM

MikeMayberry

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The Futaba has a diode in it too if I'm not mistaken, as does most every other radio out there. It prevents you from damaging the expensive main board if accidentally plugged in backwards.

You can use a NiCad, NiMh, LiPo, LiIo but not an A123 due to the lower voltage. There are many option. Also setting your screen backlight to go off after 30 seconds will help the battery life too. This setting is in the Power menu.

Mike.

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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/18/2009 6:53 AM

A.T.

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alex7403 Can I put a Nicd battery into the A9 transmitter?
I'm thinking to charge it at the field with a simple charger from its charger plug without removing the battery like im doing now with Nicd 9.6v futaba radios. This is the charger im using now for the Tx and Rx: http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXL311&P=7 Thanks Alex

Yes. The A9 accepts 6 cell AA either NiCad or NiMH battery pack under one menu or change menu function to accept Lipol Pack as shown in screen shots as per link below..
Indicated charger would not be able to peak charge batteries properly in any known recent Futaba Tx unless the Diode was by-passed - you would have a false peak only.
Please refer to:
Aurora A9 and Optima RX 2S Voltage Capablitites
Aurora A9 Battery Installed ex Factory is a #54128 TX NMH battery (6 cell) Pack (FLAT TYPE) for AUR( RA9 ) 7.2v / 1300 MAh " (not an Eneloop 2000).
Aurora A9 Battery Compartment Fit Lipol battery and connectors
Aurora A9 - Lipol User Adjustable Voltage sets Shut Down = TURNS TX OFF to save damage to Lipol and/or TX
(Audible Battery Warning is still at 6.9V with Lipol which provides say 10-20 min before shutdown.)
Aurora A9 Warning Alarms Battery types, voltage levels and consumption with Power/Battery Management Screen Shots.
Aurora A9 RX Voltage on Screen SPC voltage has preference over BEC voltage if using tap.
Aurora A9 110/230 Vac charger Red LED does not change to Green simply dims out but charge continues same rate.
Aurora A9 Diode in TX Charge Circuit Never Jump TX Charge Circuit Diode - Hitec FAQ.
Aurora A9, Eclipse 7, Flash 4&5, Optic 6, Prism 7 series Field and Fast Charging.

and refer regularly to frequently updated: Aurora 9 Mixes, Setups, Tips, Undocumented Features.

Regards
Alan T.
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< Message edited by A.T. -- 11/18/2009 8:01 AM >

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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/18/2009 11:36 AM

Tony Gag Jr.

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JR transmitters do not have diodes. I do like the idea of using a second connector for charging so you do not have to disconnect the battery every time you want to charge. It looks like a nice radio. I hope to get one in my hands soon to check it out.

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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/18/2009 1:41 PM

rctom

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alex7403

Can I put a Nicd battery into the A9 transmitter?
I'm thinking to charge it at the field with a simple charger from its charger plug without removing the battery like im doing now with Nicd 9.6v futaba radios.
this is the charger im using now for the Tx and Rx: http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXL311&P=7
Thanks
Alex

Alex:

You have mentioned field charging your transmitter several times, something that I NEVER do and I don't remember ever seeing anyone else do it. I wonder if maybe there is something wrong with the Tx battery you are currently using. You may have gotten the wrong idea about what to expect from the A9 and a lipo battery.

In mine I have a 2150mah lipo. I charged it when I got the battery and in about 3 weeks I have not needed to recharge it. The A9 transmitter uses only a small amount of power. The backlight on the display has a configurable timer so the light goes out if you don't touch the display for a minute or two or whatever you set, this is another power saving feature.

And for your life style it seems like the lipo/A9 would be ideal. Lipos have no self discharge, which means you can charge it today and carry it around with you for a month or two and it will still be fully charged. The same is true for eneloops.

I suggest getting the A9 and a lipo battery (various suppliers and capacities are available, all greater than the stock pack) or possibly 2. Keep one as a spare. That's what I do, in my case I have the original stock nimh pack plus a spare lipo. With this setup you will never be caught without battery power and you will be able to fly probably 15-16 hours with what you are carrying around.

