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"A spad is an ugly, heavy plane that does not fly ... - 7/14/2003 11:51:59 PM   
Jim_McIntyre



Posts: 2078
Joined: 4/5/2002
From: Claremont, ON, CANADA
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by nukes
Just because we don't have to take the plane home in a bag to rebuild or buy a new one, does not make it unsafe.[/QUOTE]

Ok, maybe I should send "bad Jim" away for a while.... :

----------

Seriously, If I smack my plane into something, even if it's repairable at the field, I refuse to fly it again until I've had the radio checked out.... I was just wondering if this is not common practice in the SPAD world?

Another question but related.

I was looking at a SPAD built by a buddy just this weekend and I was wondering about the radio being mounted to what appeared to be an aluminum channel hard mounted to the engine. I was wondering how much vibration was transmitted to the servos and, especially the receiver which was tie wrapped to the same channel, compressing the foam more than I would like.... He did remark that he hadn't had any problems yet but, I'm a bit wary of such practice.

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(in reply to rsieminski)
       Post #: 26

"A spad is an ugly, heavy plane that does not fly ... - 7/15/2003 12:14:17 AM   
tiggerinmk



Posts: 1527
Joined: 12/30/2002
From: Milton Keynes, UNITED KINGDOM
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by nukes
have you never heard of someone flying thier balsa airplane into a tree? [/QUOTE]

Yup, did that twice with a Superstar 60. 2nd tree killed it, so I bought and assembled a LT-40 and transplanted the radio gear.

Still flying, no probs

Yes, I can appreciate that radio gear especially receivers get damaged, but there's no way am I going to ship off my JR receivers to HH eveytime I have a hard landing....

In resonse to the SPAD vibration comment: My Sturdy birdy has the receiver resting on an aluminum channel bolted to a PVC fuse with a 46LA strapped to the front.... I don't believe it is subject to any more vibration than it would be sitting in a balsa fuselage, but then its only an R600 and I doubt that I'll be putting it into that 1/4 scale CAP I might get one day....

_____________________________

If you can remain calm, while all around you is chaos...
then you probably haven't completely understood the seriousnes

(in reply to rsieminski)
       Post #: 27

"A spad is an ugly, heavy plane that does not fly ... - 7/15/2003 1:00:37 AM   
Jim_McIntyre



Posts: 2078
Joined: 4/5/2002
From: Claremont, ON, CANADA
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by tiggerinva
the receiver resting on an aluminum channel bolted to a PVC fuse with a 46LA strapped to the front.... I don't believe it is subject to any more vibration than it would be sitting in a balsa fuselage, but then its only an R600 and I doubt that I'll be putting it into that 1/4 scale CAP I might get one day.... [/QUOTE]

But... conventional mounting would have the receiver isolated in uncompressed foam rubber mounted in a balsa box. I would never think of tie wrapping it to the gear block.

And I do send my JR receivers to HH to be checked out after any landing hard enough to knock parts off my plane....in fact, my PCM10 from one of my helis is on it's way there right now.

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(in reply to rsieminski)
       Post #: 28

Crystals not a real problem - 7/15/2003 1:07:39 AM   
rlt55



Posts: 223
Joined: 5/25/2002
From: Woburn, MA, USA
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by Jim_McIntyre

I was looking at a SPAD built by a buddy just this weekend and I was wondering about the radio being mounted to what appeared to be an aluminum channel hard mounted to the engine. I was wondering how much vibration was transmitted to the servos and, especially the receiver which was tie wrapped to the same channel, compressing the foam more than I would like.... He did remark that he hadn't had any problems yet but, I'm a bit wary of such practice. [/QUOTE]

A lot of guys worry their crystal will go on them.
Working with crystals as an active Ham for 34 years was one of the reasons I was asked to investigate a motherboard crystal breakage problem at work. As a senior manufacturing test engineer at NEC, (before the plant closed) I was charged with finding out why crystal modules were failing on a large number of motherboards.

Off frequency and dead oscillators where found using a spectrum analyzer.
After dissection, the quarts disks were examined and photographed under a powerful microscope.

I also destroyed many standard crystals and clock modules to understand the mechanics of crystal damage.

What I found was a shock of about 20 Gs would destroy a crystal.
Drop a receiver crystal a 'hard' table surface from 4 to 6 inched and the shock on the crystal will likely exceed 20 Gs.
If you drop it from 5 feet onto a carpet, it will likely be okay.

At the MoBo factory, a worker was pouring the modules from their shipping tubes onto a shop bench. The 3 to 4 inch fall was damaging about 15% of the units.

I think you can put 20Gs of load on an RC crystal and it will still work okay, but if the 20Gs is applied instantly (In microseconds), damage can occur.

I don't think vibrations from an RC engine have a fast enough rise time to inflict enough rapid motion (shock) into a crystal to damage it. It's more of a sine wave action. Things that 'resonate' are damaged by sine type vibration.
If you get the engine to generate strong vibrations up around 70 Mhz, you might need extra good isolation to protect the crystal.

