RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

Great to see you got it back in the air. I had a few battles with the wind early one in my skyfly career :-), so I make it a point not to push it with the wind anymore. It can be done successfully, but it is just a big battle with such a light plane.

I've never flown in the rain...only at the beginning of one. Most of your components are covered on the skyfly, so you may get some water in the motor (from the prop hitting the rain), but other than that, you are probably ok.

stay out of the trees!!!

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

Flying in the rain? [X(]

Probably wouldn't be too bad on the plane, but murder on you and your transmitter, LOL. If it rained hard enough, you might lose visibility pretty easy. I'd have to want to fly pretty darn bad to chance it in the rain. Just relax, the sun'll come out tomorrow my friend. :D

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

Thanks for the 'logical' testing steps - I will do these soon.
On a more 'positive' note, I did enjoy taking my single-brushless motor out for an hour yesterday. I spend a few minutes the night before, installing a ZLog Altitude 'data-logger' in my skyfly - very simple to install (just plugs into un-used servo port on receiver. I have atteched an image of the down-loaded data (represented in a graph). My single brushless skyfly has a climb-rate of 15.45 feet/sec (shown in first peak on graph). I levelled out at 541 feet and flow for a bit before 'knowning' I was higher than the FOG !!! The skylfy 'silouteeted' above the fog until I got out the other side - little worrying as I didn't know if I'd lose complete sight or not !!! Anyway, she came out the other side and I dropped it down to had a great time. I later went up to 402 feet and kept under the fog. The ZLog is a very small/neat unit and can be configured to 'mark' positions on the graph from controller input - ideal for aerial Photograhpy, as you could mark as each photo is taken and then know the exact height they were taken at.

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

Okay, good advice. :) I'll see what conditions are like today to see if I can get up in the air again. I've been waiting on tenterhooks since last week after I got all the parts in and fixed the plane. I know I can get the hang of this thing and really want to actually have nice, successful flared landing on pavement rather than flying into a museum or tree. ;)

My wife could barely stop laughing as she took this with a cell-phone camera:

http://ca.geocities.com/[email protected]_620x480.jpg

Cheers,
phaetn

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

Phaeten: Yep, as my wife would say, " a grown man and his toys." She doesn't know what she is missing.

Lambodave: That is a pretty neat device. How much does it cost?

Rob

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

Gotta love data loggers lambodave. Our modern electronic gizmos definitely add a new dimension to aeromodeling. The Oracle from Medusa Research is one that I've been wanting to order. It'll tell you your power system's actual amp draw in flight and graph it out for you if you hook it up to a computer. Eagle Tree Systems has a similar device that can either be read from a small digital readout that you plug in after a flight which will tell the max amp draw for the flight, or you can plug it in to a computer for a graph of the entire flight. Very useful to see what the actual power demands of a motor/prop combo are, as static testing may be a good guideline but can also be very deceiving. Props unload/load in flight differently than they do on the bench, and this is especially true when talking about ducted fans, helicopters, and boats. Some aircraft props, and all boat props or ducted fans will be in a stall or state of cavitation when they're not moving and being fed air or water from the intake side, so the static amp draw will be deceptively low. The current demands will ramp up sharply as they begin to be fed by ram effect as the speed of the vehicle increases, as will their power output. Likewise, other props such as those used on 3D aircraft, will have deceivingly high amp draw figures on the bench, as these props tend to unload significantly in flight. I'm not 100% positive about the Oracle, but I know that with the Eagle Tree device you can also hook up sensors for altitude, 2 or 3 temp sensors for motors, batteries, ect., and possibly even airspeed but I'm not too sure about that one either. I guess I need to do some more research before I actually buy one, LOL, but we were playing with an Eagle Tree yesterday at the flying field and even with only the little LCD readout it's quite a useful tool. I just wish I would've had my laptop along, then we could've really seen what it could do. I also have a flying buddy that's got a wristwatch with a built in altimeter that will log max altitude. More than once he's simply put his watch inside his plane and took it up just to see how high it went, LOL.

