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RE: 26cc ESM WARBIRDS READY TO SHIP!!! - 2/21/2011 3:38 PM   
jk464


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: jk464

quote:

ORIGINAL: Spychalla Aircraft


quote:

ORIGINAL: rc34074



Leo - this thread is about 26cc warbirds - and so why would you need to ask? How many people would try to fly a 50cc warbird with a 26cc engine?

Ed


Ed,

I needed to ask because the thread had departed so far from the 26cc ''ESM'' warbird topic and into Top Flite ARFs that it was difficult to recognize what you were talking about.

The answer to your last question would be few, and if they did it would not be for long.

Tell me, are pilots flying the .60 - .91 Top Flite P-47 or P-51 ARFs with a 26cc engines?

Leo


Sounds like a bad idea to me, too much shaking and wing loading. They are already a bit of a handful to land unless you have a really nice field. Electric would be a better alternative to glow for .60-.90 TF warbirds than would be gas.



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RE: 26cc ESM WARBIRDS READY TO SHIP!!! - 2/21/2011 4:40 PM   
kahloq



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Status: offline 		Why would electric be better then gas for a 60-90 size TF warbird? There are 20-26cc size gas motors that would work fine. Electric ends up usually being heavier for a plane 60 size and above if want any decent flight times.

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RE: 26cc ESM WARBIRDS READY TO SHIP!!! - 2/21/2011 6:09 PM   
rc34074


 

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Status: offline 		My experience with the Top Flite 60-90 size mustang and thunderbolt tells me that they are very strong (much stronger than the Hangar 9 warbirds I have had) and would readily handle the DLE20 engine.
I flew my Top Flite thunderbolt with engines as large as a Super Tiger 2300 and it did very well with the power of that engine. So I would not be afraid to put a DLE30 in that plane. And it would it in the cowl fine with the right muffler- maybe a Jtec.

The 2300 flew that thunderbolt like a FIGHTER!! I really had fun flying it with that engine . The strafing runs were AWESOME!!

Ed

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RE: 26cc ESM WARBIRDS READY TO SHIP!!! - 2/21/2011 6:19 PM   
ZERO-322


 

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Status: offline 		Just out of curiosity but why do you guys keep going on and on about Top Flite on an ESM thread ? not trying to be a stick in the mud but this thread has been off topic for some time

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RE: 26cc ESM WARBIRDS READY TO SHIP!!! - 2/21/2011 8:52 PM   
jk464


 

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ORIGINAL: kahloq

Why would electric be better then gas for a 60-90 size TF warbird? There are 20-26cc size gas motors that would work fine. Electric ends up usually being heavier for a plane 60 size and above if want any decent flight times.


I have a TF kit built .60 mustang with a OS 91FS in it, this is what I would recommend personally. Its fairly easy on glow fuel and runs smooth as silk. I just personally cant see running a gasser in planes that are less than 10lbs. Some people just really hate glow, so electric is an alternative for smallish planes. In my experience the best flying gas planes are 50cc and up, with the 26cc kind of not being ideal but they work ok.

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RE: 26cc ESM WARBIRDS READY TO SHIP!!! - 2/22/2011 2:47 AM   
Johnny_Zero


 

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Status: offline 		What isn't ideal about 26cc gas planes and what do you mean by they work ok?

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RE: 26cc ESM WARBIRDS READY TO SHIP!!! - 2/22/2011 3:19 AM   
kahloq



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Status: offline 		I personally don't think a .91 4 stroke is near enough for a TF P-51 or P-47. My plane came out OVER 10 pounds...10.4 pounds to be exact. Im running a saito 125 in mine. Good motor for this plane. The lowest I'd go with is a 100. But...Im at 5000 ft altitude also.
For electric on this size plane....it'd be an 8s setup using an e-flite power 110. Minimal would be a 7s on a power 90 or equivalent. Sure, a power 60 will fly a hangar 9 60 size plane just fine.....but H9 planes usually weigh a pounds or so less then TF arf's of the same size.
In any case.....talking about TF or H9 planes is not exactly what this thread is supposed to be about.

