pseudonym

Hey all. I was wondering if anyone out there could help me. I just bought a Futaba 10CHP and am having some issues trying to get the Throttle cut to.. well.. do ANYTHING. Right now I can assign switches, positions and rates til I am blue in the face without anything actually happening on the heli. I can move the collective and the throttle works perfectly, but RATE in throtle cut doesn't seem to do a damn thing no matter what switch or position I try.

Also, does anyone have any actual documentation for this device? I must say that this is honestly the worst document package I have ever encountered (And I work in I.T.!!!). It is full of errors which are completely inexplicable. For example on pg 41 where it is trying, baddly, to instruct you on how to set the throttle hold, it tells you to go to MIX, then to change it too... well I have no idea because there is nothing after that. Just a big blank spot and no explination what MIX:INH does! In fact I fail to find a single explination of what ANY of these settings are. Does such a thing exist? I honestly would never have bought this if I had known the documentation was so very very poor.

Any help, or a set of documentation (REAL documentation) would be very very much appreciated.

Futaba, if you are reading this.. wow.. like.. just wow. What were you thinking? Right now I am feeling quite ripped off =(.

pseudonym

okay. It appears that INH means there I.s N.o H.ope of this working. Turning it off "fixes" it; however, as I completely do NOT trust "automagic" fixes, I really would like a full explination of all the fuctions on ALL screens of my radio.

For near $800.. I would expect nothing less.

Thanks

Bax

My Feedback: (11)

What you are looking for is a document that does not exist. You can learn how the different functions of the transmitter work by using the instruction manual. It details how every menu option works. The main key to programming an R/C transmitter is that you must know what you want the model to do, and how you'd like it configured. If you cannot determine how the different flight controls on the model should operate, it's not possible to program the transmitter.

If you determine you need to use a programmabale mix, then you can go to the section on the mixes, and it will go through the setup. If you need to adjust the endpoints of your control system, you go to that section of the manual.

We can see that some definitions are missing. "INH" stands for "inhibited". That means that the function is not turned on for operation. When you change a function from "INH", it will say "ON" or "OFF", depending upon the functions default operation. If the function accepts a switch, such as a pmix, then the switch will be used to turn the function off and on.

In your example of the missing input parameter in the throttle cut function, you want to turn the dial to change the mix so that it's no longer set to "INH".

The instructions do walk the modeler through a basic setup, but because it's impossible for Futaba to determine a person's exact desires, it's really not possible to have a setup for a complex model. They can only write how to use a given function. The modeler needs to know if they need the given function.

There are more answers on the FAQ page:

http://www.2.4gigahertz.com/faq/faq-10c-2_4ghz.html

Many of the 10C's functions are very similar to those of the 9C, so the 9C FAQ page can also help:

http://www.futaba-rc.com/faq/faq-9c.html

pseudonym

As per my email to Futaba Support

Dear Futaba/Hobbico

I am not sure how the document could not exist.. It is a document that you would have had to provide as part of the design spec that went to your development and UI groups. (For some reference, perhaps you should look up what it is I do for a living... here is a link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/<wbr></wbr>Solutions_Architect part of that is Technical Architecture: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/<wbr></wbr>Technical_architecture). Translating that design document into a command reference would be a fairly simple task for any qualified technical writer.

The fact is, that the information dissemination tactic you have chosen is untenable for the very reasons that you stated. Here I quote;To provide documentation in this fashion that could be considered complete, would require a comprehensive listing of all possible uses for the device. This is far to large of a universe of information to be documented and even if attempted, would not be complete before the device itself is obsolete and you have to start all over again.

From this response, I can see that you are aware of the issues with your manual. My question is are you planning to do something to fix it? These are not inexpensive, nor simple devices. As you say, you can't know what everyone is trying to do, so why not provide a simple command reference and index your documentation? That way it can be used for ANY application, including Robotics, which is another "hobby" of mine.

What you have done is ignored the advanced or non-standard user and provided a document that tries to be all things to all people. What you have accomplished is to make the entire thing unusable for both groups.

Please look at this as a cost benefit relationship. Each and every time you respond to a user is a cost expenditure. That cost entails a huge amount of overhead. In Canada, floor space can run from between $400 - $1000 per sq ft per year. Everyone answering the phone, responding to emails, or who has a desk will take up, on average about 15 sq ft. of space including an allowance for walkways. That is an overhead expense of $6000 - $15,000 a year in floor space ALONE. That doesn't include employee overhead (~%30 of wage) nor does it include computer systems, phone systems and support personal. All of which are required to support your front line. The larger the contact centre, the larger the overhead cost. As this is an extremely specialized field, you would be insane to farm it out to the 3rd party, so you are stuck absorbing all those costs. Reducing incoming contacts is the number one way of reducing over all overhead in this particular cost centre. The best way to do that is to head those calls off before they get to the contact centre. You have already provided FAQs, but as you earlier stated, again it isn't possible to know all configurations. One simple step would be to setup a user forum (EDIT:Which is accessable off the FUTABA main page, not a third party site). These take much less full time staff monitoring as most questions will be answered by fellow users, rather than by Futaba/Hobbico staff; However, the number one, best way to reduce incoming contacts would be to provide, up front, complete and comprehensive documentation. These don't need to be printed and included with the product (in fact you shouldn't be including ANY paper instructions these days, people like to search documents and, as each page of paper uses 10L of water to produce, it simply isn't environmentally correct in today's business), they just need to exist. Self support is ALWAYS cheaper than guided support, even if initial acquisition costs are higher. Plot it out on a 5 year cycle and you will see the cost savings.

Thanks again

Skaluf

pseudonym
I'm sorry to hear you are having trouble with the 10C. Let me see I can help you with the Throttle Cut programing. Learning a new radio can be confusing at best.

The first thing you need to do is turn the mix on, this means you need to change it from INH (inhibit) to what will probably be OFF depending on what switch you have selected. Next go down to the bottom of the page and select the switch you want to use to cut the throttle. Most of us use F (spring loaded). You'll want to set it up so that it turns ON when you pull the switch towards you. If it operates the other direction change the POSI (position) direction to DOWN.

Next, determine where along the stick travel you want the CUT to be active. This sets where it starts to be active to the bottom of the stick travel. So, if you set the value at 50% (mid stick), the cut will only work when the throttle stick is below 1/2 stick. This value is set in the THRO (Throttle) value. You can simply move the stick to the position you want to use and hold down the dial-n-key button, it will then automatically set the value for you based on the stick position.

Finally, power up your machine. While pulling the cut switch to the ON position select the RATE menu and change the value to move the servo to the postion you need to kill your engine. That should do it. Let me know if you have any trouble, I'll try to monitor this forum for a couple of days to make sure you get it working.


Regards,

Steve Kaluf
Futaba Marketing
Hobbico

pseudonym

Steve man.. you have posted the same responce on two forums.. As you can see earlier in the thread, the issue was solved.

What i am talking about now is the issue with the lack of a manual.   Thanks for all the help, I really appreciate it.. but I would like the documentation avalible to be able to find these answers out for myself.

You charge $800 for this device, and it is a "sport" model.  Apparently it is even worse when you look at the "Pro" models.  The reason that I went with a premium product is that, as a rule, premium products are expensive because the vendor has taken the time to document them throughly and spent the money to insure that the documentation is professional and complete.  I even took the time to point out how much money you were loosing by not having a maual avalible.  Please, answer the point that I am making, don't just repeat information that has already been posted ealier.  It makes it seem like you aren't reading the entire thread.

Thanks
~m