On a side note, I really hope that you get your differential thrust issues ironed out. I flew my first twin yesterday and it was a blast! I'm used to flying single motor taildragger aircraft so a counter rotating twin with trike gear was an interesting change of events. The most impressive thing for me was the takeoff run. Instead of fighting the rudder to steer the aircraft down the runway, the P38 just shot off the blocks straight and true, with little if any rudder input necessary to keep it going straight. I'm also used to the fact that taildraggers tend to try to take off by themselves when they build enough speed, but with the trike gear on the P38 I had to make the plane rotate in order to leave the ground. This made for a long, straight, scale looking takeoff run that was loads of fun. Even though the P38 could've left the ground in 15 feet or so, I was having so much fun with the takeoffs that I tended to use as much as possible of our club's 450' runway before rotating. Seeing it accelerate slowly until it was screaming down the runway at breakneck speed, then slowly rotate and begin to climb like a real warbird was quite a thrill. The first landing was a piece of cake, but for some reason on the second one I misjudged the distance and set it down in the grass at the far side of the runway, duh. I felt like a moron, but two or three other guys do the same thing almost every time we fly so I know it's not just me. We recently repaved our runway and haven't repainted the stripes yet so there's nothing for a reference point. Makes things a little tricky. Anyway, the only damage was a landing gear leg mount that popped out of the foam. A little foam safe CA and it's good as new with only a small scuff mark on the bottom of the right engine cowl as a souvenir. In the future I need to be more careful of where I come out of my turn to final, and also remember to keep the speed up and fly the thing to the runway. This plane also has a little higher wing loading than I'm used to and likes to land a little on the hot side like most warbirds do. Overall it's a great flying aircraft and quite a conversation piece at the field just as I'm sure your twin Sky Fly will be once you get it ironed out. I'd love to see video of it flying when you get it working. Unfortunately the battery died in my digital video camera and I haven't gotten around to replacing it yet, so I have no video of the P38 flying. I did get a picture of it on the bench at the flying field though before the first flight.

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

Hi raginredneck93 - Good to see your P38 is finished and flying good. If only all twin-brushless set-ups were easy !!! Did you have any issues with your motors ? Are they both brand new, new esc,etc ? Is it always an 'art' to get to matched motors ? Did you have to play with the 'throttle' mixing to get both motors pulling the same ? I don't know if setting up 2 x brushed motors + 1 x esc + 1 battery would be easier ? Would seem to remove a few 'unknowns'. My current set-up is running 2 x brushless motors, 2 esc & 1 x 3-cell lipo. Like you - I did notice the take-offs were nice and straight (until the wheels left the ground !!!) argh !!!

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

Both motors and ESC's were new, and I'm also running a single 2200 mah 3 cell lipo. No thrust differential issues at all, I just plugged everything in and it worked, no mixing involved except for mixing the two throttle channels together 1 to 1. If it does you any good, I'm running E-Flite Park 450's and E-Flite 25 amp ESC's, all bought new at the same time I bought the plane. I'm a big fan of the cheaper motors I get off of Ebay, but I never considered the possibility that they may not be manufactured as consistently as some of the higher priced offerings, or at least not so much so as to cause the sort of issues that you're having. E-Flite motors are quite pricey I'll admit, but I've found that they're usually worth at least part of the investment. I've had really good luck with them in the past, and considering that this plane was on a killer combo deal with motors and ESC's, I had no reason to go with cheaper power on this particular project.

I'm still thinking however that your problems stem more from the different amounts of wear on both of your motors than the motors themselves. It's just a guess of course, but performing the tests I suggested will tell me more.

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

Hi raginredneck93 - I agree with you, thinking it's the mix of new & used motors. Today, I ordered 2 new brushless motors (1600 kv) - will be easy to fit when they arrive (3 screws per motor). Might save me from having to perform all the tests, and I hope I have the same sucess as you did !!!
Which way do your motors counter-rotate ? top/inside, or top/outside ?

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

Well, I've been flying a lot over the past few days: twice on Sunday (both flights ending in trees!), once on Monday evening, again this evening, and now I've really got the hang of this thing. :) Tonight was the first time I've ever flown in really quite calm conditions (it had been a humid day, so the air was still) and WOW - what a difference!! I could actually fly straight and level for a while. :) Actually, there was a bit of a breeze, and from a different direction than all the other times I've flown, but I could easily deal with it.

