Rob68

I picked myself up an Aerobird 3 today & this thing is SWEET!!! My Skyfly was a PIG compared to this thing! This is a plane that will "loop at will". I couldn't get my Skyfly to loop to save my life!!! For $9 more than what I paid for my Skyfly, this is a far superior aircraft. I'm gonna maiden her tomorrow & I can't wait! The control surface throws are lightning fast with 3-wire servos & STEEL comtrol rods. I would definitely rec'd this plane to a friend over a Skyfly anyday!

raginredneck93

I find it curious that you say your Aerobird 3 flies so much better, then you say that you're going to maiden it tomorrow. [sm=confused.gif]

I have no doubt that there's superior products on the market, even superior products for the same or marginally higher price, but the Sky Fly has been on the market for how many years now with no changes? The Aerobird 3? Perhaps Hobbico will introduce the Sky Fly 2 someday and then we'll see how they stack up. When I bought my Sky Fly 2 years ago it was, in my humble opinion, the best value for the money among the RTF trainers that I'd seen. The Aerobird was on the market at the time in two or three different versions and I recognized that it was superior in a lot of ways, but it was also priced considerably higher, and I didn't think much of the landing gear setup or the tx.

And just for the record, I heard all sorts of reports about how the Aerobird Swift was soooooooo much better than any other RTF trainer out there . . . . . then a friend bought one and I flew it. I won't go into bashing, but I will say that I wasn't impressed. I was even less impressed after he'd had a few minor mishaps with the thing and it was no longer flyable due to the flimsy wing and tail section being totally destroyed. Parts were more expensive, the tx was a joke, and on his third flight the throttle lever literally fell out of it and he had to get a new one. In the manufacturer's defense however, they did send him a new tx right away, but that didn't change the fact that it shouldn't have broken so easily in the first place especially on a plane marketed for its durability.

Don't take it wrong, I'm not meaning to sound all defensive or anything, but this IS the Sky Fly forum after all. I have the highest hopes that you'll be nothing but pleased with your Aerobird 3, and judging from what I know about the entire Aerobird line which in my experience has been an excellent product, Swift excluded, I'm sure it's a first class product especially for the money. You may however want to check out the Aerobird 3 forum for future posts. Obviously everyone here likes our Sky Flies for whatever reason. Maybe we're just gluttons for punishment, LOL.

What really matters is that everyone is having fun flying, and hopefully using these planes for their intended purpose, which is to learn to fly as cheaply, quickly, and easily as possible. Take it from a well worn modeler and flyer, no matter how many planes you build, modify, or fly in your lifetime, no matter if you go on to be a world champion giant scale aerobatics pilot or never fly anything but trainers, provided you learn to fly with it your first plane will always hold a special place in your heart no matter how much of a turd it was. I still have fond memories of a battered old second hand Superstar .40 with bumper stickers all over it to patch the holes in the covering, and I still have what's left of the wing hanging on the wall in my shop. It looked like crap, but I probably had more fun with that old piece of junk than any other plane I've ever owned. I hope that someday you all have the same memories of your first planes, no matter if they were Sky Flies, or Aerobirds, or otherwise. [sm=wink_smile.gif]

RTice

My Feedback: (9)

Good luck with your new A-bird.

No harm done, but the Rage is right, this is the Skyfly forum. We are talking about our experiences with the FLY. I purchased mine after comparing it to most of the hobbyzone line (a-bird, commander, firebird), comparing the reviews on this site, etc.

I have not been dissapointed. My neigbor did the same...and ended up with the same plane on recommendation of one of the seasoned hobby shops here.

I don't know about you folks, but the weather in the Houston area is prime for flying today. Weather bug predicts 0 wind between 11-5pm. unfortunately, I have to do some major lawn work first. Heading out now.

Good luck.

Rob68

Sorry, guys-I guess I got a little excited. I haven't flown her yet, but I meant that physically the planes fuse is a lot thinner & the nose isn't quite as long & it "looks" to me that it ought to be able to loop better. My Skyfly will always be the plane I learned the basics on. Man............I need to stay off the computer when I'm drinking!!! The ol' tact switch was turned off & I realize now that this was like going to a Chevy forum singing the praises of Ford.

raginredneck93

No harm done Rob, and I do admit that the Horizon stuff is superior in a lot of ways. I also have to admit that I haven't checked out the Aerobird 3 yet, but if it's got that same crappy one stick tx that all the other ones have I'm not interested, LOL. Just kidding, actually I know a few seasoned modelers that use 1 stick 3 channels for sailplanes and they work just fine. The Sky Fly tx is no peach either, but at least it's built in standard configuration so a newbie won't have a bunch of "getting used to" to do when they transition to more advanced planes and standard radio gear.