Mounting a receiver on a channel with a thin layer of foam to isolate it should work just fine.

If you doubt me, just wrap a tiny accelerometer in 1/8" of almost
any kind of soft shipping foam (or Hitec radio wrap) and throw
it on the floor. When you look at the G-plot, the fast rise time
of real (crystal breaking) shock just won't be there.

When I build a drop-test system to test packing materials
for shipping NEC disk drives, I found that the real 'shock' shows up when the impact is so great that it compresses the foam until it's as thin as paper.

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Rich<>

(in reply to rsieminski)
       Post #: 29

QUEBEC JIM? - 7/15/2003 1:23:23 AM   
boogerboy


 

Posts: 269
Joined: 6/1/2002
From: kuttawa, KY, USA
Status: offline 		Jim did U grow in quebec? LOL!

(in reply to rsieminski)
       Post #: 30

"A spad is an ugly, heavy plane that does not fly ... - 7/15/2003 1:26:01 AM   
Tattoo



Posts: 2124
Joined: 2/10/2002
From: Wichita, KS,
Status: offline 		Thanks rlt55!

Some people just don't think it's fair to install a radio and rig it out in 10 minutes. Actually I don't blame them, because it really isn't fair. Maybe that's the root of all this. I wonder if the paper crocery bag manufacturing companies think life is fair. My oldest Rx and it's original crystal have been zip-tied to more pieces of pipe and rails than I could ever count. Thousands of flights over the last 5 years.

(in reply to rsieminski)
       Post #: 31

Correction (and another plane name shot down!) - 7/15/2003 2:45:51 AM   
PianoManToo


 

Posts: 45
Joined: 3/17/2003
From: Kennewick, WA
Status: offline 		Okay, I do NOT want to open this up again (so maybe Chris can lock this right after I post it), but I need to make a correction to another post.

In the (now locked) post wherein a certain person slamdances SPADs and so forth, I mentioned that I flew a brand new Flik on the slope and since I hadn't yet rubber-banded the battery pack, I spewed some batteries (AA alkaline) along the slope and so forth and so on.

A well-meaning forum member then went on to point out that the Flik (in my post) was a balsa speed 400 electric plane.

That is not true. I was speaking of my Flik flying wing (similar to a Mugi). See: http://spadslopers.com (however, it might just be renamed by the time you get there!!).

The antagonist (that's a fair assessment! ) then posed the question as to the safety of my flying. Let me be very clear when I state that I RARELY fly a Flik flying wing (or any other plane for that matter) with the capability for parts to fly out and potentially hurt a bystander.

In the particular case I was talking about, I hadn't yet wrapped the battery pack in rubber bands and sealed the Flik's center opening with tape to thus prevent flying objects. Also, there was nobody else on the slope except me and the guest (who was in his motorhome at the time of said battery spewing).

I have taken the safety reminder to heart however, and will be extra careful to not fly in conditions where batteries could fly out upon impact.

Now...since the fellow forum member pointed out the Flik speed 400 ship (see: http://www.hobby-lobby.com/flik.htm), I went and looked up a review that was done on it and their name far precedes my naming of my adaptation of the Mugi flying wing, so...sigh...I get to come up with YET ANOTHER NAME!!! Oh well...rather do that than possibly face legal action based on a name!

Take care all and may we continue in this forum, happy, safe, and full of fun memories of this hobby!


_____________________________

Kevin B. Selby
[url]http://spadslopers.com[/url] <-- Free plans for SPAD slope gliders

(in reply to rsieminski)
       Post #: 32

"A spad is an ugly, heavy plane that does not fly ... - 7/15/2003 2:49:33 AM   
ChrisSpad



Posts: 1525
Joined: 4/19/2002
From: Cordova, TN,
Status: offline 		Okay folks. Since i like modding a nice happy forum, the spad bashing ends here and now.
I've put up with it for awhile, and i've had all of it i am going to stand for.
So, from now on, bash a spad in this forum, it gets either shut down, or your post removed.
If you don't like this, i suggest you go read the RCU general forum rules.


I'll save you the trouble:

[QUOTE]

HARASSMENT & FLAMING:
RCU members are not permitted to harass or "flame" other members. Please do not post or transmit any unlawful, harmful, threatening, abusive, harassing, defamatory, vulgar, obscene, profane, hateful, racially, ethnically or otherwise objectionable material of any kind, including, but not limited to, any material which encourages conduct that would constitute a criminal offense, violate the rights of others, or otherwise violate any applicable local, state, national or international law. Please note that this also includes the posting of taunts on a forum solely for the purpose of demeaning that forum's topic and/or members. [/QUOTE]


The last sentence says it all. I've seen plenty of taunts here in the last week. And it ends now.

_____________________________

No matter how many planes i plant, they just won't grow.
[link]http://www.chrisspad.com/planes/[/link]

(in reply to rsieminski)
       Post #: 33

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