I had a few near misses with the ground as I swooped a little low after some banking turns where I lost a little too much lift at low alt, but there was always room to recover (sometimes just enough!); no prangs either yesterday or today, just a couple of rough landings and two really nice and soft ones.

Two quick questions: right now my battery is lasting about 7.5 minutes before the cutout. Is that low? What I've taken to doing is unplugging and then replugging the battery in to "reset" the ESC and then hitting the throttle once for the cutout, then again, then unplugging and replugging the battery, hitting the throttle, etc. to try and really drain the battery before recharging. I guess it's time to buy another to have as a spare!

Secondly, I notice that there are times when I have to slightly input down elevator because the plane is climbing more than I want, and this happens at speed. Naturally I could just cut the throttle, thereby reducing lift because of less airflow over the wing, but there are times when I don't want to do that, and I can't trim out the behaviour. For instance, if I'm flying into the wind, there's "free lift" from the headwind, yet I don't want to lower the throttle because there's the possibility that it could stall out if I do and it's too low to recover airspeed in a dive. I suppose I could adjust the elevator horn so there's more down elevator when in a static position, but then that would mean I'd have to be holding slight up elevator in some instances if I couldn't trim out. Sorry for the long winded intro, but here's my question: if I'm forced into a position where I have to sometimes hold a bit of elevator in order to fly level, is it more desirable that it be up or down elevator? Secondly, if it is climbing more than I want, should my reaction, instead of using down elevator, be just to reduce throttle and then if that becomes a problem just to open up the throttle again?

Thanks and cheers,
phaetn

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

Hi phaetn - I also taught mysefl to fly using a SkyFly, they seem to have a tendency to like trees !!! I managed to get mine stuck in the only tree for miles on my first flight, all the time knowing it was there and I needed to avoid it... Anyway, no damage done. Even though I've trimmed my skyfly out now, I still fly using both channels at the same time. To reduce climb-rate, I'd drop the throttle a little first, and then if things start to slow down, hit the throttle and give alittle down elevator. You must always keep it moving forward, but can let it 'hover' if heading into a head wind. It good to see you haven't given up yet, stick to it and you'll be flying like a pro soon. My best advice while learning is to keep high off the ground, so you can recover without hitting the ground.

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

I sure hope new motors fix your problem lambodave, but if nothing else, you'll have some extra motors laying around for future projects! :D

That's kind of how this addiction gets started you know, LOL.

Howdy phaetn. A plane as light as the Sky Fly is going to bounce around a bit in the wind. As you get more experienced, you'll learn better how to work WITH it instead of fighting it all the time. It's sort of like when you first learned to drive a car. Everyone starts out trying to correct every tiny little drift with opposite steering, but after awhile they learn to sort of let the car drift around on its own while keeping it on a basically straight path. Next thing you know, you're doing it without even thinking about it. The same holds true for flying.

I would say your flight times are pretty typical if you're flying around mostly at full throttle. Once again, as you get more experienced and learn to play the wind and manage the throttle better, you'll find that your flight times will increase. It's never a good idea to fly an electric plane wide open all the time anyway, so you just as well start getting used to working that throttle now. A beginner plane like the Sky Fly is designed with all of its components matched in a way that it's pretty hard for you to hurt it, but later on if you move up to more advanced and more powerful aircraft, the motors/batteries/ESC's will require a little more respect lest the magic smoke be let out of them, LOL. No plane will ever trim perfectly for all conditions either, and especially one with control linkages and surfaces as spongy as the Sky Fly. If you trim a plane to fly straight and level at half throttle, it's going to climb if you add power. The same is true if you trim a plane at full throttle, it'll descend if you reduce power. Full scale planes are no different, and it's just one more demonstration of how you climb with power, not the elevator. As the speed of the aircraft increases, the angle of attack necessary for the wing to keep the plane flying decreases, so if you slow the plane down without raising the nose, it's going to descend.

One thing that you might find helpful on the Sky Fly however, is to move your control lines to the inside holes if you haven't already. Not only does this simple mod practically double your control authority, it also doubles the effective range of your trims as the same movement of the servo now translates into much more movement at the control surface. Carefully centering both control surfaces with the trims on the tx centered (important step: always recenter the trims on the tx before tuning on the adjusters) before EACH flight will also help insure that you have adequate trim in both directions to get your plane flying straight and level.

