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Countryboy -> Overview (7/23/2003 6:52:10 AM)
Pic showing overview of the 622 layed out on the wing.

Countryboy -> Overview #2 (7/23/2003 7:00:55 AM)
Pic showing the Centurion layed out. With the proper strut length, I think the Centurion in an 85 degree would be a good choice for retrofit. Also the Robart 531 would be a good choice. Don't take offense Kyle2Baseball, just pointing out what might have of been a mistake in your Robart # selection. If I'm wrong, the flame suit is on. :)

Kyle2Baseball -> Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 (7/23/2003 8:13:43 AM)
Hey Countryboy, Wouldn't you know it, I called Horizon Hobbies tech support and they told me the 622'S would be a direct replacement. Go figure Thanks for your feed back.

mulligan -> Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 (7/23/2003 8:15:07 PM)
Countryboy, It appears the Robart 531s rotate away from actuator; the 551s rotate towards the actuator, thus they seem to be a better choice if they can clear the gear bay. What's your opinion? Also, I'm looking at Robart straight struts 660s as opposed to 650s for length- you agree? Finally, does anyone know how those gear door mounting brackets (e.g., #660DB) attach to the door? Thanks, George

Countryboy -> Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 (7/23/2003 9:59:49 PM)
[QUOTE]Originally posted by mulligan Countryboy, It appears the Robart 531s rotate away from actuator; the 551s rotate towards the actuator, thus they seem to be a better choice if they can clear the gear bay. What's your opinion? George, You are correct.... the 551 series would be the better choice. After going back and reviewing Robarts site, I see that the 531 retraction angle is measured from the opposite end of the actuator. Nice catch!!! Also, I'm looking at Robart straight struts 660s as opposed to 650s for length- you agree? If you choose to go with the straight leg strut, the 660 would be the way to go. The 650's appear to be too light duty also. My personal preference on the strut would be to go with the offset yoke in that series. If you are going to go through the expense.... might as well get the look to go with it. Also, one might have to do some trimming of the wheel well to clear the scissor links. Finally, does anyone know how those gear door mounting brackets (e.g., #660DB) attach to the door? Can't answer this one for sure, as I have never used them. Have an idea as to how they attach, but without seeing them first hand, can't say for certain. Thanks, George [/QUOTE]

mulligan -> Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 (7/23/2003 10:30:08 PM)
Hmmmm, the offset yolk would look better when down, but since the retracts only retract 85 deg., I thought the wheel would not be fully in the bay, and the door would not close fully. If you look at the geometry of the 622 (even though it's not a possibility), it actually retracts 90 deg., (85 deg. from down position + 5 deg. extra). Strut is not flush with wing, giving extra room for an offset yolk and wheel to fit in bay. What to do, what to do? - George

NoGuts_NoGlory -> New Robart Gear for H9 Mustang 150 (7/23/2003 10:44:14 PM)
A very reliable source said that Robart is currently working on a set of retracts specifically for this plane. When will they be ready? - "soon". Howard

mulligan -> Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 (7/24/2003 12:49:31 AM)
Crap. That puts me in a quandry. Thanks for the news, though, Howard. I was also toying with the idea of getting the 550 90 deg. retracts with 662RL offset yolk struts and mounting at a 5 deg. tilt inside the wing. Gear down would be 85 deg. and the gear up would be 5 deg. into the wing, which would keep everything inside the wing. That would require some gear bay mods, but really anything you do would require some mod. - George

Countryboy -> Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 (7/24/2003 5:10:59 AM)
[QUOTE]Originally posted by mulligan Hmmmm, the offset yolk would look better when down, but since the retracts only retract 85 deg., I thought the wheel would not be fully in the bay, and the door would not close fully. George, If the wing had no dihedral, life would be simpler. Such is not the case though. If you go back & look at the 551 diagram, you will see that in the fully retracted position, that the strut remains at 90 deg. to the actuator/ pivot point. From this point, the strut will only swing through an 85 deg. arch. The relative angle between the retract mounting rails & the wheel bay does not change. Now picture the retract mounted in the wing.... in this case the 551 diagram as shown on Robart's site. Now visualize that retract mounted in the left wing panel "Viewed from Trailing Edge" with the wing panel blocked up to have the correct dihedral, and tell me what you see. The way I view it, that will put the wheel at, or close, to 90 deg. to earth when in the extended position, and should not affect the retraction angle. The retract, even though the wing has dihedral, will still be at 90 deg. to the wing. Does your head hurt.... mine sure does. :D If you look at the geometry of the 622 (even though it's not a possibility), it actually retracts 90 deg., (85 deg. from down position + 5 deg. extra). Strut is not flush with wing, giving extra room for an offset yolk and wheel to fit in bay. The 622-5 retract for the T/F 1/5 Mustang has problems in it's own right. That extra 5 deg. causes problems in mounting geometry also. I haven't seen one of these yet, that when sitting on the ground.... did not look like a new born Colt trying to stand for the first time. What to do, what to do? You tell me!!! :confused: - George [/QUOTE]

rc34074 -> Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 (7/24/2003 6:28:19 AM)
why not look at the spring air 400 series retracts? they would fit much easier than the robart 622s and they are strong gear-at least as strong as the robart 622 retracts. [url]www.retracts.com[/url] ed

mulligan -> Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 (7/24/2003 6:41:30 AM)
This is what I was thinking about... - George