Oh, also, lipo batteries will recharge in an hour or two, so you don't need to start the night before. I just check the voltage in the Tx and swap when one gets low, then recharge the spare.

TF

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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/18/2009 2:38 PM

Flyboy76

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Brendan Lugo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Flyboy76

Brendan or Mike, can either one of you give an ETA as to when the A9 will hit Canada, i've been checking greathobbies and hiflight regularly and was wondering when they'll be coming in..

thanks

geoff

A few went to PM hobby craft but I'm sure it was not enough to fill their back orders. I think the only available A9 left in the country here is actually at a local hobby shop. They would probably ship it if you want to give them a call. Hobby Town. 760-739-0672

thanks Brendan... much appreciated on the info.. i have been checking those 2 places because i have gift cards for both stores and would like to use them.. could you give an idea if they will be receiveing A9's before Xmas??

thanks again.

geoff

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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/18/2009 4:32 PM

Brendan Lugo

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Flyboy76

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brendan Lugo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Flyboy76

Brendan or Mike, can either one of you give an ETA as to when the A9 will hit Canada, i've been checking greathobbies and hiflight regularly and was wondering when they'll be coming in..

thanks

geoff

A few went to PM hobby craft but I'm sure it was not enough to fill their back orders. I think the only available A9 left in the country here is actually at a local hobby shop. They would probably ship it if you want to give them a call. Hobby Town. 760-739-0672

thanks Brendan... much appreciated on the info.. i have been checking those 2 places because i have gift cards for both stores and would like to use them.. could you give an idea if they will be receiveing A9's before Xmas??

thanks again.

geoff

We should be receiving our next batch of A9's in the next week or so, so I would think those shops would be gettng a few more radio systems before Xmas.

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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/18/2009 5:27 PM

Flyboy76

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Ok thanks very much..... I'm going to call and put one on order....

Geoff

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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/19/2009 12:04 AM

4*60

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I have charged with Hobbico, Triton, Triton Jr, Triton II etc. Hitec Eclipses, Hitec Prism, Futaba 9C, JR XP9303 through the charge receptacle. All seemed to charge and all seemed to be good for many, many flights and with NIMH packs, a few weeks between charges. If that's a false peak the it was still very adequate for flying and they showed anywhere from 10.8 to 11.3 volts when charged (so I on't consider that a false peak, BTW).

Anyway it has worked for me over a 10 year time frame and I will try it out if I get an Aurora. I have no desire to open the door and unplug every time.

If someone could try it and let us know how it goes.

PS with the Eneloops showing 80%. Be careful as they will show a high charge condition and then drop like a rock, I understnd, like all NIMH. I did have that happen one day when I showed 9.8 and flew a few flights. Then the low voltage alarm went off and I thought it was a timer. Got down OK anyway. Be careful.

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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/19/2009 7:36 PM

bgw45

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Does anyone have a part number ( Radio Shack or whatever ) for the charge plug?

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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/19/2009 9:18 PM

A.T.

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quote:

ORIGINAL: bgw45 Does anyone have a part number ( Radio Shack or whatever ) for the charge plug?

Plug sizes :
Aurora A9 110/230 Vac charger Charge Plug/adaptor sizes. [Red LED does not change to Green simply dims out, continues charge at same rate].

Aurora 9 - Mixes, Setups, Tips, Undocumented Features.

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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/19/2009 9:34 PM

Bob Pastorello

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Hey, A.T. - I don't want to get into some big disagreement, but that charger "dims but continues charging" is b.s. When mine was new, I left is conected, it dimmed, left it overnight....next day, turned on TX, read 6.5, and started beeping almost immediately. That pack went in the trash as I installed my 2S lipo.....but my experience was sure less than satisfactory.

