RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 12/30/2012 10:06 PM

ram3500-RCU

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quote:

ORIGINAL: mstcitabria73

Gary,
Who is the maufacturer/dealer for that 42% ?

It was built from the A.M.R. kit.

http://www.amr-rc.com/index.php?path=content&SC=kits&SUBSC=kits%20to%20be%20assembled&page=kits_info&produit_id=10&marque=AMR&langue=en

The picture in the ad is of my plane.

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 12/31/2012 1:27 PM

mstcitabria73

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more of Gary's stuff.......nice

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 12/31/2012 3:36 PM

bookmaker

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Nice builds.

Last April I bought a full scale 1965 Citabria 7ECA and have been considering building a model of it. I bought some plans and have been keeping an eye out for someone selling a BN kit cheap.

The big issue is that the early Citabrias have what is called the "No Bounce Gear" with oleo struts more like the Champ. Also the elevator has no aerodynamic counterbalance. These should not be big issues however.

Here is a photo of my bird.

Dale

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 12/31/2012 5:37 PM

do335a

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tenacious101010

Thanks for that great information. It will be a big help. I find it hard to believe that they would even recommend a .60 size engine for this thing. They stretched the truth a lot more than they do now. I had a choice between a G-38 with magneto, and a DL-50, so since the DL-50 was 1 pound lighter, that is it. I still have 2 inches of ground clearance with a 22 inch prop, I would prefer to have a 20 inch prop.
Denny

When they came out, those Nosen Champs and Citabrias did indeed fly with .60 size engines.

At that time, there were no gasoline engines - they came a bit later and started the gas thing when a Quadra chain saw engine was converted and stuffed into a Nosen Champ.

The largest glow engine at the time was an OS .80, so that's what I stuck in mine. The structure was basicaly weak, esepcially in the nose. So if you put in a DL 50, you'll be adding considerable weight to make a compatible structure.

Back in those days. planes of this sort flew on the wing, not the prop. Trying to imitate a helicopter was not on the agenda. If you try it with that airframe, you may be quickly disappointed, unless you make a bunch of other weight increasing mods so that it doesn't suffer structural failure.

I always fail to understand why people want to try to make things something that they are not. It's still what you started with. Want 3D? Start with that design objective and work backwards to the start to suit.

All the best with your dream.

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 12/31/2012 6:37 PM

ram3500-RCU

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quote:

ORIGINAL: do335a

quote:

ORIGINAL: tenacious101010

Thanks for that great information. It will be a big help. I find it hard to believe that they would even recommend a .60 size engine for this thing. They stretched the truth a lot more than they do now. I had a choice between a G-38 with magneto, and a DL-50, so since the DL-50 was 1 pound lighter, that is it. I still have 2 inches of ground clearance with a 22 inch prop, I would prefer to have a 20 inch prop.
Denny

When they came out, those Nosen Champs and Citabrias did indeed fly with .60 size engines.

At that time, there were no gasoline engines - they came a bit later and started the gas thing when a Quadra chain saw engine was converted and stuffed into a Nosen Champ.

The largest glow engine at the time was an OS .80, so that's what I stuck in mine. The structure was basicaly weak, esepcially in the nose. So if you put in a DL 50, you'll be adding considerable weight to make a compatible structure.

Back in those days. planes of this sort flew on the wing, not the prop. Trying to imitate a helicopter was not on the agenda. If you try it with that airframe, you may be quickly disappointed, unless you make a bunch of other weight increasing mods so that it doesn't suffer structural failure.

I always fail to understand why people want to try to make things something that they are not. It's still what you started with. Want 3D? Start with that design objective and work backwards to the start to suit.

All the best with your dream.

Good post that I find myself agreeing with 100%.

Remember the Bud Nosen giant scale 'trainer'? It was advertised to fly on a .60 size engine. And it did. I had one just because it was so big. I bashed it into a twin. Wish I still had pictures.

Flew it into an out house, and that was that. I guess you could say it 'took a crap'

.

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 1/1/2013 9:18 AM

Bass1

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You guys are getting me all amped up again to fly my Nosen Citabria. She's been a restin' nicely in my shop for a year or two now. Mine is as light as a medium size Florida strain pelican and is fun as hell to fly. You definitely want/need good rudder skills to really enjoy it to the max though. Short field, high obstacle, power off, steep slips to a landing are awesome if you have the nerve

!