Hope it helps, and it's GREAT to hear that you're up and flying!

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

Hi raginredneck93 - Thought about you, when I saw this one - skip 4 motors, go striaght for 6 !!!

[link]http://modelflight.com.au/rc_model_electric_planes/graupner_me_323_gigant.htm[/link]

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

Nah, 6 motors? That's too easy. [>:]

I was thinking more like a Spruce Goose. :D

I saw one in a magazine years ago that these two old geezers had built. It had a wingspan of something like 30 feet, and was powered by 8 K&B .61 glow engines. Back in my early flying days, I had a hard enough time keeping ONE of those blasted slimer motors running, I can't imagine 8 of them at once, LOL. By the time you got the last one started and tuned, the first one would be out of fuel or the glow plug would crap and you'd have to start all over again at the beginning. They did fly it however, and according to the magazine article it was a sight to behold, especially the sound of 8 glow engines all at once as it passed overhead. It took both of them to fly the thing, with one guy actually flying the plane while the other one worked the throttles. I have yet to see an electric Spruce Goose however, so if anyone knows of somebody that's selling one please let me know. That one would have some serious "WOW" factor at the local flying field!

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

I've gotten my Skyfly in the air a few times now. We seem to always have at least a little bit of a breeze here, so it's hard to get any flying time. I pretty much keep the plane in the trunk of the car these days so that I can take advantage of a still day when it presents itself.

On the first day, I hadn't trimmed out the rudder correctly AFTER I powered it up so after the first few failed attempts to hand- launch the plane, it took off, got altitude as it made a nice, wide left turn, I hit the throttle to avoid ramming a building, soared over it, and then realized I was heading over the approach the Golden Gate Bridge, so I cut the throttle and landed right in a tree. Hads to come back later in the day with a telescoping pole and knock it out. Caught it right in my hand.

Came back a few days later but the breeze was a little too strong. Last weekend I tried it in a different spot. I had stiffened the main wing with a piece of carbon fiber rod (following someone's suggestion several pages back) to lessen the chance of damage in case I crashed it or if I looped the plane too hard. After a few bad launches, I got the plane airborne. I remembered - ALTITUDE, ALTITUDE - and so I got the plane flying, climbing and quite by accident did a loop & cleared the ground. The breeze kept coming & going so I still haven't really gotten a feel for the plane yet. Crashed several times. The longest I kept it in the air was probably 30 seconds. I'm really amazed at how much abuse the plane can take:D. On one of the crashes, I didn't cut the throttle quickly enough so the prop took a chunk out of the trailing edge of the main wing. Patched that with some packing tape.

A couple of days later I took it out again. A little breezy so it was hard to keep it in the air. On my last crash, I creased the horizontal stabilizer enough to end the day's flying. Stopped by the LHS to get one, but they were out so they ordered one. Got home, cut down a piece of carbon-fiber rod taped it to the bottom of the fin. Made the fin flyable again. It's definitely stiffer than when new. I'm just wondering if that piece of cf rod is going to disrupt the airflow under the fin enough that the elevator loses its effectiveness. Took it out yesterday morning but it was too breezy given that I still don't have the feel of the plane so I really couldn't tell.

No worries, though. Once I get the hang of it, this is going to be a lot of fun. I'm glad I spent the extra few bucks for the Skyfly over one of the cheaper planes from Horizon.

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

NRD: nice story. Based on a little experience, it sounds like you are flying in an area that is not quite large enough for you. I suggest trying to find a large enough area where you can get her up without worrying about buildings, freeways...and the Golden Gate. You will have a much better experience. Also, remember that altitude is your friend until you feel confident with the skyfly.

and remember to cut the throttle sooner than later to avoid damage to the motor, wing, and receiver. It should be a second-nature instant reaction when you approach a tree or the ground. :-)

Check out some of your fellow skyflyers in action. The 3rd one down is mine.

http://youtube.com/results?search_qu...o&search_type=

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

I've been having good, clean fun with the Skyfly and feel very comfortable with it now.

