RE: Hangar 9 150 Size P-51

RE: Hangar 9 150 Size P-51
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RE: Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 - 9/27/2006 10:04:43 PM

Hello82

Posts: 128
Joined: 8/20/2006
From: Boston, MA, USA
Status: offline

Hi again

Ok got found my charging stuff.

Capt G...I took a closer look at your plane and noticed you drew some lines on it, or small screw holes...how did you do that on the ultrakote?

I jumped right in and bought some of those new heavy JR ultra, metal gear servos for the flaps and can use them down the road for my Ziroli P-51 I'm going to build soon. Hows that build going for you Capt G? Similarities to the H9-P-51 arf?

M

(in reply to Hello82)

Post #: 626

RE: Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 - 9/27/2006 10:44:24 PM

Capt G

Posts: 832
Joined: 1/27/2002
From: NV
Status: offline

Panel lines are easy on Ultracote. I use the "Industrial Ink" sharpies (pack of 3 at Office Max) as they are very resistant to alcohol. The hardest part is deciding what to draw - a good 3-view helps. Have not done much lately on the p-51. Got the rudder and horizontal stab built. I mounted the elevator servos in the stab. I think it's going to look like this.

Attachments

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(in reply to Hello82)

Post #: 627

RE: Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 - 10/1/2006 12:20:46 PM

Hello82

Posts: 128
Joined: 8/20/2006
From: Boston, MA, USA
Status: offline

Hey

Maidened the P-51 yesterday. Flew beautifully and like everyone else, just some right and down trim was all she needed. Tracked very nicely and rolls straight.

Saito 180 and APC 17x8 with a 22 oz tank running 30% Nitro heli fuel.

Issues:

1) 22 oz tank running the motor rich for 3rd breakin run only gave me 5 minutes?????? Double checked the tank was full too etc...could this be??? Does she guzzle that much? Do I need to go to a much largr tank?

2) Stock retract broke second flight - plastic interior parts snapped right in half and fell out....on a good landing too! Robart 551 rs and 660 struts sitting on my work bench already half installed later that evening. They do stick out 1/8" and I had to cut the wheel well corner a hair. Question... the screws on the sides of the 551 and the one air nipple...I had to make a ton notches in the stock rails to make these clear....and they don't give you much room to secure tightly now? I'm trying to beef it up but it's tight!

3) the Hanger 9 3-1/4" wheels...are they wider than dubros of same size? The robart axle is not long enough to attach a collar???? It is flush with the end of the wheel?

4) Is everyone using the smallest size air tank that robart has? They told me medium was best, but I'll need to do some serious cutting...found the smallest size kicking around the lhs for 10 bucks so I grabbed it and it will be alot easier to fit, but will it support this size plane still?

5) What are you guys using for air pumps?

6) Like to post a pic but keep getting error sign when trying to load it (using a MAC)

thanks
Matt

(in reply to Build-n-flyer-RCU)

Post #: 628

RE: Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 - 10/1/2006 1:11:34 PM

Build-n-flyer-RCU

Posts: 1049
Joined: 9/26/2002
From: Evans, GA, USA
Status: offline

Congratulations on the maiden!

I don't know about the 180 (never owned one) but all the Saitos I've owned really guzzled the fuel until the low end was leaned out. You have to turn the idle screw in a bunch of turns from the factory setting. If you haven't done this yet, then no surprise. Once the engine is set right I'm sure you will get at least 10 minute flight times.

Also no surprise about the stock retract. Its hard to believe that H9 actually sold this plane with those pieces of junk. But it sounds like you were ready for this with the Robarts. Next watch out for the gear rails, they are also very weak. If you are having to cut then to get the Robarts in then that will only make them weaker. I bet if we did a poll we would find out that most people successfully flying the plane ripped the rails out and replaced them.

I get plenty of gear cycles with my Spring Air gear and a small tank. I bought a little 12V air compressor from the auto section at Walmart and fitted it up with a football needle inserted into a piece of air line with the filler fitting on the other end. The one I bought has an air gage and even a little dial that shuts the compressor off at a set pressure. I think I paid around $25 for it and it really works great.

Again, congratulations. Get the gear right and you will have a great flyer!

