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best material for hull - 4/26/2009 10:19 PM   
esselte


 

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Status: offline 		most of the sailboats have fiberglass hulls right? are there any other materials that can be used for the hull or fiberglass is the best one suited for it?

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RE: best material for hull - 4/27/2009 5:27 AM   
larrykin



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quote:

ORIGINAL: esselte

most of the sailboats have fiberglass hulls right? are there any other materials that can be used for the hull or fiberglass is the best one suited for it?


esselte,

odd question. Most kit boats have plastic hulls (ABS or similar). A top of the line IOM boat has a carbon fibre hull and deck.

A basic scratch build boat for fun will be balsa planks with fibreglass outside and inside as a composite. The fibreglass gives strength and the epoxy resin makes it waterproof. You can build a boat without using fibreglass. Just ask the Vikings.

For a full fibreglass boat you just need a male mold and then lay fibreglass over the mold for an exact copy of the hull. It's so easy to work with why bother with other materials? Try using cedar planks with pitch and tar mixed with straw for waterproofing. Circa 1700's.

There are threads on the web somewhere where they mention using silk and some types of cotton instead of fibreglass impregnated with something to make the material waterproof. In Australia the Aboriginals made canoes from paperbark. In South America and Egypt they use papyrus reeds. In the Pacific Islands they used dugout canoes. Most real boats are made from aluminium or steel. So no, most sailboats don't have fibreglass hulls.

Larry L.


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RE: best material for hull - 4/29/2009 12:09 AM   
zacsparrow


 

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Status: offline 		the best material is.....






anything that will float and will keep the water out! haha.pretty simple huh?


for others, it's just as simple as spraying a newspaper with varnish.. letting it dry... and voila... instant hull ^_^

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RE: best material for hull - 11/13/2009 2:16 AM   
cbinfl


 

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Status: offline 		Some folks use  wood ? .   Go figure ......     Check out ,      www.pondyachts.net

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RE: best material for hull - 11/19/2009 7:13 PM   
DMYC 42


 

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Status: offline 		I manufacture 9 different classes of R/C boats. Most are controlled by class rules. Those that only allow fiberglass are doing so to keep cost lower. The IOM does this, My IOM is built from S-Glass. If I had my choice I always pick carbon. It my be more money (not as much as people think) but, I use less layers to get the stiffness I need. Some boats like the Footy I makle from S-Glass because the carbon is too heavy. So there is no real answer to your question other then the material depends on the boat you are building.

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RE: best material for hull - 11/20/2009 2:51 PM   
GLX


 

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Status: offline 		Hi

Just a quick clarification on Larrykin post re IOM - The class rules don't allow any other composite as fibre glass so exotic fibres such as carbon, kevlar or other hybrid fibres are not allowed. This is to keep the cost down.


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RE: best material for hull - 11/20/2009 10:51 PM   
larrykin



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Status: offline 		Hi GLX & DMYC 42,

I tried to edit my post re IOM and using Carbon Fibre. Can't see how to do an edit. Yes, I was totally wrong and IOMs are only made from fibreglass. No exotics.
By coincidence I am building an IOM right now and have had to read the class rules.... need a combination law degree and ship builders licence.

QUESTION - What is the rule on the Mast Post Tube? Basically I have a mast box / keel box combo with cutout in deck for mast. Into the cutout I have a removeable Mast Tube which slides into the mast box. Is this as per rules? And why does the tube have to be removeable? Or have I read the rules wrong. Is it only if the Mast Tube is made from Carbon Fibre that it has to be removeable? My Main Sheet Tube is carbon fibre and is fixed vertical to the hull floor. Is this OK as it is not structural and just guides the sheet for the Main Boom?

Larry L.

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RE: best material for hull - 11/21/2009 12:13 AM   
GLX


 

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Status: offline 		no worries Larrykin.

Re your mast tube I never heard nor seen such a setup. You typically have 2 setups : one where the mast sit on the deck (not your case) and one where the mast slide down a mast hole. In the later case you don't need a removable mast tube, the actual mast of your rig goes down the mast hole and that's it.

I'm afraid that even the main sheet post can't be carbon. You are correct in that it doesn't add to structural stiffness but carbon is only allowed in the build of the rudder and fin keel and nowhere else.  

Hope this helps - out of curiosity what design are you building ? 

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RE: best material for hull - 11/21/2009 2:19 PM   
mfr02


 

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quote:

IOMs are only made from fibreglass

I do believe that wood is permitted.

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RE: best material for hull - 11/22/2009 12:37 AM   
GLX


 

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Status: offline 		Yes you're correct wood is allowed. it's just exotic composite such as carbon, kevlar, and other hybrid composite that are not allowed. Wood and and fibreglass are allowed... 

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RE: best material for hull - 11/22/2009 1:03 AM   
larrykin



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Status: offline 		GLX,

about Carbon Fibre. If the Main Sheet Post is removeable it can be made from CF. The Mast Tube is as per Anders Wallin design. An IOM boat builder in the Netherlands ( I think ).
I am building his Noux2 from free plans on his website. The Mast Tube is fibreglass and is enclosed accept for top opening. Measures 11mm at base sloping to 20mm at top and goes from base of hull to above deck level. It's 12mm wide. Shape allows for mast rake. This stops water in mast box from wetting mast heel. It's a bit of overkill. But looks good and I have seen them used on other IOMs.
Today I am painting the boat and last night finished my #1 rig sails. When painting finished in another 2 days will be ready to rig mast and start tuning. I made a mold for this hull and deck and will start on my next boat shortly. Will probably sell this boat to pay for the next one. FYI this makes my ninth scratch build of a 1m RC boat.
Below are pics of my last USOM build.