I've been flying almost every day for about a week and have done touch and goes plus landings on asphalt, as well as a few rolling take offs. Most of the time I do hand launches, however, and land in a field since I fly from a farm and it's a bit of a risk near trees and lamp posts to actually get to the paved parking lot. (Where I live there's an actual huge working farm in the middle of the city run by the federal gov't to study crops, etc. It's a great place to fly since there's LOTS of open space and is very convenient only about 3 mins from my house! You can GoogleEarth the location [link=http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Carling+Ave.+ottawa&sll= 37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=60.032659,103.183594&ie=UTF8&ll=45. 388324,-75.717344&spn=0.026402,0.050383&t=h&z=14]here[/link]).

I'm surely over-confident now (a dangerous condition!) and routinely fly in conditions that would have been way too windy for my first few flights (about 13-15mph plus small gusts). Now I find the Skyfly very easy to control: The thing has a tremendous amount of lift, acting like a homesick angel, and also has very docile stall characteristics. The secret for me has been to be constantly be aware of the lift vector, recognising that banked flight generally reduces alt if it's not compensated for (as the lift vector is no longer perpendicular to the ground) and any time I start getting in a bit of trouble at low alt I just straighten out the wings and hit the power; within a second or so the plane is happily climbing again. During the "rebuild" I did remount the horns and control lines to go through the holes closest to the control surface for added rudder and elevator authority (thanks for the tip!) and I'm sure this helps a lot.

Happily I haven't had any crashes in a while (knock on wood!) but feel pretty good about my instincts to save the plane and I'm quite comfortable with reversed controls when it's flying towards me. Since I don't use the beginner mode on the radio, I think one area I really need to work on is co-ordinated flight (not between ailerons and ruder, naturally, but between the rudder and elevator to tighten up turns). Right now I have fairly wide and gentle turns, though sometimes I do have to react quickly for big gusts, and know that I can start to explore more tightly carved turns and practice operating withing a smaller flying space.

Today I flew in WAY too high wind conditions 18mph with gusts up to 29mph, according to [link=http://weather.weatherbug.com/Canada/Ottawa-weather.html?zcode=z6286]Weatherbug[/link]. I figured I have enough spare parts that I can just replace anything I might damage, and I wanted to see just how difficult it would be.

At one point I had a hilarious experience where the throttle was quite (but not fully) open, I was headed directly into the wind at low alt (just a little above eye level) and at very close range, so the plane was essentially hovering, not making any headway but not getting shot up into the air either. I literally felt like I could just reach out and grab the plane right out of the air it was so still!

One thing led to another, and I knew I was really pushing my luck the way the Skyfly was lurching and skidding all over the place; I managed at one point to just pull up in time as the plane was about to auger into the ground after a gust caught it during a turn. I didn't nose dive into the field, but didn't quite clear the ground either, and basically pulled off a very unexpected three point landing at full speed. I watched for a moment, amazed that I hadn't made a lawn dart (and a bit surprised that it wasn't swooping up either!) as the plane just ran across the field at full tilt for about five or so feet. Once it was down there was no way it could lift off again (the field is too rough) and I went to collect it, deciding I had made a lucky escape so I was done for the day. I had seen that the wing and stabs were fine, but was very surprised to find that I had ripped off a rear wheel from its axle! I managed to locate it after a few minutes of looking, but couldn't find the little cap that glues on to hold the wheel in place. Now that's one part I don't have... I'll have to jerry-rig something tonight!

I want to keep flying the Skyfly for most of this summer, maybe heading to something different for the autumn. I have my eye on Alfa Model's [link=http://www.hobby-lobby.com/spitfire.htm]ARF electric Spitfire[/link] from HobbyLobby. Given that it has a puller rather than pusher prop, is a low versus high wing, without the dihedral tips, and surely has a smaller wing area am I crazy to consider it? Just how much harder would it be to fly? I know the Skyfly is nice and slow with lots of lift, will a smaller Spit be insane? Just how different is it to fly with aileron controls, too?

Thanks and cheers,
phaetn

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

Hey Phaetn I know the experimental farm very well. I have family in Ottawa and in fact lived there for a while myself.

For a new wheel retainer, I've had good luck with the smallest size nitro fuel line from the hobby shop. I explained that I'd lost my Skyfly's wheel retainer and they just gave me a couple of inches of this fuel line, saying everybody uses it. I cut a 1/4" piece of the line so it became a rubber grommet, then pushed it over the axle. Problem solved.

