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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/1/2009 11:32 AM   
martno1fan



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Status: offline 		Just  a heads up on the mounts for the rcmk motors,you cant use standard zenoah ones as they are too thin and the starter catches the flywheel when you try to pull it and theres been a few bad things happen,seen a  few guys destroy them by not spotting this issue ,you need to fit spacers between the starter and the mounts to allow it to run free if you want to use zenoah mounts or you need to use the rcmk mounts which are thicker,just a  heads up.Also the head bolts on the motor tend to be too short and can back out so you might like to swap those for the standard zenoah ones which are longer and wont back out etc.
Mart

< Message edited by martno1fan -- 6/1/2009 11:33 AM >


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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/1/2009 11:40 AM   
Dreamin Hemi



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Status: offline 		Thanks Dion, won't be long.

Dreamwakes, I completely agree with you about the use of styrene wax.  It does make things a little easier, except for having to remove the wax on the surface before you follow through with the repair.  Since you already know how these products work, I'll speak for the other thread followers.....

I choose this method using the plastic sheets for two reasons for this repair......First of all, it keeps out air (just like the wax additive). Secondly it flattens out the area requiring only light feathering and since one of the repair locations is on a corner, the stiff plastic enabled me to repair two sides at the same time since the gelcoat was held in place with the walls of plastic. 

Just worth mentioning I typically use the wax additive if I were to spray a large area with gelcoat alone.  There are always more than one way to do something.  Perhaps if ever needed, I'll use the styrene wax method  in the future for some variety.

quote:

By the way...its good to see someone take a stand against copying others good work..
Gary

Thanks. I hate seeing UNETHICAL and outright plain copying of designs. People don't realize the work that goes into these boats before you buy them. I know I have no less than 60 hours so far in prep work and I'm still not close to finished! Now just imagine the time involved when this idea comes from scratch and a plug needs to be designed, built, tested, rebuilt, retested, remolded....etc. I'm using an already tested and proven design so 90% of the work has been eliminated, yet I still have so much left to do.
May seem hypocritical in this thread, but anybody that has been following along the past few weeks knows the correct channels have been established so to speak. Months of preparation and working with this hulls original designer, NVS Motorsports early on in this project ensured that this would be well documented and I have been given full production rights for these hulls here in the US. Again I will mention that we have an agreement of terms and one of them is a portion of all income generated with this goes back to NVS as a royalty fee. There is nothing sneaky going on, and I have nothing to hide....which is one of the reasons I choose to do this thread. I just wanted to open myself up to all the viewers and let them know how this entire deal panned out from the beginning.

< Message edited by Dreamin Hemi -- 6/1/2009 1:10 PM >

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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/1/2009 3:31 PM   
Dreamin Hemi



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Status: offline 		Break time after 2 more applications of 1.5oz mat. 2 maybe 3 more layers this afternoon once things cool down.

So far....

1 layer .75 oz mat
2 layers 1.5 oz mat

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< Message edited by Dreamin Hemi -- 6/1/2009 3:41 PM >

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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/1/2009 7:47 PM   
Dreamin Hemi



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Status: offline 		On a roll......two and a half more layers (glassed over a few of the same areas twice....guess the fumes are getting to me ). Figured a close up was due. Each layer always get's easier since the bends are getting more and more gradual. I did the last layer of mat in one piece.

Layers:

1 layer .75 oz mat
4(.5) layers 1.5 oz mat
1 extra layer 1.5 oz mat around the flange area only for added rigidity.

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< Message edited by Dreamin Hemi -- 6/1/2009 7:57 PM >

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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/1/2009 8:28 PM   
Dreamin Hemi



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Status: offline 		Just "green trimmed" all the flash, or left over fiberglass from the flange. If I don't do it now, I'll have to use a cut-off wheel as this stuff get's super hard within an hour or so. Just skimmed over the edge with a razor knife. Doing this now makes for less material to remove with my belt sander after the last layers are finished curing.

....again almost forgot to add in the pictures.....

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< Message edited by Dreamin Hemi -- 6/1/2009 8:32 PM >

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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/2/2009 2:15 AM   
Dreamin Hemi



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Status: offline 		MOLDING PROCESS COMPLETE!!!

Final layer of heavy mat just applied and this baby is DONE.....  Just need to trim the edges and belt sand them tomorrow.

I promise these will be the last shots of just this process.  Hard to see the differences picture to picture as layers of glass get added, but did the best I could. 

You will notice I placed 2" wide strips of 8 oz glass CLOTH around the perimeter of the mold.  This will actually serve a few purposes....

1.  Adds rigidity to the flanges
2.  Keeps the splinters out of me from the needles of hardened mat little hairs (already had 2 good ones the last couple days)
3.  Thickens the area where the mold bolt holes will be drilled
4.  It looks good?!?!
5.  Because I have 200 yards of this stuff and I'm.....as quoted before...."A LAMINATING ANIMAL!!!" LOL.....ok, resin fumes have officially melted by brain.