Walt

_____________________________

VQ P-61, H9 150 P-51, D-F Decathalon, NEA Twin Air, Duellist, Nobler, GP 60 Extra, Arrow racer, LT-40.. the hanger is full!!

(in reply to Hello82)

Post #: 629

RE: Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 - 10/1/2006 4:12:21 PM

drifter

Posts: 303
Joined: 9/26/2002
From: Baltimore, MD, USA
Status: offline

My buddy has a Saito 180 in his H9 Mustang. He flies a lot longer than 5 minutes. You might ask him about his setup. He's on RCU as "Oriole".

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hello82

Hey

Maidened the P-51 yesterday. Flew beautifully and like everyone else, just some right and down trim was all she needed. Tracked very nicely and rolls straight.

Saito 180 and APC 17x8 with a 22 oz tank running 30% Nitro heli fuel.

Issues:

1) 22 oz tank running the motor rich for 3rd breakin run only gave me 5 minutes?????? Double checked the tank was full too etc...could this be??? Does she guzzle that much? Do I need to go to a much largr tank?

(in reply to Hello82)

Post #: 630

RE: Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 - 10/2/2006 3:12:00 PM

Hello82

Posts: 128
Joined: 8/20/2006
From: Boston, MA, USA
Status: offline

Hey

I'll go check out Walmart and see if they still have those air compressors and I'll email Oriole about the tank issue too ..thanks!

I've been working diligently on the robart retracts...I decided not to rip it all apart, but did manage too put new thick ply rail rails in under the regular ones, plus braces around them...so I think I should be set!

Hey, I saw a pic here somewhere where the flyer used nylon bolts for the retracts ,yet larger than the regular metal screws. Any thoughts on this? I presume it saves the wing in a really hard landing or crash and they would just shear off maybe. Or do you think they would shear off to easily and cause problems more than not?

Still can't figure how to load pictures, gettinf error sign...but was able to load them to the main rcu gallery

Here she be... " Mary Jane" You can see a few other shots if you click on the bottom right cursor too

http://www.rcuniverse.com/gallery/galleryItem.cfm?itemID=67483&dummy=5162.91963642599&opener=/gallery/galleryCat.cfm%3Fgaltype%3D1%26clubgal%3D0%26subgaltype%3D85

Matt

(in reply to drifter)

Post #: 631

RE: Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 - 10/2/2006 4:32:17 PM

Tom in Cincy

Posts: 188
Joined: 5/18/2002
From: Cincinnati, OH, USA
Status: offline

quote:

1) 22 oz tank running the motor rich for 3rd breakin run only gave me 5 minutes?????? Double checked the tank was full too etc...could this be??? Does she guzzle that much? Do I need to go to a much largr tank?

I think if you would go to a 15% nitro 18% oil fuel you would get a little longer run.

I am running a 180 on the stock tank. My timer is set for 6min. That gives me plenty of reserve.

YMMV
Tp

(in reply to Hello82)

Post #: 632

RE: Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 - 10/2/2006 5:12:51 PM

Build-n-flyer-RCU

Posts: 1049
Joined: 9/26/2002
From: Evans, GA, USA
Status: offline

I have used nylon bolts for fixed gear airplanes where I am cocerned about breaking the gear mount. But the the gear breaking free can cause damage especially on low wing planes and the screws would have to be pretty small to fit retracts. Not sure that its a good idea for this application.

Nice nose art lettering!

Walt

_____________________________

VQ P-61, H9 150 P-51, D-F Decathalon, NEA Twin Air, Duellist, Nobler, GP 60 Extra, Arrow racer, LT-40.. the hanger is full!!

(in reply to Tom in Cincy)

Post #: 633

RE: Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 - 10/3/2006 4:13:27 AM

fossil

Posts: 380
Joined: 1/7/2002
From: Tullahoma, TN, USA
Status: offline

I have a saito 180 in mine with stock tank running 15% fuel/16x10 prop and depending on throttle position I get 10 to 15 min flight times. I usually fly around at half throttle or less and can do a lot of full throttle passes across the field and still get 10 to 15 min flights. I have never understood why lots of guys want or think they have to run 30% fuel to get good performance out of a saito engine, I have several and they all run great on 15%. This plane screams across the field at full throttle, I can't see needing it to go any faster than it does now. I also have the spring air retracts with the very small air tank and get 5 to 10 gear cycles at 100 psi.
Randy