Over the years, it's been interesting watching the rivalry between Horizon and Great Planes/Hobbico. They both make some excellent products, as well as some complete turds, LOL. I've got a good selection of products from both companies and I'd never go so far as to crown one or the other the winner. Horizon seems to always have the "cool factor", Great Planes/Hobbico stuff tends to be built a little more durable but also heavier, and it seems that with every version of a particular product that they introduce they swap places on one factor or another. I do know that I haven't had anything but bad luck with Electrifry ESC's, nor have any of my flying buddies. We won't use the dreaded "yellow" speed controls for anything but paperweights. Normally I lean toward Castle or the low price offerings from our Chinese friends on Ebay, but on my latest project I decided to give Horizon a chance. We'll see how the 2 E-Flite 25's in my P38 fare as soon as the wind quits blowing at the flying field.

phaetn

Thanks for the replies, folks, and for the tips about removing the spinner. Sure enough, just some gentle pressure on the two tabs and the prop slid right off.

Unfortunately I have to wait until next Friday for the fuselage to come in at my local hobby shop. I can order from the U.S. more quickly online, but, unfortunately, the international shipping fees (especially for an oversized part like a wing) ends up costing much more than the parts themselves. I'll just have to wait!

It's funny, but I really never noticed just how gusty local wind conditions were at this time of year until I started thinking about flying an R/C plane. I wonder what things will be like in the winter... I've seem some vids on Youtube of flying when there's lots of snow on the ground and it looks like fun.

Cheers and thanks again,
phaetn

raginredneck93

It IS fun, but COLD! I used to fly off of skis back when I first learned to fly, but I haven't done it in years. I'm kind of a fair weather flyer these days, LOL.

And you're not just kidding about noticing the wind. It's kind of funny actually. Lots of times I'll be standing around with a bunch of non flyers and someone will make a comment about what a nice day it is only to have me reply, "Yeah not bad, but too damn windy", LOL. They just look at me like I'm a moron because usually the wind is no more than 10 MPH which is a slight breeze to them, but enough to keep most of my fleet grounded unless I can find a runway pointing straight into it, LOL. I also catch myself checking out every flag and windsock that I pass no matter if I'm on my way to work or the flying field. It's just a habit.

RTice

My Feedback: (9)

Ditto, Ragin and Phaetn. I forget who I am talking to in casual conversation and I always end up commenting on the wind. In the past, I would have LOVED the kind of breezes we are getting now, but lately it has been in the 10ish mph range and that just puts a frown on my face. Needless to say, I spend a lot of time on weatherbug.com :-)

I just got from maidening my glowire rig on one of my skyflys. It sails! I flew it once just to make sure it was sky-worthy, and then put it back in the truck until my neighbor gets his ready for some real night flying. maybe tomorrow night. the conditions were beautiful this evening.

I put the skyfly away and pulled out my slo-v for a maiden flight. After several quick emergency landings I finally got the thing balanced. I flew it around for a while and then brought her in for a beauty of a landing.

raginredneck93

I love your Sky Fly night flyer! I never thought of night flying the Sky Fly, but I do have a Mugi Evo made from translucent coroplast with LED's inside and light ropes around the leading edge and over the fins. Morgan has pics of what they look like on his website, mugi.co.uk. If you use bright enough LED's and enough of them, the entire plane glows like neon. Another trick that we've used is to bust open glow sticks and smear the glow stuff inside all over the outside of a plane. A little messy but works good.

Night flying is a blast, but far more difficult than most people think until they try it. I also have a Pitts Python foamy that I built from foamyfactory.com plans that's almost done. Then intention for that one is to make it a night flyer and I think it'll work well. There's always plenty of night flying at our club's fly in every year, with the most popular act being my friend and his Sceadu .50 heli all dressed out in lights doing a little 3D action in the dark. Those lit up blades look mighty cool when they're lighting up the runway in an inverted hover just inches off the ground. Lots of foamies and T-Rex 450's, and one year the owner of our LHS showed up with a SIG Rascal 120 all decked out in light rope. Now THAT was something to see!