Stagwing -> P51 Gas (7/31/2003 7:19:26 PM)
I'm putting a G23 in mine. I have wanted to move up to gas for a while and I happen to have a new G23 just sittin there begging to be used. I'll let you know how it works out. I have access to some pretty good modelers around here so brain storming the installation should not be that much of a problem. If anyone else out there has already used a G23 or G26 send pictures of your setup. Dan

yard-dart -> price??? (8/1/2003 11:13:28 PM)
I'm kinda like P-51B, this plane seems to be a little pricey. I've put some numbers together on what it would take to complete this plane: $500.00 Plane $400.00 Engine $250.00 Servos $50.00 Spinner $1200.00 Minimum Now I don't mean to sound like a tight-ass, but this seems a little much. I know that all of these items are mandatory, but $500.00 for a plane that's not even considered a big bird is a little overkill. I've got the 1/4 scale Pacific Aeromodels Laser, which is a big bird with a gasser, and I only have around $900.00 in it. I am aware that there is no comparison between it and the mustang, but still, a plane is a plane. The quality of my laser is great, so quality is no longer an issue. All planes "should" be of good quality anyway. I am no tightwad when it comes to planes, my wife will tell you that, but I just think this 'stang is a little to harsh on the pocketbook. I think $399.00 is about the "max" that should be charged for this bird. I think I'll wait for the price to come down a little before I purchase it, and I'm quite sure it will come down. John

P-51B -> Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 (8/2/2003 12:43:22 AM)
Yard-Dart, I was able to get one at my LHS for $370.00. I also called Doug's hobby shop in Waldorf, MD., they had them for either $390 or $370 (I can't remember which). You can find their advert in RCM. I already have a saito 180 (...unless I decide to go gas) and radio gear. I will have to get a spinner for it though.

airspeed917 -> Retracts (8/2/2003 2:53:12 AM)
I have been talking with Robart,, They got themselves the wing for this plane and figured out the best pair of retracts for it. Here is what I was Told. This is the actual reply. Ron: The powers that be have decided the Robart 551RS 85 deg Retract mechanisms will work, but this means converting to a pneumatic system rather than mechanical. They also suggest the 660 Robostruts with a 3-1/4 wheel. There will not be any major modifications to the wing with these suggestions. Hope this helps. Sincerely Gary Ernst Robart Mfg.

Stagwing -> Gasser (8/2/2003 9:01:22 AM)
P-51B I can't seem to find anyone else using the G-23. I called a rep at Horizon today and he said the designer stipulated that gassers were not recommended for some nonspecific reason. I don't get it, the only difference between gassers and glow (if you discount the aggrivation with glow) is the fuel used. The G-23 is within the weight range of this plane. It fits the cowl area without having to butcher the wood or the fiberglass. I guess I will be on my own on this venture. Dan Gravity always will win...

P-51B -> Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 (8/2/2003 9:04:43 AM)
Interesting. It will be interesting to see how yours comes out with it. I am leaning towards gas, since I want to put my Saito 1.80 in my H9 73" cap (it used to be in one...before...well you know)

thehoker -> P51 (8/2/2003 12:36:43 PM)
I am presently building a WM GS P51,and just recently got my first look/touch on the H9 1.50 P 51,a few observations- That color scheme just does nothing since the 60 is already in it,but the WM schemes are week also,but easier to change being almost all silver.The supplied hardware is a joke for both kits. The fuse and fiberglass color matching and fit look allot better on the worlds,but the H9 looks much more scale-wing fillets,and a curved underside where fuse blends into leading edge of the wing.The underbelly radiator looks much better on the H9 also. The fully sheeted wing on the 9 is better than the open bay WM wing,gear? both look to be wobbly goblins. Replace the stockers with spring airs,404's lighter and more positive than robarts(only one air line per unit as they are spring assist on the downward cycle-cant beat that-lose air ,gear drop and lock),and being physically smaller,an easier fit. Get the 404s and a set of 1/2 robart offset oleo's the complete set can be had from sheldons hobbies for just over 200.00. 85 degrees is the correct one for these as the 85 degrees is what they swing down to compensate for the dihedral in the wing,its not a reference to the retracted position, if you go with 90's you have to angle the mounts. The biggest thing I found wrong with the h9 kit was the size,why 77"? I have seen modified Wm P51's that you could mistake for a topflight P51, but the H9 is so much smaller that wont happen( people might mistake it for a 1/6 scale pica-wich is smaller yet-yikes). Why didn't they go with a 84-89" plane?Its not even giant scale,yet it has a giant scale price? Anyways I found the H9 to be much easier to bash to get closer to scale,(I'm doing this to my WM- wing fillets,scale main and tail retracts, the 6- 50 cals,ect,ect....) quality appears to be a wash, but for the added 2-3 pounds I'd rather have a 5" larger wing.Don't get me wrong,it definitely is a nice kit,just seems the bang for the buck isn't as good as I was hoping,but hey when is it? Oh yea,for those of you thinking gas,that mvvs 1.6 should be plenty for this warbird,you don't need 3d out of it do you? Anything with over 12# thrust should fly it nicely. Check out rcs and the 1.4,and 1.8 gassers, light weight and powerful. Just my opinion

