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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/22/2012 6:45 PM   
microdon2


 

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Status: offline 		mach2 - I'd love to post some vids - just needs a better camera and a good videographer. (not that I think of it, I'm a member at the same club as "knockoffs", and he's an excellent shooter (plenty of very good vids on Youtube). maybe I can ask him to shoot my Rev 70...)

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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/22/2012 9:40 PM   
Slow and Steady


 

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Status: offline 		This plane with a DLE 20 sounds like a great combo, but for overall sport flying a 75AX is also a good option. It is not a nitro hog and you don't have to deal with the gasoline smell; my 75AX will do knife edge all day long, flies light and has plenty of power. There are going to be trade offs no matter what you choose.

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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/22/2012 10:06 PM   
Luchnia


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: eldad007

does anyone have a video or pics of reinforcing the firewall of the rev70''?


All I did to mine was a couple of small angle pieces for braces and then I drilled holes through the side into the cross piece and screwed in socket head servo screws. Once all done, I epoxied the whole area. The thing is super strong now. I think it will break somewhere else first before the firewall.

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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/23/2012 3:22 AM   
mach2


 

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Status: offline 		These pics show just the top done. I did all sides. Just epoxied triangle wood to the box.


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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/23/2012 3:24 AM   
microdon2


 

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Status: offline 		mach - I did the same. Also epoxied inside 90's to the inside corners in front. Seems pretty strong.

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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/23/2012 3:33 AM   
mach2


 

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Status: offline 		I also started dropping epoxy to the inside of the fuse where the main gear screw into the bottom. Its not glued very well at all which contributes to the gear ripping out of these planes.

make sure you reinforce the gear with some aluminum plates on the top and bottom of the gear. Or something along those lines.

Jeremy


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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/23/2012 3:56 AM   
Slow and Steady


 

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Status: offline 		My Extreme Flight 50cc Yak has the fire wall tab locked to the sides of the box, similar to the Revolver, but also has a wood fillet on the vertical edges of the firewall, both inside and on the front of the box. No metal angles and it has held up fine with no sign of separation. While some manufacturers provide aluminum angles, I wonder if they are overkill or maybe just another way to handle the issue. Never heard of an Extreme Flight engine box coming apart.

Just to clarify, the firewall is the face of the box that the engine bolts to. This is likely more critical than the were the top of the box meets the first fuselage former.

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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/23/2012 5:27 AM   
mach2


 

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Status: offline 		oh yeah, I drop epoxy to as much area to the inside edges of where the firewall meets the box as I can. If its glued anything like the landing gear box, its not good enough....

Jeremy



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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/23/2012 1:17 PM   
wjcalhoun


 

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As noted by S&S the key is to understand how stress is transmitted in the airframe, and be sure that stressed joints are strong enough. On the firewall question, the engine generates thrust transferred to the firewall by the engine mount, the FW transmits thrust to the SIDES of the engine box which are continuous back to the wing tube, where much of the airframe drag occurs. That section of the airframe structure is generally under tension. So, be sure that the joints between the FW and the SIDES of the engine box are reinforced. The joint between the top of the engine box and the first fuse former (F1), where the cowl attaches, is much less critical for thrust. Those joints however do contribute to the torsional rigidity of the engine box, resisting twisting forces from the engine spooling up and down and the torsion generated by turning the prop, so if you see a problem there, fix it.

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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/23/2012 4:09 PM   
Slow and Steady


 

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Status: offline 		WC, You mentioned something I totally overlooked and that is the twist on that box as the engine is punched. I guess some of that is dissipated as the plane rolls, but on a level flight it probably torques the frame quite a bit. I heard that the new DA120 challenges some 100cc planes.

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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/23/2012 9:10 PM   
ahicks


 

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Status: offline 		There's another force on the firewall too, especially with a heavier prop, as a result of "gyroscopic precession". That force has to do with the energy required to move a prop at speed (a gyro basically) spinning in the plane it's in, to a new one? As flown around the "race track", there's not much of that force going on, but what about when a snap roll or other rather violent maneuver is done? That force has to register right up there, or exceed, anything mentioned so far? Not suggesting you need to install the alum. braces, just tossing that idea out as something else to consider....

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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/23/2012 9:25 PM   
wjcalhoun


 

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Status: offline 		I'm sure that gyroscopic precession is a strong force. Maybe some aeronautical engineer or physics post-doc could calculate it for us, based on the mass of a prop and the RPM we turn. It would come into play in maneuvers that change the pitch or yaw axis, like, as you said, snaps, flat spins, tumbling. It would be interesting to get a sense of the magnitude of that force. Thrust is pretty easy - probably always less than 15# for the engines we put on R70s.

Another force i have thought about occasionally is g-force during maneuvers. A DLE20 weighs about 2# +/- so in a 5g pull, there would be 10# of down force on the engine box. Has anyone put a Eagle Tree system accelerometer on their plane? Do we know what kinds of g-forces the R70 can generate?



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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/23/2012 11:00 PM   
68gts


 

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Status: offline 		Be sure to reinforce the firewall! this happened to me on friday....

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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/23/2012 11:07 PM   
microdon2


 

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Status: offline 		... hence the insertion of angles on those inside corners ...

Add one to the "upgrades" list.

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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/23/2012 11:50 PM   
capt1597


 

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Status: offline 		bummer dude!

