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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/4/2010 7:40 PM   
jmohn


 

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Status: offline 		Here are the two KMP vs. real side-by-side:



These are about the same perspective. They look pretty close to me. Maybe a little long on the nose of the KMP one, but it's hard to tell with the different schemes. Good enough for me though!


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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/4/2010 7:47 PM   
drdoom



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Status: offline 		I cant wait till one of you guys come out with a operating Canopy set...Maybe Detail 4 Scale???

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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/4/2010 8:00 PM   
flytaildragger


 

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Status: offline 		Thanks for the critical view, and I quote,

"KMP scale models as arfs will offer the modeler a ante up in competition in our advanced and open classes."

No one ever said or claimed that our Arf's will be good to compete in expert class. This is for the exacting scale enthusiasts. I attended the 2009 Scalemasters finals in Wenatchee. I was particularly interested in the F4 Phantom because of it's scale detailing. I met with the placing pilot and plane in expert class, and he told me it took 9 months to create just the finish on the plane.

This quote is accurate and you will be able to compete in these classes in Scalemasters with our arfs.

< Message edited by flytaildragger -- 3/4/2010 9:35 PM >

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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/4/2010 8:03 PM   
flytaildragger


 

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Status: offline 		The dihedrahl looks inaccurate, but it is there. It is the photo of the plane the way it was taken.

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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/4/2010 8:14 PM   
jmohn


 

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Status: offline 		It looks great! These are two different models I think too if you look at the cowl there are some differences. Here's another photo that looks like the same model. It looks even closer to the KMP model.




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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/4/2010 8:46 PM  1 votes
Havoc


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: flytaildragger

Always a neighsayer out there. ,

[


Before the name calling begins or gets out of hand, there is a simple way to resolve any honest questions, and not make this an adversarial affair.
Just post the 3 vue drawing the model is based on. Or say where it can be found.

Thus, as promised, the modeler will have matching documentation if competition is his goal.

I have included a 3 view that illustrates my concerns.
The flap - aileron dimension of the model does not match any I have seen, nor does the fuselage shape behind the canopy.


But, I have not seen them all, and am quite willing to view and accept pics or accepted drawings that match your offering.

This way my observations can be corrected and you will have removed any doubts my questions may have raised.

Regards



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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/4/2010 9:08 PM   
flytaildragger


 

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Status: offline 		The pictures of the prototype represented is an introduction. It all takes time to put everything together. If the flaps and airlerons don't match identically, then there may be a flying reason for them to be engineered that way. Balancing scale accuracy and flying ability is a balancing act always facing new designs in model aviation. You can be assured that I will investigate your claims.

< Message edited by flytaildragger -- 3/4/2010 9:35 PM >

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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/4/2010 9:22 PM   
flytaildragger


 

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Status: offline 		Whew, the demands of the discerning modeler eh? An operational canopy. You can easily do this yourself with some of the scale accessories that are available. I don't think that the additional cost to OEM this would be widely accepted. We did OEM the hidden switch hatches, and I personally found that great. I made my own for some time cause I hated having the switches and charge receptacle on the outside of the airframe.

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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/4/2010 10:27 PM   
vertical grimmace



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Status: offline 		The issue is, There is a builder of the modeler rule.

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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/4/2010 10:50 PM  1 votes
P-51B



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quote:

ORIGINAL: vertical grimmace

The issue is, There is a builder of the modeler rule.



What, you mean this little ol' thing?:

6. Builder of Model: The CD shall make every reasonable effort to assure himself that each flier has completely “constructed‟ the model(s) he uses in competition, including the covering where used, with “constructed” to be interpreted as the action required to complete a model starting with no more prefabrication than the amount used in the average kit (“average kit” is interpreted by Control Line Aerobatics as a model that may consist of precut, unassembled parts or assembled (uncovered) subcomponents such as wings, horizontal and vertical stab, fuselage; requiring a few hours of assembly time and covering). Models which are completely prefabricated (“completely prefabricated” is interpreted as the model is ready to fly out of the box or in a few minutes (less than an hour) of assembly time.) and require only a few minutes (less than an hour) of unskilled effort for their completion shall be excluded from competition. (Control Aerobatics additionally interprets that any model, that is pre-covered in the box is excluded from competition). In the case of rubber-powered models (excluding Indoor duration models), commercially available balsa, plastic, and hardwood propellers may be used. Materials and design may be obtained from any source, including kits. The builder-of-the-model rule applies to every AMA event unless specifically noted otherwise in the rules governing that event.






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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/5/2010 12:11 AM   
jmohn


 

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Status: offline 		Never understood that one since most of the jet guys are flying all composite planes. All they do is paint and detail. Hardly any "real" building on those. Many of the other kits (Byron, etc.) have molded fuzes too. I guess if you have to construct the wings it's ok??? What about those foam core wings???

Whatever, just enjoy what you got and fly more



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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/5/2010 12:16 AM   
valr


 

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Status: offline 		Guys,

The US Scalemasters classes for Advanced and Open have both been setup to allow ARFs or 'non-builder of the model' entries. BOM rule, of course, still applies in Expert class. So what's the issue?

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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/5/2010 12:39 AM   
P-51B



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quote:

ORIGINAL: flytaildragger

The following is the followup of the Sig Series Warbirds that KMP will be producing this year, as follow;

The next plane is the FW190 D9 Dora 83''

Supermarine Spitfire 88''
A lot more of the more popular Warbirds as well, Keep checking with us on a regular basis for the progress.

A new release about every 1.5-2months. However logistics allows.



Mk IX???

How big was the Emil I see referenced after the original post was modified?????