mulligan -> Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 (8/2/2003 6:56:14 PM)
For those who are considering upgraded retracts... 85 deg. is stock, but you will have to use non-scale non-offset struts. For a little added effort, you can cut a slot into the wheel well and use scale offset struts. After doing some measurements and drafting (see post #111), the best way to do this seems to be with 90 deg. retracts rotated 5 deg. into the wing. For me, it's worth the added work for the scale struts. I've got the parts on order (Robart #530RS & #662R/L), and I'll take some pics in a week or so to help some of you decide. - George

Countryboy -> Interesting "Very Interesting" (8/2/2003 8:48:35 PM)
Mulligan, I understand your philosophy in what you are trying to accomplish, but what do you propose to do with the retract mounting rails. Are you planning to modify these in any way? How are you going to cock the retract, without the outboard part of the retract frame extending past the lower surface of the wing....without modifying the rails? Notice in the attached pic,,, if you were to lower the wheel deeper in the wheel well, the outer edge of the retract frame is going to raise proportionally. The five degree tilt angle you propose, will extend the outboard edge of the retract frame about .175 below the skin. How do you plan to compensate for this? When you say that a offset yolk can not be used without cutting a slot in the wheel liner, are you referring to the bottom of the liner, or where the side wall and the strut cutout meet?

airspeed917 -> Zenoah installation (8/2/2003 10:58:33 PM)
I'm putting the G-26 in mine thats modified by BH Hanson its supossed to put out 3hp,,,, The magneto and flywheel are removed and it has an electronic ignition installed, cost $380 its lighter too....

Capt G -> Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 (8/2/2003 11:22:53 PM)
Hey Countryboy - What gear is thet in the picture? (did you decide on the GSP yet?). G.

airspeed917 -> Hor Stab (8/3/2003 12:16:04 AM)
Can someone who already owns this plane tell me if the Hor Stab is fully sheeted or just built up,,,,, I have a friend who has the 60 size and the Hor Stab broke off in flight two inches in from the fuse, on both sides,,,,, its got me worried about the H9 1:50

thehoker -> P 51 (8/3/2003 12:18:04 AM)
I must admitt I dont know about gear on this H9 plane,I know the WM Gs P51 is a little bigger,and easily accepts offset strut retract mods.The 85 degree is what is called for, yes you will sacrafice the stock wheelwells .Go to Evos hanger he shows you the entire process of installing the spring airs(A better set up than robarts), with robart offset struts, making new wheel wells and the making and fitting of very good fitting doors. The spring airs defenitly seem the way to go with the H9, there physically smaller,they hold the same weight,are less expensive,(139.99 at sheldons hobbies),and you have the added bonus of lighter weight(only one air line per leg), and they have the fail safe option of when air pressure drops ,so do the gear.Thats why all the jet guys swear by spring airs. As far as a G23, or 26, why would you want to go that route? A mvvs 1.6, a rcs 1.4 or 1.8 all weigh less and make more power.If its because you have one sitting around,why risk turning your nice new stang into a slow leadslead just to find it a home(not to mention that side intake with that warboro would mean hacking the cowl full of holes,no?).A 120- 150 two stroke glow would be a better fit than a zenoha, just dont mind the mess(and cost of fuel).

Countryboy -> Hangar 9 150 Size P-51 (8/3/2003 1:28:15 AM)
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Capt G Hey Countryboy - What gear is thet in the picture? (did you decide on the GSP yet?). G. [/QUOTE] Capt G., The retract shown in the pic is the CJM Centurion style gear. I decided against the swap for the GSP-P-51. The guy was straight up, and admitted the fact that the wings & tail-feathers could stand to be recovered. I just didn't want to get into doing that at the present time.

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