Happy flying.

Dave

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

Great idea - thanks!

As for Spitfires, now I've spied the [link=http://www.hobbyzone.com/rc_planes_parkzone_spitfire.htm]Parkzone Spit MkIIB[/link] that seems like a good all-in-the-box solution for me at the right price if I ever get good enough to try a warbird.

Cheers,
phaetn

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

As for the Spitfire (or any other plane with ailerons), just practice on the simulators between now and then...and then take it slowly. I have a couple of slow-flying 3-channels planes (including 2 skyflys of course), but my next move is going to be investing in a 2.4ghz system so that I can take advantage of the ARF's and plug-n-play planes out there. my flying buddy still hand launches most of his flights, but I figure I need to master the ROG take-offs and landings, handling the planes in various conditions, etc, before i move on to ailerons.

I am currently working on a brushless epp eagle...as another slow-flyer...but with a bit of "umph" from the brushless motor...and then my next plane would either be a HZ Super Cub (which seems to come highly recommended), and then on to something with ailerons...maybe a Spitfire, Mustang, or Focke Wulfe (sp?).

Throw us up a video of you flying!

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

Like you guys, I taught myself to fly with the skyfly. I then decided to 'upgrade' the skyfly to brushless set-up with 3-cell lipo. This did mean replacing all electronics, and installing 2 servos, REC and using a different TX. I went for the Spektrun DX6, which is a good investment for any future plane. You learn 'heaps' when you upgrade your own plane. These days, you might be better buying the DX6i or DX7. It's also good to see how you have improved the plane, as you got used to it before the upgrade, and then you get to fly the same plane AFTER the upgrade. Anyway, I am now working on a twin-brushless motors on a Skyfly - spinning counter-rotating props, and another I am also working is fitted with 2 x ducted fan units (Looks like a 737 !!!) I'll let you know once I get these into the air !!! Long life the SkyFly ...

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. While the Sky Fly is indeed an excellent trainer, it most likely will not prepare anyone for a warbird as their second plane. Not trying to discourage anyone, but warbirds are sort of the holy grail of RC flying. Everyone wants to fly one, but very few ever do so successfully. Many that do are often disappointed with the performance because these planes are flown "hands on" all the time. There is no such thing as a leisurely flight with a scale warbird, they're on the edge of a stall and moving fast at all times just like their full scale counterparts. The same holds true for most scale planes, depending of course on just how "scale" they are. Many of the warbirds on the market these days aren't exact scale models by a long shot, and therefore are much easier to fly than they would be if they were appropriate with regards to tail area, wing span, ect. If you insist on a warbird however, and have your heart set on a Spitfire, then I would go with the Parkzone version if I were you. It quite likely has a few more "gimmicks" built in that will make it easier to fly. The problem however, is that even though it has ailerons, it's still a 3 channel plane with a simple radio system so you're essentially gaining nothing as far as gear that you can use later. My advice to anyone who's mastered the Sky Fly would be to use the money to instead buy a good computer radio system of 6 channels or more. I of course would suggest a DX7 because that's what I use and I like it, but the final decision is of course up to you. I would then save up and invest in a "real" trainer as a second plane. By this I mean an Electristar, a Nexstar EP, (both of which come with a decent albeit a bit simplistic radio, but 4 channel nevertheless), or perhaps the new T34 from E-Flite that comes either with a DX6i or as a plug and play. Whichever route you choose, I'd put at least one "real" RC plane under my belt before I tried a warbird, that way you will either have the confidence necessary to pilot one effectively, or you will realize just how much more experience you need before taking such a big jump up the ladder, and likely spare yourself a lot of frustration.