Larry L.




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< Message edited by Justaddwata -- 11/23/2009 5:02 AM >

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RE: best material for hull - 11/22/2009 8:40 PM   
GLX


 

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Status: offline 		Hi Larry, your boat looks good alright.

Yes I know (not personally) Anders - he has a fantastic website. And his Noux 2 is a proven IOM boat design.  I know some water can get lodged in the mast well but the added weight is so negligible - My old TS2 was a good 40gr overweight (before I put it on a diet to bring it to min weight) which is a lot more then the weight of the water in the mast well and I still did very well. In IOM racing there is a lot more to loose in bad tuning, handling, tactics then a little water around the mast.  My previous boat a Vapour built by Carl Weatherill in NZL which had a mast well too and it never stopped me from being competitive with it.

I think I got mixed up when you were talking about the mast tube cos I though there was another tube sitting in the mast well where the mast slides into.... Typically the mast well is moulded together with the finbox so it's easier to get the right alignment between fin keel and mast in the centre of the boat.. I never build an IOM but I wish you the very best in your build.  


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RE: best material for hull - 11/23/2009 10:56 AM   
larrykin



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Status: offline 		Thanks GLX,

I do have a Mast Tube sitting inside the Mast Box! I made the tube and am not sure why . Followed plans and Anders Wallin's site info. I do know that it supports the mast and mast heel much better than just the mast box which is 18mm wide. Mast tube is removeable. Maybe to check to ensure it's not made of CF .
Next build I'll do things totally differently and follow Anders's newest build details with a fibreglass keel fin mold and seperate mast box. See pic below. And I'll cut a mast box hole in my deck mold.
This has been my first IOM build. I could finish a USOM in a fortnight. This thing has taken me about eight weeks to finish. Today I checked my sails and rigging and am pleased that the sails look magic when all the sheets are tensioned right. Can't wait to test sail then sell this build so I can start on #2 Noux. Now I know what I'm doing with an IOM build and can skip all the mistakes I made when learning on this one.

Larry L.


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RE: best material for hull - 11/25/2009 9:37 PM   
GLX


 

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Status: offline 		Hi Larry,

First of all I'd like to congratulate you on your build as it looks very clean and well built. Re the mast well with a removable part, that is news to me. Normally the mast well is attached to the finbox, the part epoxied to the hull and deck and that's it. ie the mast just goes in the mast well.

you learn everyday ;-)

Personally I like Craig Smith mast setup : he has a "plastic" mast shoe that is simply glued with doublesided tape on the deck and the fin tread comes through the deck, through the mast shoe and the bolt is tight tightening the whole mast shoe system. really loved it with my TS2. though I have to say the only thing I like with mast well setup is that it is more practical when rigging the boat as the mast is more stable. But it should make the hole construction of the boat a lot easier. 

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RE: best material for hull - 11/29/2009 8:01 AM   
larrykin



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Finished my Noux IOM.




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RE: best material for hull - 11/29/2009 5:05 PM   
GLX


 

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Status: offline 		nice one larry - well done.

 

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RE: best material for hull - 11/30/2009 1:58 AM   
DONS BOAT WORKS



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Status: offline 		Ditto.

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RE: best material for hull - 11/30/2009 10:14 AM   
larrykin



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ORIGINAL: DONS BOAT WORKS

Ditto.


Gee guys, thanks for all your praise. Talk about 'short and sweet' ..... ditto
That was meant to be tongue-in-cheek. I do appreciate the comments.

SOAPBOX TIME Just for any 'lurkers' out there reading these posts who think scratch builds are for the expert wood-workers and craftsmen. Two years ago I had never touched anything that had radio controls, and, had never built any models in my life . In fact I had never even considered model-making as a serious interest.
I do own a real boat and love yachting on rich friends boats. Now after reading this forum and a few others plus buying a couple of books I've become a competent scratch builder. My last few builds the boats with my sails have performed like magic. One of my YouTube videos of one of my RC yachts sailing has had over 5000 hits . I've managed to combine my interests in photography with painting and have learnt some skills in woodwork and even electronics. I just rewired a boat tonite and installed a new receiver for my new 2.4GHz system. Two years ago this would be all gibberish to me. And I still don't know which is a Tx or a Rx or whatever you call them.
So, if you are like me back then, my advice is have a go! Plans are free as is all the expert advice from guys like Don and GLX. Tools needed are relatively cheap to begin as are materials. And this is one hobby that you can do while watching TV. Well at least I do. The garage is too cold at night. I am yet to try racing and find building very rewarding. From a rough plan and some basic raw materials you can build something that becomes a thing of beauty as it glides through the water. Powered by the invisible wind and responding to tiny twitches on a toggle.
OK guys. Any of you inspired now?

Larry L.




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RE: best material for hull - 11/30/2009 1:24 PM   
mfr02


 

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Status: offline 		A great philosophy, Larry. Very well done. It just goes to show that this hobby need not be a contest to see who can buy in the most parts, nor does it require a lifetime's dedicated learning. I did something similar about twenty odd years ago, and the boat is still working and giving pleasure. She's old enough to vote now.

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