RTice

My Feedback: (9)

yep, I saw the lighted mugi, they look phenomenal. It is one of the best I've seen. I don't wish to spend the $ though.
Thanks for the comments. I didn't get to go flying last night. :-(

raginredneck93

MONEY?! [sm=confused_smile.gif]


RC aircraft don't get much cheaper than a Mugi Evo. Of course the flight gear costs a little, but a person can go as mild or wild as they want to in that department. I fly mine on $10 motors, $15 speed controls, and $4 servos. If you think that's expensive, do yourself a favor and stay away from helicopters! LOL

RTice

My Feedback: (9)

hey Ragin, you are right. I was also looking at the "bug" kits and must have gotten them confused. The RTF bug kits were in the $150 and above range. Not that 150 is out of this world.

The mugi does look reasonable at second glance. I don't have a useable radio that I know of, so my next radio will probably be a 2.4 ghz...and there is where you start putting a dent in your wallet.

All I have so far is the radio on the skyfly, an esky lama heli, and a slo-v? Are any of those convertible to the mugi?

raginredneck93

Possibly the Slo V, but none of the others for sure. Any radio that supports elevon mixing will work, and I have to admit that I don't know about the Slo V radio. If it uses a standard rx and servos, you could always add an external elevon mixer. 2.4 gig is definitely a wise choice in my opinion, I run Spektrum gear myself. I bought a DX6 shortly after they came out, and now fly a DX7 for about the past year. I love my Spektrum radios, but I have to admit that their servos are garbage. Once again, IMHO. The cost of radios keeps going down every year, and the value seems to keep going up at the same rate. A DX6 can easily be had for under $200. Just a few years ago a radio like that would've cost much more.

One trick you might consider is to watch Ebay. I picked up a single stick 3 channel awhile back (I have no idea why because I have absolutely NO use for it, LOL), for $4. It's a Hitec Neon with elevon mixing capabilities so it would work for a Mugi. Also, there's always old 4 channel rigs around for sale dirt cheap, some of which even have adjustable endpoints and with the addition of an inexpensive onboard V-Tail/Elevon mixer like the ones that GWS sells, would work even better. I even picked up a Hitec Flash 5 computer tx off of Ebay one time for $30. Just be careful. There seems to be a lot of folks on Ebay selling "new in the box" tx's without rx's or servos and for some reason they're getting almost the price of a full system. I've seen loads of DX6's go for upwards of $150 for a tx only. When you figure that's without $60 worth of servos and a $50 rx, it's not such a great deal. I think a lot of these are people buying a complete system, robbing the flight pack, then selling the tx on Ebay and practically recouping their entire cost because people are dumb and don't read/think. It's a heck of a way to get a free set of airborne gear, but unfortunately I'm not dishonest enough to do it myself, LOL.

raginredneck93

Oh, and one more thing. Although the Mugi kits are priced quite fairly, you can scratch build one for pennies. I buy full 4X8 sheets of 2mm Coroplast from a local sign supply shop for about $10. That's enough Coroplast to build about 9 Mugis. That's a little over a dollar a plane. Can't beat that price, and they're so darn tough that I'm still flying the first one that I built almost 2 years ago.

RTice

My Feedback: (9)

Hey RedNeck...from Big Sky.
Thanks for the tips. yeah, I used to work with coroplast. I am not feeling inclined to buy/build one right now, but you gave me and others some good insight.

About the radios, do you see any big differences between the dx6i series and the dx7? I heard one guy say he is moving back to the dx6i (from the dx7) due to programming issues.