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 1/1/2013 3:07 PM

mstcitabria73

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Bass1

You guys are getting me all amped up again to fly my Nosen Citabria. She's been a restin' nicely in my shop for a year or two now. Mine is as light as a medium size Florida strain pelican and is fun as hell to fly. You definitely want/need good rudder skills to really enjoy it to the max though. Short field, high obstacle, power off, steep slips to a landing are awesome if you have the nerve !

Bass1, you are getting me amped up to finish my build, lol!

< Message edited by mstcitabria73 -- 1/1/2013 5:08 PM >

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 1/1/2013 4:57 PM

Twin_Flyer

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Now I'm rethinking my Quadra 35. I want to fly it on gas as I'm trying to get away from Nitro.

What about a 20 CC gasser? Either an RCS 140 or a Kalt G22 as that's what I also have available...

Bill S.

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 1/1/2013 5:23 PM

mstcitabria73

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Bill,
I decided to go with with the DLE 35cc rear exhaust and carburetor gas burner to avoid the slimy, oily mess from the nitro fuel, nothing against nitro burners I have a bunch, gas is much cheaper than the nitro fuels, I live about 200 miles away from the nearest LHS where the nitro fuel is available, gas in town 2 miles away.....................

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 1/1/2013 5:29 PM

ram3500-RCU

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quote:

ORIGINAL: mstcitabria73

Bill,
I decided to go with with the gas burner to avoid the slimy, oily mess the nitro burners are well known for and the gas is much cheaper than the nitro fuels.......

You will like the sound, economy, clean burning, and larger prop.

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 1/3/2013 3:19 AM

Joey B

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I am finishing up the air frame on my bud nosen citabria now I have os 120 4 stroke i am using for power do you think it will have enough power I am covering with fabric then paint

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 1/4/2013 5:02 AM

Bass1

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Joey, Not sure what the RTF weight will be with your model but if you keep it nice and light (under 15 lbs or so) the 120 4 stroke should be adequate for scale type flying. I remember a a scale builder who competed in Top Gun civilian class some years ago with a Nosen Champ (basically the same airframe) and either won his class or placed 2nd with his 16 lb. Champ powered with a Saito 150. He had built his airframe with a removable hatch in the bottom of the fuse directly over the CG so he could add weight if he decided it was too breezy/windy for the appearance of "scale like" flight (not getting blown all over the place). During the competition he added 2 lbs. of sand to the aircraft because of the high gusty winds giving him an 18 lb. model with his Saito 150. It worked as he kicked butt and placed well in the competition and had some real nice photos and a mini write up in M.A.N. magazine. Of course the full scale Champ is a little more docile flying than the full scale Citabria so he didn't need insane power. Not sure in the the weight differences between fabric and paint as opposed to something like iron on ready colored 21st Century fabric or similar but that might be something to consider in keeping your bird light. I guess it all depends on how much paint you use, amount of detail and how light you build.

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 1/4/2013 9:46 PM

loserr

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Would any of you guys that have built the BN Citabria kit have recommendations on what material to use and where to get it for the windshield. also how to build tail plane supports (material and attachment types) thanks

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 1/4/2013 10:50 PM

mstcitabria73

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quote:

ORIGINAL: loserr

Would any of you guys that have built the BN Citabria kit have recommendations on what material to use and where to get it for the windshield. also how to build tail plane supports (material and attachment types) thanks

I'm using this on my tailfeathers, cost about 7 bucks and a cinch to
install, just make sure you install hardwood mounting points where the
fittings attache. GPMA2844 Great Planes Flying Wire/Fitting Set
Ultimate Bipe Performance Series ARF

or you could use these carbon fiber rods that will work well also, about
the same price below,
GPMA4031 Great Planes Carbon Fiber Tail Wires 25% Pitts M-12S
50 Performance Series ARF

nice set of folding wing struts and jury struts from Hanger9's Super Cub PA-18 106" Wingspan ARF to mount on the BN Citabria 105.5" wing, all fitting/mounting hardware, extra $ but nice......
http://hangar-9.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=HAN454010

windshield material,
http://shop.balsausa.com/category_s/183.htm

Coverite 21st Century Fabric Covering Material,
http://www.coverite.com/covering/covq0301.html

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 1/8/2013 4:06 AM

loserr

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thanks, the flying wire looks like just what I need..