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RE: 26cc ESM WARBIRDS READY TO SHIP!!! - 2/22/2011 4:48 PM   
vallawyer


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kahloq

quote:

ORIGINAL: rc34074

The Top Flite gold edition p47, if built straight, DOES NOT SNAP. I had one and it was almost impossible to make it snap - you would had to TRY to make it snap. I really enjoyed flying that plane. It does tend to be a bit heavy compared to say an H9 p47 but the wing design on that plane is a superb design. I flew it many many times. If you slow it down it just mushes forward - NEVER snaps.

So Kahlog if the guy in your club had a gold edition Top Flite p47 that snaps there is NO WAY that it was built correctly (by correctly I mean according to the plans and the parts that come in the kit), or perhaps the CG was way too far back.

Ed


YOU made a big assumption and retorted by talking about a gold edition KIT....not the ARF. This thread is about ESM arf's and as an extension, maribino was asking about first warbirds. So...are you then suggesting he should go BUILD a KIT as a first warbird..spend all that time and then risk it?
No.
Top Flite has an ARF P-47 60 size. Maybe you didnt realize that. The TF P-47 arf IS HEAVY....and YES it WILL snap. You try and impune a 30 year builder/experienced flyer? Please. He built the larger TF P-47 kit, but also the 60 size TF P-47 ARF as an everyday flyer and YES it will SNAP as he found out.
Now...maybe had you said...maybe the arf is heavy compared to the kit...but trying to sit there and lambast someone...especially trying to help a new warbird pilot get started off on good footing.....well...take a step back!



Thats not true.  The TF P47 is one of the easiest to fly warbirds ever.  



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RE: 26cc ESM WARBIRDS READY TO SHIP!!! - 2/22/2011 4:54 PM   
jk464


 

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ORIGINAL: kahloq

I personally don't think a .91 4 stroke is near enough for a TF P-51 or P-47. My plane came out OVER 10 pounds...10.4 pounds to be exact. Im running a saito 125 in mine. Good motor for this plane. The lowest I'd go with is a 100. But...Im at 5000 ft altitude also.
For electric on this size plane....it'd be an 8s setup using an e-flite power 110. Minimal would be a 7s on a power 90 or equivalent. Sure, a power 60 will fly a hangar 9 60 size plane just fine.....but H9 planes usually weigh a pounds or so less then TF arf's of the same size.
In any case.....talking about TF or H9 planes is not exactly what this thread is supposed to be about.


I'm guessing I get 60-80mph out with my .91, can do large loops, and have plenty of power for take off. I guess it depends what you want from your warbirds, personally I have other planes for flying thrills and tend to fly warbirds conservatively.

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RE: 26cc ESM WARBIRDS READY TO SHIP!!! - 2/22/2011 4:55 PM   
kahloq



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quote:

ORIGINAL: vallawyer


quote:

ORIGINAL: kahloq

quote:

ORIGINAL: rc34074

The Top Flite gold edition p47, if built straight, DOES NOT SNAP. I had one and it was almost impossible to make it snap - you would had to TRY to make it snap. I really enjoyed flying that plane. It does tend to be a bit heavy compared to say an H9 p47 but the wing design on that plane is a superb design. I flew it many many times. If you slow it down it just mushes forward - NEVER snaps.

So Kahlog if the guy in your club had a gold edition Top Flite p47 that snaps there is NO WAY that it was built correctly (by correctly I mean according to the plans and the parts that come in the kit), or perhaps the CG was way too far back.

Ed


YOU made a big assumption and retorted by talking about a gold edition KIT....not the ARF. This thread is about ESM arf's and as an extension, maribino was asking about first warbirds. So...are you then suggesting he should go BUILD a KIT as a first warbird..spend all that time and then risk it?
No.
Top Flite has an ARF P-47 60 size. Maybe you didnt realize that. The TF P-47 arf IS HEAVY....and YES it WILL snap. You try and impune a 30 year builder/experienced flyer? Please. He built the larger TF P-47 kit, but also the 60 size TF P-47 ARF as an everyday flyer and YES it will SNAP as he found out.
Now...maybe had you said...maybe the arf is heavy compared to the kit...but trying to sit there and lambast someone...especially trying to help a new warbird pilot get started off on good footing.....well...take a step back!



Thats not true.  The TF P47 is one of the easiest to fly warbirds ever.  




P-47's are usually one of the easier planes to fly, but its a warbird and it WILL snap. Period. I dont care what you think, say, whatever. Its possible to snap end of story. If you think it isnt, then your lieing to yourself.