Rob

raginredneck93

To be honest, I haven't monkeyed with the DX6i yet. I know a couple people that have them, but I haven't heard much about them yet. One thing that I don't like is the fact that they only have a 4 cell battery. It makes them a lot lighter, but at the expense, IMHO, of making them feel phony and toy like. I say use an 8 cell only run it 4S2P for twice the capacity. One thing that was accomplished with the 4 cell battery however, is that the balance is a lot better than the older Spektrum systems, and the one that I actually fondled felt really good in my hand. The DX6i isn't "bottom heavy" like my DX6 and DX7. The sticks were smooth, the gimbals tight, the ergonomics are awesome, but as far as programming I honestly have no idea. I wouldn't be surprised if the DX6i has a few programming options that the DX7 doesn't considering that it's a newer radio and most likely more advanced, however I haven't had any programming issues with my DX7 at all. It seems mighty straightforward to me, and I've been able to do pretty much everything I've ever needed to do with it. One thing that I don't like about my DX7 however, (it still hasn't been remedied on the DX6i, or most JR radios for that matter), is the fact that there's no proportional 5th, 6th or 7th channels. Most Futaba radios have sliders on the sides/rear that can be set to run proportional flaps, speed brakes, ect. Everything on the Spektrums is on switches, either two or three position, but no sliders. The DX7 has two rocker switches that can be set to, say, lower flaps in small increments, but they're extremely cumbersome to operate. As I mentioned however, the DX6i is no better in this respect. It does however have a sensible trainer switch location which is yet another area where the two previous versions fell a little short. I think it's more a matter of personal choice myself. If you only need 6 channels, the DX6i is no doubt an awesome radio, especially for the money. I also happen to fly glow helis however, so the 7th channel on my DX7 is quite useful. I've recently found myself wishing for an eighth. Perhaps 9 channel JR 9303 2.4 is in my future.

lambodave

Hi raginredneck93, I 'maidened' my twin-motor skyfly this weekend - Didn't go very well !!! As sson as it became airbourne, she 'yawed' to the right and hit the desk. No damaged - tired it a couple more time - same thing. Went home to re-tested CG and balance. All was OK. I thought it may have something to do with the counter-roatating props (one normal / one reverser pitch). So I put on two normal props, changed the wires, so both motors spin the same way. Tooked it out again, still did the same thing, to the same side. This has me thinking ... Is it the airframe, are an imbalance of the motors ? I removed the wings, and suspended from washing-line. I then applied power to both motors and it did start to spin towards the way it 'flew'. My question is, how 'balanced' must the motors be in a twin-engine set-up ? They are both new motors, running the same ESC, and spinning the same props (powered from the one 3-cell battery). If 'suspened' on a washing-line, at the CG point, should the plane not spin at all ? ie - should it simply pull itself forward and hold itself there ? Should I run both motors from a single ESC ? This is my first twin-motor set-up, and don't know how 'balanced' the motors must be. I could play with the throttle-mixing so they become more balanced. This outing still ended well, as I got my 'other' single Skyfly with me and put 4 x 2200mah lipos through her. No wind, sunny skies - GREAT !!! Did some touch & go's and mastered landing a step or two away from where I was standing. Did a few sub 4-feet passes ... My few hours of flying will make my working week ahead alittle easier ... I'd love to re-try to twin-motor set-up again next weekend, so any advice will be good !!!

RTice

My Feedback: (9)

Hey Lambodave, regarding the twin motors.... Do the other planes that use them operate on twin ESC's? I don't believe so, but it might be something to check out. That is really strange. It certainly appears that one motor is pushing more air than the other, doesn't it? If it is not too much trouble, switch the motors and see if you get the opposite effect. At least that would narrow it down.

Regarding the lipos, are you running them on a stock setup, or thru a brushless motor and other non-stock electronics (ESC, servos, etc)?

Rob

raginredneck93

You can run two brushed motors off of the same ESC, but brushless have to have their own. I've read about people running two brushless motors off of a single speed control, but the results have been mixed and unreliable at best. A year or so ago I actually read about a company that was marketing a micro twin motor setup that was designed to run off of a single ESC, but once again I never heard any more about it so I don't know how it worked out. The problem comes in on start up. As long as both motors start at exactly the same time, all is good, but if one motor hesitates on start up then the other one will run and the one that hesitates will just sit there and buzz. The other problem is with wire length. I've extended the battery side wires several times with good results, but not so much so on the motor side. I've been told by people with much more electronics knowledge than myself that as long as you make them all exactly the same length it'll work just fine, but I've done so and had issues especially with high kv inrunners. The pulse rate on those type of motors is just too fast I guess, and longer wires give it more time to get jumbled up between the ESC and the motor.