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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/5/2010 1:19 AM   
jmohn


 

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Status: offline 		Even in expert class they allow the composite jets and molded fuzes. Maybe the guys selling them are the original mold makers? I don't know, but almost every jet is a composite and many of the props are now too.

Valr - exactly, just enter in open or advanced.


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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/5/2010 1:47 AM   
vertical grimmace



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Status: offline 		I thought I saw Expert mentioned as a class these aircraft could be entered into. Honestly, if you do not like to build, scale is not the event for you. unless you want to be a pilot in Team. Whatever. I just fly expert and I build my models. Whatever makes people happy. It would be a shame for someone to be mislead though and show up at a qualifier and have to fly a lower class than expected.

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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/5/2010 6:14 PM  1 votes
drdoom



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quote:

ORIGINAL: flytaildragger

Whew, the demands of the discerning modeler eh? An operational canopy. You can easily do this yourself with some of the scale accessories that are available. I don't think that the additional cost to OEM this would be widely accepted.


You may be right in the cost issue But I think that it looks to be worthy of the modelers effort to install one. the other thing it needs is the rather large hinge bracket on the bottom on the rudder attached to the fuse. that is an easy fix. I Have tracking Number on the ESM version. If anyone is interested Ill post Pix in a New thread...


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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/5/2010 8:36 PM  1 votes
flytaildragger


 

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Status: offline 		Well, Mr. Havoc, KMP has taken your views to heart. We are going to modify the area behind the canopy to match the drawings and change the flap configuration to scale representation. The prototype pictured was just that, a prototype and Andrew Kondor has the desire to offer that "Model of Distinction" All production models will be modified to accomodate these changes. There will however, be a short shipping delay to accomodate these changes to those that have ordered. It is our desire to deliver those expectations to the best of our ability.

< Message edited by flytaildragger -- 3/5/2010 11:22 PM >

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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/5/2010 10:40 PM   
jmohn


 

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Status: offline 		Wow...that's great! I know it's been something Andrew has wanted to do with the old designs too. It's great that he can do this now and make something super nice. Keep it up!


Jeff


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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/6/2010 8:21 AM   
ZERO-322


 

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Status: offline 		talk about being in tune with the customer and responding to feedback ! I am very much impressed sir ! to listen to a customers wishes and needs and then delivering on the goods ? this is great business ! and I am sure you all will do well , you have won me over with this display and have gained a new customer for sure ! I eagerly await new offering by KMP

Mike

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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/6/2010 1:21 PM  1 votes
LDM


 

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Status: offline 		Great responce GUs and Andrew , But I must say that if a person is really going to be critical of a arf due to scale fedelity I would suggest (if truely interested in the model) is to purchase the model and make the mods .
Bashing arfs is fun and has become a new class in itself on RCU , it even has its own section on rcscalebuilders .
As far as a sliding canopy , you can make one in a very easy and inexpensive manner .
Precision makes long arm air cylender for about $16 thru $25 dollars depending on how much movement you need , I am useing one on my Fw190 and have about 6" ov movement (planned in that manner ) .
I cut the rear deck off and gave it movement .
I have the original KMP corsair , again a great starting point , I will cut wheel wells to scale and add doors ect , I think the new breed of ARFs is an exciting time for Warbirds fans and those to who to make the arfs there own with mods and many more upgrades

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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/6/2010 5:36 PM  1 votes
Havoc


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: flytaildragger

Well, Mr. Havoc, KMP has taken your views to heart. We are going to modify the area behind the canopy to match the drawings and change the flap configuration to scale representation.


You're quite welcome. That was a thank you wasn't it?

I would like to take all the credit for the observations I posted, but I was not the first.
I am glad that those observations helped you get closer to your stated goal of "true scale".

This is a positive result, and a feather in the KMP cap. I bet you sell more models as a result of Andrew's response. I have 6 and may make it 7.

As for the "just buy it and fix it" advice in a post above- Why would you do that if the manufacturer is willing to make corrections based on legitimate observations?
At least give the manufacturer a chance to address any issues.

Again, kudos to KMP. I think everybody wins.



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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/6/2010 5:55 PM  1 votes
LDM


 

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Status: offline 		Dont misunderstand I am glad that they will tweek the plane , my point is that you never going to get exact scale in arfs , but there getting better and better .
If you check out the CMP Zero post , the guys are doing some amazing things to that stock arf .
NOt all the suppliers can fix every detail nor will they be willing if they have gone to production or final mould state .
I hope these companys keep the warbirds coming , its an amazing time for the arf warbird fan and I cant wait to see the new KMP Dora !!!!

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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/7/2010 6:46 PM   
WarbirdFlyer404


 

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Status: offline 		Will the KMP model T-28 have the working gear doors as the VQ models T-28 and will the pricing be in the same range? As there model it runs 400$ and looks nice as well but you can only mount up on this up to a 40cc as the KMP you can go up to 62cc. They are now taking a 50$ deposit for reserving one of the first of there production runs. Im trying to decide which one I want or if maybe one of each.

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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/10/2010 9:07 PM   
Magnum RC



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Status: offline 		I hope the retracts will be designed to accept the new electric worm gear drives that are available.  Scale like retracts are a definite plus.


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RE: The New KMP Signature Series Warbirds - 3/10/2010 9:16 PM   
flytaildragger


 

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Status: offline 		Warbird, VQ is also a dealer of KMP. He offers several brands of Warbirds hence a great place to shop. In answer to your questions, the KMP Signature Series planes are going to be more money than the other brand. We have invested in details that most of the other arf's don't have in this price range. As far as gear doors, they are included, but I don't believe there are nose gear doors on either.

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