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RE: 26cc ESM WARBIRDS READY TO SHIP!!! - 2/22/2011 5:00 PM   
jk464


 

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What isn't ideal about 26cc gas planes and what do you mean by they work ok?


I guess I should specify, they should work great for 70" WS fiberglass warbirds with a radial front end. In that type of setup you need the extra weight of a gasser anyways so no big deal. If I were to get the KI84 which I'm very tempted I would definitely go this route. Now for something like the esm 109 I would guess a large glow saito would probably be more ideal.

I havent seen a dle 20cc in action, it looks more RC airplane specific than earlier small gassers and might have pretty good power to weight.

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RE: 26cc ESM WARBIRDS READY TO SHIP!!! - 2/22/2011 5:10 PM   
kahloq



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Status: offline 		Whats the elevation where you are in CA?

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RE: 26cc ESM WARBIRDS READY TO SHIP!!! - 2/22/2011 5:39 PM   
vallawyer


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kahloq


quote:

ORIGINAL: vallawyer


quote:

ORIGINAL: kahloq

quote:

ORIGINAL: rc34074

The Top Flite gold edition p47, if built straight, DOES NOT SNAP. I had one and it was almost impossible to make it snap - you would had to TRY to make it snap. I really enjoyed flying that plane. It does tend to be a bit heavy compared to say an H9 p47 but the wing design on that plane is a superb design. I flew it many many times. If you slow it down it just mushes forward - NEVER snaps.

So Kahlog if the guy in your club had a gold edition Top Flite p47 that snaps there is NO WAY that it was built correctly (by correctly I mean according to the plans and the parts that come in the kit), or perhaps the CG was way too far back.

Ed


YOU made a big assumption and retorted by talking about a gold edition KIT....not the ARF. This thread is about ESM arf's and as an extension, maribino was asking about first warbirds. So...are you then suggesting he should go BUILD a KIT as a first warbird..spend all that time and then risk it?
No.
Top Flite has an ARF P-47 60 size. Maybe you didnt realize that. The TF P-47 arf IS HEAVY....and YES it WILL snap. You try and impune a 30 year builder/experienced flyer? Please. He built the larger TF P-47 kit, but also the 60 size TF P-47 ARF as an everyday flyer and YES it will SNAP as he found out.
Now...maybe had you said...maybe the arf is heavy compared to the kit...but trying to sit there and lambast someone...especially trying to help a new warbird pilot get started off on good footing.....well...take a step back!



Thats not true.  The TF P47 is one of the easiest to fly warbirds ever.  




P-47's are usually one of the easier planes to fly, but its a warbird and it WILL snap. Period. I dont care what you think, say, whatever. Its possible to snap end of story. If you think it isnt, then your lieing to yourself.


A Holly Lobby Telemaster will snap too if you are stupid enough.  But you have no idea of what you are talking about, the top flite P-47 is one of the easiest fo fly warbirds ever.  



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RE: 26cc ESM WARBIRDS READY TO SHIP!!! - 2/22/2011 9:38 PM   
jk464


 

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ORIGINAL: kahloq

Whats the elevation where you are in CA?


Oh, probably 50' or so, I recently moved to Utah though and haven't yet flown there yet. I might be in the same boat as you now.

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RE: 26cc ESM WARBIRDS READY TO SHIP!!! - 2/23/2011 1:53 AM   
kahloq



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quote:

ORIGINAL: vallawyer


quote:

ORIGINAL: kahloq


quote:

ORIGINAL: vallawyer


quote:

ORIGINAL: kahloq

quote:

ORIGINAL: rc34074

The Top Flite gold edition p47, if built straight, DOES NOT SNAP. I had one and it was almost impossible to make it snap - you would had to TRY to make it snap. I really enjoyed flying that plane. It does tend to be a bit heavy compared to say an H9 p47 but the wing design on that plane is a superb design. I flew it many many times. If you slow it down it just mushes forward - NEVER snaps.

So Kahlog if the guy in your club had a gold edition Top Flite p47 that snaps there is NO WAY that it was built correctly (by correctly I mean according to the plans and the parts that come in the kit), or perhaps the CG was way too far back.