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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/24/2012 1:06 AM   
capt1597


 

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Status: offline 		after busting out firewalls and landing gear on a number of arf's and then repairing them i came to notice that my repairs (using epoxyand tri-stock) were stonger than the oringinal build and seemed to last much better. so i started to reenforce my arf's before the broke and have seemed to achieve stonger planes for my effert. i now epoxy reenforce all my arf's now. one word of caution, these are planes and dead weight sucks. you can over do it. try and think like an engineer not a mason. happy flying, capt

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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/24/2012 2:14 AM   
wjcalhoun


 

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Status: offline 		Well guys, i found a site that purports to calculate the force on a prop related to precession:

http://www.supercoolprops.com/articles/%20f2b_gyroscopic.php

I did a test calculation for a Xoar 17x6 prop turning 6000 rpm, traveling at 60mph, with the prop 14" in front of the CG, and a radius of turn 10' gives a precession force of about 3 oz. Mass of prop, rpm, velocity, and radius of prop are in the numerator; the distance of prop from CG and the radius of the turn are in the denominator.

Were the turn radius shorter, or rpm or speed greater, or using an APC prop (quite a bit heavier), the force would be more. Because of the influence of velocity, which in a flat spin is low, I don't think that the precession force would be a lot greater in a flat spin or snap. I may be way off base, or the purported calculation may be in error, but if not, the precession forces are small relative to g forces.

68gts - HOW did you do that?





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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/24/2012 2:37 AM   
mach2


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: 68gts

Be sure to reinforce the firewall! this happened to me on friday....


WOW, im glad that i have gotten into the habbit of reinforcing that peice too. They are not glued well at all. So put some epoxy and triangle wood stock if you can fit it, on anything that has any amount of stress on it.

did you crash due to this issue? 




ahicks brings up a point that ive never thought about but must have a very strong influence. Just think about how efficient and strong those tiny gyros are that are used on some 3D planes and helicopters. They are tiny and yet strong enough exert a lot of force. And even though Im a novice pilot i like to do things that would fight the gyro effect like tumbling, snaps, lomecovaks, and even the start and of a knife edge and a flat turn fights the gyro (prop). I love uncoordinated flight. It looks really cool in my opinion.....when the tail kicks out its just down right cool looking.

check out this guy. I love the way he flies.

the turn @ 1:32 is sweet. It makes the smoke trail look cool. I loved the tail sliding when i was pumping smoke on the revolver. But I aint putting it back on the next one. Regardless of how cool it looked. If it was the interference from the pump that caused my loss of signal to the Rx, it aint worth it. There isnt enough room on the rev to put the smoke pump far enough from the Rx. Unless i put it inside the cowl somewhere. And then it would be way too nose heavy.  And my plane with the DLE 20 doesnt need ANY more weight up front....



Jeremy



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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/24/2012 2:44 AM   
mach2


 

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Status: offline 		And Ive seen this before but I dont know what its called. At 56seconds of this video he does a maneuver where he gives full right rudder and pulls the stick back (full up elevator).

Actually ive seen the opposite which looks cooler. Its full rudder and full down elevator. It is a sweet looking move, but I have never seen a RC plane do this.....


@ 0:56



Jeremy



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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/24/2012 11:30 AM   
68gts


 

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I was coming in too hot for the landing and seen the edge of the runway coming fast... so i gave her full throttle and pulled back on the stick and the landing gear( which ripped off) hit the tall grass and did a nose over and ripped the firewall off....not too much damage so i ordered new wheel pants and a cowl...damn tower catalog sucked me into buying a TOP FLITE 1/7 SCALE P-51! going gas with this one too  DAMN YOU TOWER!! LOL



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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/25/2012 12:52 AM   
Luchnia


 

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Status: offline 		Since you are posting vids, I thought I would throw in a pic of my smaller revolver. Take note of the pilot

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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/25/2012 1:03 AM   
Luchnia


 

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Status: offline 		RCU is really struggling to download anything tonight. Tried to upload more pics but it failed....arrrggh

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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/25/2012 1:08 AM   
microdon2


 

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Status: offline 		Luchnia - you got Svetlana Kapanina to fly your Revolver???

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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/25/2012 7:19 AM   
mach2


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: 68gts

I was coming in too hot for the landing and seen the edge of the runway coming fast... so i gave her full throttle and pulled back on the stick and the landing gear( which ripped off) hit the tall grass and did a nose over and ripped the firewall off....not too much damage so i ordered new wheel pants and a cowl...damn tower catalog sucked me into buying a TOP FLITE 1/7 SCALE P-51! going gas with this one too  DAMN YOU TOWER!! LOL




That's a really nice plane. Are you doing the DLE20? I bet it would be a clean install and only need some opening on the bottom. Wouldnt need to cut anything on the side, especially with a pitts muffler. It'd be nice to keep the cowl nice and not all cut up with stuff sticking out, like ive got to do with my P51.

The scale style flaps and ailerons look cool.

Jeremy




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RE: Larger Revolver - 4/25/2012 7:25 AM   
mach2


 

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ORIGINAL: Luchnia

Since you are posting vids, I thought I would throw in a pic of my smaller revolver. Take note of the pilot


Its hard to see in this pic, but Mario is flying my P51. My boys are all into Super Mario Brothers stuff so I thought they'd get a kick out of that. They went nuts. It was cool to see their excitement. They just though it was the craziest thing ever!

Im on duty until thurday. Ill get a better pic of Mario. It came out cool because he matches the airplane's colors...

Jeremy



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