Q-500 Racing Discuss AMA 428, AMA 424, and any other variants of Quickie 500 racing

Head shim for TT .40 PRO?

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Old 05-10-2011, 11:47 PM
  #1
jaka
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Default Head shim for TT .40 PRO?

Hi!
The TT.40 PRO engine has a thick 0.40mm head shim as standard.
Do you keep that head shim when using 15% nitro or do you replace it with thinner one??

In Sweden we use 80/20 fuel in Q-500 pylon so do you have any suggestions to what shim to use then.
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Old 05-11-2011, 04:46 AM
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Default RE: Head shim for TT .40 PRO?

FOR FAI FUEL TAKE OUT THE SHIM
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Old 05-11-2011, 04:57 AM
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Default RE: Head shim for TT .40 PRO?

Hi!
Okay! So no shim is needed at all when running 0% nitro..?
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Old 05-11-2011, 05:13 AM
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Default RE: Head shim for TT .40 PRO?

depends on the tolerances in the engines. I've seen TTPros that would almost have no head clearance at all without the shim.

Dave Shadel (www.pspec.com) used to sell an assortment of shims for the thunder tiger, you might try his website, see if he still has them. He had a range of thicknesses from .001 to .005 I believe. You could use them to build up what you need.

I've not run one on 80/20 fuel, so couldn't provide much recommendation for you.

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Old 05-11-2011, 06:19 AM
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Default RE: Head shim for TT .40 PRO?

With 15% nitro we generally end up with .004 to .008 depending on the engine. As fizz says be careful of tolerance if you take the shim out altogether.

Denis
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Old 05-11-2011, 07:22 AM
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Default RE: Head shim for TT .40 PRO?

You really run yours that low? I think I've been running around 13
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Old 05-11-2011, 07:24 AM
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Default RE: Head shim for TT .40 PRO?

of course our air is a lot more humid here in Kansas than you probably are in CA - it's harder to squeeze humid air...
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Old 05-11-2011, 07:49 AM
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Default RE: Head shim for TT .40 PRO?

I use NO head shim on the OS .46AX here with 15%.
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Old 05-11-2011, 08:07 AM
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Default RE: Head shim for TT .40 PRO?

Yup a lot less humidity and a lot less water vapor
I've been through about 6 or 7 TTs. I break them in on the shim they come with, about .014 and then start dropping about 2 or 3 thou at a time until I find peak rpm. I use the thickest shim that gets me that rpm and seems to unload well in the air. The thinnest I have settled at is .005 and the thickest is .008. I did have one that peaked at .002 but then on the first hot day it told me "give more head room or I'm going to grenade on you"[:@] .

Denis
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Old 05-11-2011, 08:13 AM
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Default RE: Head shim for TT .40 PRO?

Hi!
Please guy's! Metiric please...much simpler that way!
I make my own aluminum shims so ...I try and run it with one 0,1mm shim first and we'll see.
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Old 05-11-2011, 08:32 AM
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Default RE: Head shim for TT .40 PRO?

That 0,1 is a .004 Jan. But first you have to decide to use a , or . . I would start with a 0,2 and come down on it about 0,05 at a time. Using 0,1 as a starting point could cause confusion because of tolerance like fizz said.

Denis

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Old 05-11-2011, 09:03 AM
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Default RE: Head shim for TT .40 PRO?

Denis - are you measuring actual head clearance at TDC, or only shim thickness?

That might account for some of the difference.
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Old 05-11-2011, 09:15 AM
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Default RE: Head shim for TT .40 PRO?

Only shim thickness and based on the difference in shim thickness I see my guess is there is a lot of difference in head clearance from engine to engine, but I never measured it.

Denis
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Old 05-11-2011, 10:07 AM
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Default RE: Head shim for TT .40 PRO?

I've found that there are a few thousandths of difference from engine to engine, even to the point of nearly having contact between the piston and head with no shim. That would explain the differences in your numbers and mine.

I don't have my notes here at work, (shh...) so I don't know for sure how thick the shims are in the three or four TTpros that I have.

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Old 05-11-2011, 10:59 AM
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Default RE: Head shim for TT .40 PRO?

Hi!
I will make a few 0.1mm shims and try what works best.
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Old 05-11-2011, 02:04 PM
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Default RE: Head shim for TT .40 PRO?

If you measured head clearance I would be interested to know what you found ran best out of curiosity. I never measured it because there wasn't anything you could do about it except change shims anyway; rules, so I just shimmed for rpm. Sense the head on the TT40 has a tapered squish band about .004 I always kind of thought the inner edge of the squish band should wind up about .009 or so from the piston for best rpm in our rpm range but I never checked it. I always wondered why the Nelson had a squish band with no taper. It looks like a receipt for detonation. But what do I know I'm just a dumb aero guy .

Denis
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Old 05-11-2011, 02:30 PM
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Default RE: Head shim for TT .40 PRO?

Using a flat depth mic across the head, I measured to the seating surface of the head -
Same depth mic (actually a dial depth indicator) I measured TDC - more than once. This can be tricky if the piston/sleeve fit is squeaky tight. Dub Jett recommends measuring BDC and subtracting the stroke if you know it, so that's another way.

I think my best TTpros were set up between .013 and .015 on the piston/head clearance for 15% nitro. Not too hard to needle, seem to run just fine.

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Old 05-13-2011, 05:46 PM
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Default RE: Head shim for TT .40 PRO?

I've noticed a .004 variance in the engines I have had over the last few years. Must be a local thing since I have had good success running .007 clearance. I check them with an indicator and Jo blocks.
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Old 05-21-2011, 04:55 AM
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Default RE: Head shim for TT .40 PRO?


Quote:
ORIGINAL: fizzwater2
depends on the tolerances in the engines. I've seen TTPros that would almost have no head clearance at all without the shim.
I measured the head clearance of 2 TT 40 Pros yesterday with my brand-spankin' new digital depth gauge http://www.garrettwade.com/digital-s...ge/p/96T01.12/ using 2 different techniques. In all 4 cases I got the same results. WITHOUT head shims, there was essentially ZERO clearance. If there is any clearance at all, it is on the order of 0.0005-0.001". And that's with a dead-cold engine. I have no idea what happens when the metal expands. I was planning to take out the stock shim (0.015") and run without, but based on my measurements and earlier recommendations in the forum, I put in 0.007" worth of Dave Shadel's shims. When I have time, I'll run tests with different thickness of shims but from what I measured, you had better run it with at least some shim unless you want to smack the piston into the head. [:@]
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