Ed


YOU made a big assumption and retorted by talking about a gold edition KIT....not the ARF. This thread is about ESM arf's and as an extension, maribino was asking about first warbirds. So...are you then suggesting he should go BUILD a KIT as a first warbird..spend all that time and then risk it?
No.
Top Flite has an ARF P-47 60 size. Maybe you didnt realize that. The TF P-47 arf IS HEAVY....and YES it WILL snap. You try and impune a 30 year builder/experienced flyer? Please. He built the larger TF P-47 kit, but also the 60 size TF P-47 ARF as an everyday flyer and YES it will SNAP as he found out.
Now...maybe had you said...maybe the arf is heavy compared to the kit...but trying to sit there and lambast someone...especially trying to help a new warbird pilot get started off on good footing.....well...take a step back!



Thats not true.  The TF P47 is one of the easiest to fly warbirds ever.  




P-47's are usually one of the easier planes to fly, but its a warbird and it WILL snap. Period. I dont care what you think, say, whatever. Its possible to snap end of story. If you think it isnt, then your lieing to yourself.


A Holly Lobby Telemaster will snap too if you are stupid enough.  But you have no idea of what you are talking about, the top flite P-47 is one of the easiest fo fly warbirds ever.  




I have MUCH better idea of what Im talking about then you do. That is fact. Your favorite line is "you have no idea what you are talking about". You only say that because you lack the ability to debate someone without attacking them.
Ive never stated a p-47 isnt a relatively easy plane to fly. But ANY warbird can bite you and doesnt mean being stupid as you want to label anyone that says anything different then you. There are scale masters that crash planes all the time. At least a couple crashes happen at every warbird event. And these are by super experienced people. So...your going to call them all stupid?
No matter what size or weight, any warbird can snap and it doesnt mean the plane is necessarily going slow either. Guess you've never heard of a high speed snap. A bank snap? Do some research bud, cuz you are really over your head. Guess you've never heard of lift slippage either. Know what your talking about...seriously...before you start posting anything.

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RE: 26cc ESM WARBIRDS READY TO SHIP!!! - 2/23/2011 2:28 AM   
ZERO-322


 

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Status: offline 		Ok I would like to but in for a sec

but Val not that long ago you slammed some poor guy on a thread for making a reference that wasn't related to the topic SO tell me this WHAT ARE YOU DOING ? at least others like kahlog have attempted to drop the subject , and yet you insist about going on and on about something that has nothing to do with the topic of this thread take it somewhere else !

talk about being a hipocrite !

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RE: 26cc ESM WARBIRDS READY TO SHIP!!! - 2/23/2011 12:12 PM   
Asanders



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Status: offline 		JK, what part of Utah? There are several clubs around. The elevation isnt all that bad, there is a difference. A lot of pilots here go one or 2 engine sizes larger. I did fly in Victorville one year and could not believe how fast my 40 sized Spit flew compared to up here. It flew like it had a 60 in it.

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RE: 26cc ESM WARBIRDS READY TO SHIP!!! - 2/23/2011 3:13 PM   
jk464


 

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ORIGINAL: Asanders

JK, what part of Utah? There are several clubs around. The elevation isnt all that bad, there is a difference. A lot of pilots here go one or 2 engine sizes larger. I did fly in Victorville one year and could not believe how fast my 40 sized Spit flew compared to up here. It flew like it had a 60 in it.


I'm in the Lehi area and checked out the local field on the internet, it looks like a super nice field.

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RE: 26cc ESM WARBIRDS READY TO SHIP!!! - 2/24/2011 3:58 AM   
Asanders



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Status: offline 		Cool, that is where I fly. Great club awesome field. Hope to see you out there sometime when it gets warmer. I don't fly much in the cold anymore.

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RE: 26cc ESM WARBIRDS READY TO SHIP!!! - 7/6/2011 6:14 AM   
witooa


 

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Status: offline 		Hi could you please advise me on a motor for the ESM Fiesler Storch 93", I have a RCG- 22cc as suggested, But some reports say a 30cc , the 22cc is not enough power, Do you have any thoughts on this as I would buy a 30cc if required. Also the gap with the wing slats seem to be a issue I don't have a gap sizs do you know the gap size, hope you can help regards Allan.

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RE: 26cc ESM WARBIRDS READY TO SHIP!!! - 7/6/2011 8:01 AM   
witooa


 

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Status: offline 		Hi Sorry I ment to say RCG 26cc Motor NOT 22cc for the ESM storch. Cheers Allan.

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