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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/20/2009 5:01 AM

bgw45

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Thanks for the link, AT. I'm not sure why the "diode" in the circuit would keep the batter charger from recognizing peek, unless the charge leads are on the board side of the diode and charging would be through the diode.

The diode in a Futaba is there simply to prevent damage to the board if a JR or Spectrum charger was attached. They cause a mess in a Futaba since they have reversed polarity.

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RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/20/2009 9:39 AM

A.T.

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quote:

ORIGINAL: bgw45 Thanks for the link, AT. I'm not sure why the "diode" in the circuit would keep the batter charger from recognizing peek, unless the charge leads are on the board side of the diode and charging would be through the diode. The diode in a Futaba is there simply to prevent damage to the board if a JR or Spectrum charger was attached. They cause a mess in a Futaba since they have reversed polarity.

A peak detect charger if used through charging circuits containing a diode as used by Futaba and Hitec, can only give a false peak. No True Peak Detect Charger can read the voltage when the feedback is impaired/interrupted. Even the quick blow fuse used by JR has caused problems for users. (mainly when blown by many users hooking a Hitec, Sanwa/Airtronic or Acoms lead up in error - reversed polarity, some more than once).

Clear statement from just one of the leading charger manufacturers (and repeated by others) =
Sirius Electronics-TX Diodes bridging FAQ page
"Q: My SIRIUS CHARGE will not work with my Futaba transmitter. Why?
A: There is a diode in the charging circuit of most Futaba FM and PCM transmitters (Futaba AM transmitters do not have a diode). This diode prevents SIRIUS CHARGE from detecting the transmitter battery and turning itself on. The diode is very easy to defeat, and will not affect operation of the transmitter. If you would like to see how to do it, click here.
By the way, BEWARE of fast chargers that claim to work through a diode. It is impossible to do proper peak detection through a diode, due to the diode voltage drop changing drastically with temperature and current. Your batteries are at risk!"
-
With increasing use of Lipols. there are corresponding increase in reported incidents and recalls e.g
Battery Carriage Dangers - November "Aviation News" - already some suppliers will no longer ship LiPo's by air.
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Quote
1. "The transmitter has support for using a 2s lipo built into its programming. I suspect the diode is there to make sure you have to remove the battery from the radio before charging.
I had a customer call yesterday looking to replace a plane that had burned up from a Lipo fire. If that happened inside a transmitter it would make a giant mess, would destroy the transmitter and possibly burn down one or more structures.
For any manufacturer better safe than found negligent. Is it really that hard to pull the battery out to charge it? "
RCTom "TF" post # 273 above

2. "Ding ding ding! We have a winner.
It is there to help protect the transmitter/circuitry from having a battery over charged by a peak charger that fails to shut off. From a service stand point I have seen quite a few ''melt downs'' come across my bench because of this and the diode had been jumped in the radio. Granted, damage to the radio can still happen even with out it jumped but the severity of the damage has been way less and usually those radios can be fixed back up with out too much hassle. So in short, it's there to protect you and it's there to protect us. "
Brendan Lugo, Hitec USA post # 274.above.

Concur with above and posts 273 & 274, having also had Futaba and Hitec TX brought in for service which have been virtually destoyed by overdischarge/overcharged Lipol batteries or where diode has been jumped and a "trusty - not old" charger has failed, not pretty sights and overall repair + new battery or full replacement cost is high.

There are sound reasons why more than one manufacturer adds protection to the circuit and more than one has clearly advised "Do not charge Lipol batteries in the transmitter."

Aurora 9 Mixes, Setups, Tips, Undocumented Features.

Regards
Alan Tong
Alan's Hobby, Model & RC FAQ Web Links

< Message edited by A.T. -- 11/20/2009 10:01 AM >

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Post #: 299

RE: New Hitec Aurora 9-Channel 2.4Ghz Radio System - 11/20/2009 9:59 AM

PlaneKrazee

Posts: 4200
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From: Westerly, RI, USA
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I wish the warranty was longer than a year.

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