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 1/16/2013 4:44 AM

bandit357

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hi guys, I built and rebuilt a Nosen Citabria and she fly's great at 17.5 lbs. this bird will fly great with a DLE 20, or so, i put a DLE 30 on the front and it has at least 3 times more power than she needs, for scale type flight 1/4 throttle is all it takes, the vertical performance at full throttle is amazing. i am however very cautious about too much speed on down lines, and hard maneuvers. the wings are built as per the plans, so i don't trust the wings to stay on with a high G load.

as for CG i had to add a pound of lead to the nose to get it right, and yes i did add extra strength from the fire wall back to handle the gas engine, i have had no structural problems with the gas engine.

as for tail feather bracing, i used the Du-Bro 4-40 rods, and they have been working great for over 20 years. Like every one else hear, i sure do love my Nosen Citabria.. cheers.

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 1/18/2013 8:55 PM

mstcitabria73

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quote:

ORIGINAL: bandit357

hi guys, I built and rebuilt a Nosen Citabria and she fly's great at 17.5 lbs. this bird will fly great with a DLE 20, or so, i put a DLE 30 on the front and it has at least 3 times more power than she needs, for scale type flight 1/4 throttle is all it takes, the vertical performance at full throttle is amazing. i am however very cautious about too much speed on down lines, and hard maneuvers. the wings are built as per the plans, so i don't trust the wings to stay on with a high G load.

as for CG i had to add a pound of lead to the nose to get it right, and yes i did add extra strength from the fire wall back to handle the gas engine, i have had no structural problems with the gas engine.

as for tail feather bracing, i used the Du-Bro 4-40 rods, and they have been working great for over 20 years. Like every one else hear, i sure do love my Nosen Citabria.. cheers.

bandit357,
Are you using the stock factory aluminum landing gear with the 30cc gas burner on that nice looking bird?

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 1/19/2013 12:38 AM

bandit357

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Yes, that is the stock gear, with wire for the axles. see the pic. it has been working good, with just enough flex.

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 1/19/2013 4:31 AM

Twin_Flyer

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What diameter is the wire you make the stiffeners from?

Thanks,
Bill S.

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 1/20/2013 6:38 AM

bandit357

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the axles are 3/16, i believe Du-Bro tires come with that center hole

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 2/9/2013 7:44 PM

mstcitabria73

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about 90% done on the fuse, got to sheet the nose and upper rear structure next....

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 2/10/2013 11:58 PM

warbdluvr

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Thanks for the great thread. I happen to have one of these gathering dust on a shelf. Nice to know what I'm into before I get started

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 2/12/2013 6:21 AM

bandit357

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lookin good MST,

when you get to the sheeting, you will have fun, i boiled mine, then soaked with glass cleaner, then i strapped them down and let dry, it came out nice.

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 2/12/2013 12:04 PM

mstcitabria73

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Thanks Bandit, and yes the build gets much easier at this point and able to make more progress now. I think I could have built about 3 modern day kits with the amount of time I have in this build so far, tuff build, more or less on your own as the build instruction info is almost non-existent, just got to keep pushing on looking for the light at the end of the tunnel, lol. Hearing from all you guys about the great flying qualities of the BN Citabria helps to keep me in the cellar a few hours everyday. The cowl, wheelpants, LG and tail feathers are about complete also. Got my order from National Balsa in yesterday for more wood to begin the wing construction, they offer some really nice 48 in. Sitka Spruce for the main spars and have some good quality balsa too. It's about -30 below zero, windy blowing snow and no green grass insight till May so another trip back down in the cellar for a few more hours...........pics below are of my Midwest Citabria, 80.75 wingspan w/ Saito 1.00 four stroke covered in 21st Century fabric, sweet flying machine.

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RE: BUD NOSEN 1/4 scale CITABRIA BUILD COMPLETION - 2/13/2013 5:27 PM

mstcitabria73

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quote:

ORIGINAL: bandit357

lookin good MST,

when you get to the sheeting, you will have fun, i boiled mine, then soaked with glass cleaner, then i strapped them down and let dry, it came out nice.

managed to get some sheeting on the nose top and bottom, instant CA made it an easy task just by forming the sheet to the contour and bonding it....

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