Total laminate:
1 layer .75 oz mat
6 layers 1.5 oz mat
1 layer 1.5 oz mat around flange
1 strip 2" 8 oz cloth tape around flange

Total materials for all parts:
4.5 gallons laminating resin
9 yards 54" wide mat
4 3/8 nap rollers
8 disposable 1" brushes
3 disposable epoxy brush
2 quarts Cabosil......probably closer to 1, as I spilled the can over.  I also mixed way too much for each part and had some waste.
Chopped strand glass to mix with the cabosil



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< Message edited by Dreamin Hemi -- 6/2/2009 4:10 AM >

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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/2/2009 5:14 AM   
Paul M


 

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Status: online 		Looks like your gettin close to pullin some hulls, Scott. Looks great.

I understand the purpose of the clay on the 1st half of the mold, but I would have thought on the second that there would be no voids to deal with and therefore no need for the clay. Can you explain?

Thanks,

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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/2/2009 6:35 AM   
Dreamin Hemi



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quote:

ORIGINAL: Paul M

Looks like your gettin close to pullin some hulls, Scott. Looks great.

I understand the purpose of the clay on the 1st half of the mold, but I would have thought on the second that there would be no voids to deal with and therefore no need for the clay. Can you explain?

Thanks,

Your absolutely right Paul, in a perfect world I woulden't need it for this half, however when I pulled the 1'st half from the flange frame, some of the clay was removed as well.  Had to simply square off the corners with just a small amount of clay, no big deal. 

Won't be to long now before parts are pulled.  Just need to prep the mold surface assuming everything I've done so far comes out well after the plug is removed....probably Wednesday.



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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/2/2009 8:41 AM   
Morspeed


 

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Status: offline 		NVS, Scott,, all good answers , can't argue with with your reasoning..are you gonna put one in the water Scott??   

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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/2/2009 12:00 PM   
Dreamin Hemi



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Status: offline 		It would be WRONG for me not to!  Once I find a desirable layup for strength/weight I'll definately have to make one for myself.  Did that with the other deep V I offer (D'CS) and was able to get a few video's in.  Plans are for me to attend the Toledo show this year and it would sure help to have at least one of each already together with the bare hulls I'm bringing....will get into that later. 

This mold will sit one more day and will remove the plug.  Today hope to trim/sand the edges and drill holes for the bolt locations.  Will also spend some time wetsanding/polishing and prepping the hatch mold, already mostly polished out.




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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/2/2009 2:51 PM   
Dreamin Hemi



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Status: offline 		This was a quick task.  Edges sanded with my handheld belt sander and finished off with a DA sander.  Found the desired hole locations and drilled 1/4" holes to accept the bolts used to clamp this thing together.  Using  1/4" bolts with hardened steel fender washers to distribute the clamping pressure as wide as possible.  Would have liked to have the bolt locations closer to the hull, but with the wooden stands I had to space it off a little.  Should be enough bolts, but I'll see once the 1'st parts are made if I need more....may add more anyway just because I can! 

Now off to more wetsanding and polishing.


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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/2/2009 5:20 PM   
Dreamin Hemi



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Status: offline 		Using a pnumatic cut-off wheel and Dremel tool with a titanium cutter head I trimmed off the flash of glass around the hatch area.  Then used my palm sander to finish the job.

Will use a series of posts to show what happened as I was doing this.


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< Message edited by Dreamin Hemi -- 6/3/2009 12:44 PM >

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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/2/2009 5:32 PM   
Dreamin Hemi



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Status: offline 		Definately not intended, but while sanding and cutting the hatch area, the seal broke away (as it should) from the plug and the mold began to split apart on me.  Could have done a few things, but must of this glass was laid 3 days ago so I'm not at all worried.  Was going to remove the plug tomorrow morning anyway.  But..........

IT'S OUT!!!.................... AND LOOKING GOOD!!!


I tried to just pull it apart and only moved a little.  Used the soft plastic wedges and ran around the flange and the two halves literally came apart on their own!  One side just needed a little more convincing.

What you see here are shots as I was initially removing the mold halfs.  No cleanup, just straight first time seeing the results, so I thought you would want to see the same.




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< Message edited by Dreamin Hemi -- 6/2/2009 5:41 PM >

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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/2/2009 5:44 PM   
Dreamin Hemi



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Status: offline 		The top mold has been on the plug for over a week so might as well take it out also since it's already opened up.  Just took 2 wedges tapped down to have it literally fall out of the mold.  Good wax and PVA make this job easy.


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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/2/2009 5:56 PM   
Dreamin Hemi



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Status: offline 		A few close up's of the detail.  The plug came out very easily and there were no damaged areas.  The mold surface is excellent, but I still want to wetsand with 1500 grit and polish to a mirror.  The last picture shows all the parts and pieces used to create this.