_____________________________

"I'm Not Driving Fast I'm Just Flying Low"

(in reply to Build-n-flyer-RCU)

Post #: 634

RE: Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 - 10/3/2006 2:27:57 PM

Hello82

Posts: 128
Joined: 8/20/2006
From: Boston, MA, USA
Status: offline

Hey

Randy..Yeah the local lhs suggested the 30 % for break in and then toning down later...I'm still learning about what fuels to use...it's been 20 years out of the hobby and just getting back into it. Could I also go to a 32oz larger tank anyhow and still use muffler pressure or would I also need a fuel pump if I do that.

I had a local flyer help me on the maiden which I'm glad I did. We put low and high switches on the throws ...even though I had it at the minimum already, and added some exponential to keep the neutral positions less sensitive. That all really helped because she really doesn't need much! I don't recall having those options back in the 70 and 80's...but maybe I just never had some good gear back then?

Capt G...I found those industrial pens and they work way better than the regulars... thanks for that tip! Nice design photo you have for your Ziroli...it almost looks like a model too with that desert background.

Walt-- nose art ...yeah thanks for hipping me to printing it out on the computer and then tracing it back onto monokote and then cutting it out carefully...simpler than I expected.

Should have the retracts in by tonite! Any more tips on that? Robart 551RS with 660 striaght struts.

Matt

< Message edited by Hello82 -- 10/3/2006 2:50:41 PM >

(in reply to fossil)

Post #: 635

RE: Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 - 10/3/2006 11:56:10 PM

Build-n-flyer-RCU

Posts: 1049
Joined: 9/26/2002
From: Evans, GA, USA
Status: offline

I really think that if you crank down on the low end adjustment your fuel efficiency will improve a whole bunch and you will not need a bigger tank. The factory Saito idle setting is always extremely rich. Give it a try before doing anything drastic.

As mentioned earlier in the thread the elevator rates recommended in the manual are way too much unless maybe you intend to do snap rolls and 8' loops. I fly at half the recommended low rate and its plenty enough for a warbird.

Walt

_____________________________

VQ P-61, H9 150 P-51, D-F Decathalon, NEA Twin Air, Duellist, Nobler, GP 60 Extra, Arrow racer, LT-40.. the hanger is full!!

(in reply to Hello82)

Post #: 636

RE: Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 - 10/4/2006 3:05:37 AM

Hello82

Posts: 128
Joined: 8/20/2006
From: Boston, MA, USA
Status: offline

hey

ok I'll be trying some other fuel soon and leaning out the idle and high speed a bit more.

here's another question...how long should the air last in the robart system if you let it sit in one postition. I had it at 100psi tonight and it's working great...but I tried pumping it up and then just let it sit there, it seems to lose 75% of pressure after about 45 min to an hour...is this normal or do I have large leak issues?

I get about 7-11 regular cycles using the small air tank.

...almost have them in for the long weekend!

best,
Matt

< Message edited by Hello82 -- 10/5/2006 2:58:59 AM >

(in reply to Build-n-flyer-RCU)

Post #: 637

RE: Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 - 10/6/2006 3:56:39 AM

Hello82

Posts: 128
Joined: 8/20/2006
From: Boston, MA, USA
Status: offline

...and ....another question ..... my CG is now 1/4" behind the recommended because of the air tank I installed. I installed farther after of the trailing wing edge in the air scoop.

Will that still be ok? I did see someone say that he made his a bit behind recommended on purpose...but I'm not sure exactly how much.

It needs 3 oz in the very front to bring it back in place otherwise.

thoughts?

M

(in reply to Hello82)

Post #: 638

RE: Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 - 10/6/2006 4:42:06 AM

fossil

Posts: 380
Joined: 1/7/2002
From: Tullahoma, TN, USA
Status: offline

I haven't check too see how much, but mine does lose some pressure while it sits for an extended time. More in the retracted position than down and locked. I think it is the valve that comes with spring-air retracts if you don't have your servo adjusted just perfect it will continuously let air out of the valve. of course the spring-air retracts only go up with air pressure they go down because when the valve releases the pressure there is a spring that drives the retracts down. I believe robarts are air up and down. As far as the GC being 1/4 inch behind the r