You are right however, the motors have to pull evenly in order to work so your "string" test is definitely applicable. Here's another test you can use to get a bit more info:

Isolate your motors one at a time and run them on an amp meter. Is one motor drawing more amps than the other? That would tell me that you have something amiss as they both should be drawing about the same. You could perform a similar test if you had access to a tachometer. Just run the motors up and tach them (if you're using props, I thought you said originally that this was a ducted fan but I could be thinking of something else), they should both be spinning the same RPM at any given throttle setting. If they're NOT, then try unplugging the ESC's from the rx and plugging them one at a time into the throttle channel. Repeat the test. If the results stay the same, then I'd say it's a problem with a motor or ESC. If they both turn the same speed/draw the same current plugged in one at a time, then I'd say the problem is in the programming. Trying your string test with a Y harness instead of seperate rx channels might give you similar results. If one pulls different on a Y harness then there's definitely an issue with the motor or ESC. I forget which ESC's you said you were using, but if they're programmable make certain that they're programmed the same. Some ESC's are programmable for throttle curve, response rate, slow start, ect. and that would definitely cause you problems. Another possible issue is total amp draw. If you're trying to pull to much from the battery, you could be throwing one motor or the other into throttle cut. I've ran into that problem on my P38 already. When I was bench testing it all was well until I tried a full throttle runup after the battery had drained a bit. The motors would alternately go into throttle cut which made the plane do a funky washing machine dance all over my work bench, LOL. One more question. Are you running a single battery or a separate one for each motor? If you're running separate batteries one could be a little stronger than the other, causing one motor to have a bit more power. If you're running a single battery, are both sets of wires exactly the same length? Probably wouldn't make much difference, but could definitely cause problems in some cases. Try isolating the motors one at a time and let me know what happens. Hopefully this problem turns out to be something simple but I wouldn't try flying again until we get it resolved. Just stick with it, twin motor models are more complicated, that's why you don't see as many of them as singles, and that's also why they're more fun. I'm thinking about a C130 myself. If I can get two motors to work, then I say it's time to try 4.

lambodave

Thanks guys for your response - It's dark now (11pm and about to watch the F1 monaco race on TV).
raginredneck93 - You were right, I was planning a ducted fan version, but found the two ducted fans I bought didn't have much pull, so I've gone with props now.
I will try throttles on a Y harness (bypassing all mixing). I ran a single battery & 2 ESC - all using stock wire lenghts (No extensions).
I'll also do an 'AMP' test of each motor.
I'll keep you posted on my progress ...

phaetn

Well, I finally got the ESC and other parts switched over to the new fuselage. It was pretty much a rebuild but now everything looks shiny and new.

The one thing that surprised me was how long it took to actually thread the nylon control lines through the tailboom so I could connect them to the servos. I had to undo the plastic mounting bracket ahead of the boom, plus the dividing screw within the boom itself, then carefully feed line through. It took quite a few attempts and was much more time consuming than working on any other component. It seems to me, short of tying a knot on a previous cable to pull a new one through (which I couldn't do in this case since it was a new boom) one always had to go about it the way I did it.

Any tips for speeding up the process? I tried inserting a needle through the boom's eyelets with the nylon line attached just to give it some weight, but it didn't really end up working (either the needle was too big for the opening in the boom, or the needle's own eyelet was too small to receive the nylon line). Perhaps some thin gauge wire that could fit though the apertures easily, but have enough rigidity to be guided would be helpful, and then the control line could be attached to that and pulled back through.

How do you guys go about it?

Anyway, the Slyfly's ready to go, I'm just waiting for a weekend without gusts to go out and fly again.

Thanks and cheers,
phaetn

raginredneck93

Glad to hear that you got it back together. I have just as much fun working on/building planes as I do flying them. Hopefully your situation is similar.

I've never had to thread mine from scratch, always just tied them to the ends of the old ones, but were I to do such a thing I think I'd just tie them to the end of a piece of music wire long enough to reach all the way through. Failing that a person could use a weight, but as you mention finding a weight small enough to pass through the holes yet heavy enough to pull the lines might be a trick. I've always got a good selection of various sizes of music wire in my shop, so most likely that's the method I'd end up with.

lambodave

Tried the twin-motor skyfly again today (y-harness of THR channel) - Still no good, same thing. Yawed to the right. Took plane down to my Fathers who checked rpm of motors using his digital tacho device. At full throttle with 3-bladed 6x4 props installed, one did 11,400 while the other did 11,890 (almost 500 rpm more). The real problem is with the 'rpm curves', as they cross-over near mid throttle. Regardless of throttle mixing (when configured) I still can't get them in tune. Both motors are the same brand & Kv rating, but one had some use, the other is brand new. same goes for ESC's - could this be a problem? should I buy another brand new motor ? What the chances of getting two similar performing motors ?

raginredneck93

OK, now we know why it's yawing, now we need to figure out why one motor is running faster than the other.