Since this won't be worked on for another day or so, I placed the plug back inside and bolted everything together.   Another day or so in the oven won't hurt and clamping it all tight stops any potential for warping.  Also added 8 more bolts to the flange......gives it great even clamping pressure all the way around.


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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/2/2009 7:42 PM   
Hesco Racing


 

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Status: offline 		Man how big must the smile be on your face now. Looks great. I can just see the products out of that mould is gouing to look as good if not better than your D'CS.

Great work. I jope you are going to continue this thread as you amke your first product.

How long will you let the moulds rest before you start making the first one.

Cobus


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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/2/2009 8:00 PM   
Dreamin Hemi



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Status: offline 		Yeah, the smile is pretty big.  Cracking that thing open I had lots of anticipation, heart rate elevatred.....etc.  HUGE relief seeing that the surface was as smooth as the plug was, I can finally take a breath now.  This mold is definately better than the DCS as far as finished surface.  I didn't spend an incredable amount of time on that mold since I always paint them due to the seamless design and the work that it takes getting it seamless.  I'm still making them inbetween layers of glass on this mold lately.  This should be a much easier build when compared to the effort it takes me to build a DCS. 

The title of this thread is "Duplicating an existing hull", no way am I going to stop just here.  We're only half way through!  At this point I could actually begin building the actual hulls after multiple coats of release wax.  I'll spend the next few days wetsanding and polishing every nook and cranny in these molds before production begins.  I want the finished product to have a mirror shine or as close to it when it comes out of the molds.  There will be no painting required, ready to sticker up of you want.  I'm thinking in a week or so +/- I'll throw some gelcoat in there and begin laying up the 1'st hull.  From that point if I'm happy I hope to keep the molds wet!  Thanks for the compliments, makes all the effort worth while.


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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/2/2009 8:24 PM   
twindaddy66



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Status: offline 		Way to go Scott!

T-Daddy

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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/3/2009 10:29 AM   
nvs motorsports


 

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Awesome finally production is so close now
Love the pics i got a bit of a portfolio going here hahaha my pics your pics probably the most photographed mold in history

Congrats anyway Scott im so glad it is you that has done this project (coping the hull ethically) you have trully done the design justice

PS the next plug will be flawless



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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/3/2009 11:21 PM   
nothinbetr2do


 

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Status: offline 		wow scott, your really move'in.  again i haven't check this thread in a few days,  i can't believe how much you've got done. that's great.  also, i got the motor mounts in and was able to finish putting the motor together. i'll post some pics of it done if you want?  looks like it won't be long now, before i'm going to be coming over. keep up the great work, tony

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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/3/2009 11:56 PM   
Dreamin Hemi



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Status: offline 		Thanks guys.  Will start to polish this evening and perhaps begin waxing in preparation for building some parts from these molds.  My DJ gig canceled on me tonight so I have some free time.   Production will begin shortly, the only thing that will interfere is my father......he may only have a few days left.  Please keep my family in your thoughts and prayers. 


< Message edited by Dreamin Hemi -- 6/4/2009 2:00 AM >

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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/4/2009 1:40 AM   
slotcsx


 

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Status: offline 		Nice job, can't wait to see finished hull #1..............Hang in there with your Dad, it is tough, lost my wife to cancer 6/9/08, it does get easier, but life goes on, hang tough for your Mom............prayers are with you and your family.............Bill

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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/4/2009 1:41 AM   
jtdesign


 

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Status: online 		scott first off family is the most important thing & we will be thiking of you and yours.
second excelent job, i thought i was the only perrson that filled all of my free time with boats. with all the building you do , do you ever get time to run your boats?


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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/4/2009 1:54 AM   
twindaddy66



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Status: offline 		Scott,

Best wishes to you and your family. I hope everything gets better. Hang in there buddy, we're all thinking about you and yours.

    John
(T-Daddy)

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RE: Duplicating an existing hull...ETHICALLY! - 6/4/2009 2:33 AM   
Dreamin Hemi



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quote:

ORIGINAL: slotcsx

Nice job, can't wait to see finished hull #1..............Hang in there with your Dad, it is tough, lost my wife to cancer 6/9/08, it does get easier, but life goes on, hang tough for your Mom............prayers are with you and your family.............Bill

Sorry to hear that Bill, that's about the same time I lost my younger brother last year.  Basically side effects of colon cancer is what is making my dad lose his battle.  With this cancer, we expected this result long ago, my brother was a semi-truck to the face kind of shock.
quote:

With all the building you do , do you ever get time to run your boats?

Not really, hopefully  this summer once things wind down a little I'll get time to test this cat a bit myself.

Thanks to all you guys, I appreciate the support.  Going to be a rough couple weeks to come for my family, thankfully we have lots of support. 







< Message edited by Dreamin Hemi -- 6/4/2009 2:36 AM >

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