On another note, mastering takeoffs with the Sky Fly will do a great job of preparing you for anything with trike gear, but not necessarily a taildragger such as most warbirds. Scale planes in general, and especially those with relatively small tails such as Spitfires, are notorious for lousy ground handling. From the second the wheels begin to turn until the second they stop after landing, they need to be controlled on all 3 axis as well as managed with regards to airspeed. The Sky Fly basically flies itself compared to most of these planes. Do yourself a favor and gain a little experience first. Most importantly, MASTER the art of landing. Own it, downwind, upwind, crosswind, long field, short field, no excuses. Pick a spot and land on it. When you can do it EVERY time, then consider a warbird. Of course I may be exaggerating a little, but if the only thing you've flown is a Sky Fly, flying a warbird is going to be a lot more like work than fun. That's the very reason why seemingly most RC pilots get stuck on aerobatic models and never quite make it to warbirds. Extra 300's go where you point them. P51 Mustangs go everywhere but, LOL.

As an example, I've been flying for years and I've only just begun to tinker with semiscale warbirds. I wouldn't even consider a true to dimension built up model yet.

Also, flying wings are excellent warbird trainers. Their high speed and maneuverability, along with their bank and yank and turn and burn flight characteristics make them great for getting used to flying out of all sorts of bad orientations. That and they're usually tough, unlike most warbird models especially those made of styrofoam. Once again, my suggestion is the Mugi Evo, www.mugi.co.uk. If you want a fun second plane that will transition nicely into a warbird, there's your ticket. Won't help you any with the takeoffs and landings, but at least you'll know what to do once it's in the air.

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

Probably big enough, it's just hard to find a calm, still place in the City where I can get the feel of the plane. Otherwise, you have to cross a bridge, deal with a lot of traffic, and drive another 20 miles just to get away from civilization and the wind.

Here was the first place I flew (where the plane went in the tree - I've gone back a few times) http://maps.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTEx...461649&zoom=17

The second place - a little tighter but it was calmer and I kept her in the air for maybe a minute at a time. http://maps.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTEx...474009&zoom=17

The third place - http://maps.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTEx...463924&zoom=17

And the next place I'll try (The Polo Field in Golden Gate Park) http://maps.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTEx...463924&zoom=17

Nice thing about the last one is that it's 5 miutes drive closest to my house and only a couple of minutes walk from the boat pond - I can park at the pond, walk over, fly the plane, walk back, and then run boats for awhile before I leave.

This week, we're having some (relatively) warm weather. That means no breeze from the ocean, still air, so I should be able to get some fly time in. I just scored the E-sky flight simulator on Ebay for almost nothing, so I'll be practicing with that once the still, warm weather passes.

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

In my haste to pass on the wisdom of us old fogeys, I almost forgot to endorse one of the best all around "second plane" aerobatic trainers there is. The venerable 3D foamy! They're relatively new on the scene, having been invented some time later than the rocks and dirt that I'm used to working with, LOL.

Foamies are GREAT second planes after mastering a plane like the Sky Fly, and also an awesome way to get used to using all of your controls. Foamies are extremely active on all axis much like scale planes, however they're so overpowered and their wing loading is so low, that they're more like a warbird on Valium. They're perfect for getting used to the idea of flying inverted, as well as doing rolls and loops and whatever else your imagination can throw at them. I tend to think they're billed as being far more durable than they actually are, but they will take a surprising bit of abuse and can often be pasted back together with a bit of foam safe CA and some clear tape. At any rate, they'll work wonders on a person's takeoff skills, as well as landing and just general flying basics. The way a foamy lands is pretty much like any other plane you might ever fly, only slower and much more forgiving since a foamy is extremely hard to stall. Set the elevator, work the power to control the rate of descent, and fly them to the runway steering with the rudder and keeping the wings level with the ailerons. Piece of cake. Foamies also like to fly with coordinated rudder and aileron, much like most scale planes do, so they're a natural second step for someone looking to get into warbirds.

Fooey on me for not thinking of it sooner. :D

RE: Flyzone Sky Fly
 

Hey NRD: I believe the e-sky simulator is a repackaging of the FMS simulator. You should be able to search the net and find the skyfly for the simulator. you can also find the slo-v...which is another nice slow flying plane. You will also find warbids so you can get a taste of that. It is amazing how easy it is to crash a plane! :-)

Redneck: Good idea on the foamies. They appear to handle quite differently from any other plane, but would appear to be much more forgiving in terms of durability etc. I am building a large foamie (not aerobatic), mainly so I can overpower it and be able to fight back thru the wind in my area.


BTW - the Sky Fly 2 has been announced/released. Check out towerhobbies.com