I assume you're running them both off of a single battery? If that's the case, then we know it isn't the battery. One possible test, if you have two digital volt meters, would be to hook up a set of test leads to the solder joints directly on each ESC, run up the motors, and see if both ESC's are getting the same voltage under load. Do yourself a favor and go to Radio Shack or similar and get a set of clip on test leads, or make some or whatever, but don't try to hold the wires or it'll never work and you'll likely hurt yourself, LOL

Barring that, you could also amp test each motor individually, which could also point you in the right direction. Which motor is turning faster, the new one or the used one? The reason I ask is because if the older motor is turning faster, it may be that the new one isn't broken in yet. If the newer motor is the one turning faster, there may be an issue with a bearing on the older motor. If the slower motor is drawing more amps than the faster one, this would also point to a bearing issue as it's needing more power to overcome the resistance in the bearings. Getting another new motor might fix your problem, or you might wind up with the same issue all over again. If it turns out that there's absolutely nothing wrong with either motor, then it may be just a manufacturing variance and you could likely try 100 motors before you found two that matched. If it's a break in issue, then simply bench running the new motor, or putting new bearings in the old one might fix the problem. If it's a manufacturing variance however, you're likely just screwed other than getting another motor or two and hoping you get two that match.

Did you perhaps try swapping the propellers and taching the motors? If it was a prop issue, then the results should move with the props. The same logic should work with the ESC's as well. Swap them and see if the results stay the same or move with the ESC's. That way you can at least eliminate some variables. If you swap props, get the same results, then swap ESC's and get the same results, then we know for a fact that the issue is with the motor and can investigate that avenue farther. If the problem moves with the props or ESC, then we know that one of those is the issue. You say that the problem is with the throttle curves, which would point me in the direction of an ESC problem. It would stand to reason that if it were a bearing issue or otherwise with a motor, then one should be lagging behind all the time, not just at certain points on the throttle curve. It's not so much a "problem" with the ESC, just an inherent variance that would normally never be a problem. If it were a single motor model it wouldn't be an issue, only when you try to get two of them to work together.

Try swapping props, tach it, then swap ESC's and tach it, and let me know what happens there. Hopefully we end up with some info instead of more head scratching. On the bright side, if you think this is difficult, try getting two glow engines to work together, LOL.

phaetn

Flew the rebuilt Skyfly. I was really getting the hang of it! I picked today because it had rained in the morning so the winds were very calm for the first time in about a week. By the time I got the the field, both kids (one three, the other one) and my wife were asleep in the car, so I headed out on my own.

The sun was starting to come out by the time I was airborne, and there was a bit of wind. I have a lot of experience with flight sims, plus have been in small aircraft a fair amount, too, so I have the hang of "altitude is life" (e.g. space to recover), plus the whole idea of "energy" (swapping speed for alt or vice versa).

I had one little crash, nothing too serious, checked out the plane and all its control surfaces, and then sent it up again. During the flight the wind started to pick up and the gusts were getting stronger, popping up the plane in a headwind, and generally pushing it around, I was REALLY getting the hang of it by the second time, and could make adjustments for the gusts, power on for a headwind, power off for a tail wind, anticipate and counter skids, do some swoops and that kind of stuff. For orientation I basically was just flying big circles so I wouldn't get confused with crossed controls, but did I big figure eight too. I was having a lot of fun and then the kids came out of the car. I lost concentration a bit to look at them, let the wind push me a little too far afield as the plane was hit by a cross-wind downwind of me (rookie mistake) and..... I flew it into a tree! DOH! I'm discovering how hard it is to judge distances: I thought it wasn't going to be a problem and I was going to clear them!

I wasn't going to climb the tall spruce (it's about fifty feet up) with its still wet and slippery branches. Even if I'm dumb enough to fly into a tree, at least I'm smart enough to not risk my neck for a $100 airplane!!

Happily, I can borrow a neighbour's long extendable pole for getting down icicles off roofs. Hopefully I won't prang the plane too much as it falls out of the tree!!

Cheers,
phaetn

EDIT: Managed, with the 30 or so foot pole, plus climbing up some of the lower branches to get it down. It seems quite unscathed, and branches slowly let it come down from its height and I even caught it on the way down. Maybe I'll fly again tomorrow.

Whats it like to fly in the rain? Is it too hard on the planes and components?