Q-500 Racing Discuss AMA 428, AMA 424, and any other variants of Quickie 500 racing

Fuels

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Old 09-07-2008, 08:47 PM
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Vendata
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Default Fuels

Hi there guys,
What are you guys using in the way of oil in your Q500 Models / 424 racing.
& your Q40 racing models. EG: 100% Synthetic 0r 100% Castor
0r 80/20. I know using 100% Synthetic is cleaner but, is it as good as using
castor. I heard castor varnishes up the piston & liner!! but protects the engine better
than any Synthetic.
I heard using 100% Synthetic makes the engine perform better & faster!!
Your thoughts please.
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Old 09-07-2008, 09:23 PM
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mostly 80/20 around my club these days. Of course, we just made a club purchase of some Wildcat Extra 18% oil, 80/20, so that might influence it a bit...

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Old 09-08-2008, 09:03 AM
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I went to a practice clinic here in the Houston area a couple of weeks ago and noticed that the big dogs were using fuel that had at least "some" castor in it. I like to have a little castor in my fuel just in case of an accidental lean run. I kinda wish the CD's would start having both types (full synthetic and blend) available on race day.
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Old 09-08-2008, 09:58 AM
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I don't have the exact specs, but the powermaster fuel that is supplied at most major pylon contests in the US is a blend of synthetic and castor oils.
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Old 09-08-2008, 11:03 AM
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Dava it's 18% oil 6 Castor an 12 synth.
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Old 09-08-2008, 01:05 PM
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Default RE: Fuels

Unfortunately the Club 40 guys here in Texas have chosen to go with all synthetic. The fuel is sponsored and that may be why. I just finished a can of the Powermaster castor/synth blend, good stuff. Great day everyone.
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Old 09-08-2008, 01:36 PM
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Default RE: Fuels

I'm down to my last gallon of powermaster and love the stuff also.

Very good fuel.

Are you guys using Ritches Brew in Texas? If so, we ran that at the Champ race a few years ago, and it worked great also...
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Old 09-08-2008, 11:05 PM
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Default RE: Fuels

Hey Butch I wouldn't mind if you mixed up a little at the event for yourself. Take say 20 oz. and mix in some caster, and run it. BUT I only CD one race, and I know you, and that you wouldn't try to add anything extra, but others might not see it that way.
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Old 09-09-2008, 02:41 AM
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Default RE: Fuels

my prefered oil mix is 90% synthetic and 10% castor. i allways buy and mix my own to the ratio of 20 to 1, the synthetic oil is Coolpower, the castor is first pressing Castrol. many guys say to go to 18 to 1 ratio but i feel this slight extra oil content doesn,t make the engine run any slower, actually the engine runs better as its abit cooler.
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Old 09-09-2008, 10:44 AM
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Hi!
Over here in Sweden we use 17% all synthetic oil and 10% nitro in our 428 Q-500 racers, which are Nelson and JETT powered.
In our 424 Q-500 class we use 80/20 fuel ...thats all 20% Castor oil...and do our engines get black inside... You bet!!
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Old 09-09-2008, 03:15 PM
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Default RE: Fuels

Jaka,
Why is it that you guys use 17% synthetic in your Q500 428 Racing with Jetts & Nelsons.
But you guys use 20/80 mix blend for your Q500 424 Racing.
0ur engines get real black inside, as well using the 20/80 blend.
I was thinking about going 18% Synthetic, in the 424 class racing over here?
Just wondering if the engines would perform any better? 0r perhaps faster?
I know it would be alot cleaner inside for the engines!
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Old 09-10-2008, 10:06 AM
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Default RE: Fuels

Yes Dave we use Ritch's brew which is very good stuff it's just that the CD's are getting the all synth fuels for the races.

Thanks Eric; I don't really mind all that much running the all synth for a race here and there, I just wish they would move to the blend as I feel since were are talking noobs here (Club 40 is entry level after all) it would leave some cushion for a lean run without damage.
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Old 09-10-2008, 02:07 PM
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Default RE: Fuels

When we went looking for a fuel sponsor for our Club 40 races, Randy Ritch was the only one that agreed. He has been VERY generous with his sponsorship of racing in Texas.

He supplies us with 15% fuel with all synthetic oil and we greatefully use it! It is the same fuel run in all NMPRA races in Texas. It is great fuel. Maybe it is less expensive for him to produce, I do not know nor do I care! With the price of fuel now days, and the scarcity of Nitro, I would not care what the blend is as long as he GIVES it to us! I, personally, like all synthetic. Because of his generosity, I run nothing but Ritches Brew in ALL my engines.

I am not trying to be a hard *****, but I can't believe some one would gripe about receiving a free gift!!
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Old 09-10-2008, 06:08 PM
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Default RE: Fuels

Are you trying to make me feel bad Chuck? Hey I got an idea, I won't burn any of you guys fuel since you put it that way. Count me out big fellow.

P.S. I think I explained why I felt the way I do. Also note that I said Ritch's Brew is good stuff. This is a beginners class, I think, and they are not always the best at setting needles so a bit of cushion (Castor) would help them. Last I heard you were trying to build pylon racing up and the net effect of your comment is one less now.
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Old 09-10-2008, 08:53 PM
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Jezmo - I did not mention you, it was a general statement, but do what you think is best. (I just happened to post after you did so it says "in responce to Jezmo")

The discussion of which is best, castor blend or all synthetic, has been going on for quite a while. One thing is certain: Castor oil burns and turns to "gunk" when it gets too hot, synthetic does not.

So which one is actually better if you accidentally get a lean run?? IMO it is all synthetic, but that is just one opinion.
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Old 09-10-2008, 09:07 PM
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I am well aware you did not mention me by name, you didn't have to.
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Old 09-12-2008, 11:17 AM
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Well now that, that's over back to Vendatas original question. Out here in the west we use fuel with some Castor for pylon racing because that is what the race organizers provide (powermaster 15%). Most of us like it for the added protection the Castor provides in case of lean runs. Yes it will yellow the piston and liner and result in faster build up of carbon on the piston and head. I find that frequently taking the backplate and head off and rinsing the engine with lacquer thinner goes nicely toward controlling it. A paper towel dipped in lacquer thinner will take the the varnish and carbon right off if it is not allowed to build up thick. If the varnish builds up to thick then you well have to remove the piston from the cylinder. Still clean it with a paper towel and lacquer thinner. It must be lacquer thinner, not any thinner will work. I do this to my racing TT40s, Nelsons and Profis.

Denis
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Old 09-12-2008, 02:34 PM
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Hi!
We use 17% all synthetic oil in our Q-500 428 class as the rules says so over here[8D]. I think it's just because thats the fuel that most of all resembles the fuel used in 428 pylon in the USA.
80/20 fuel is used in our "newcomer" class Q-500 since day one, at least since we started flying Q-500 in the early nineteens.
We use standard .40 engines like Webra GT .40, TT .40 SE PRO and OS FX.40 and use 10x6 plastic props.
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Old 09-12-2008, 02:38 PM
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Hey there Denis, how regular do you clean the top of the Piston in your engine.
I have noticed it doesn't take long on the 460S AX to build up a black thick film
of castor, on the top of the piston. I suppose the longer its lefted there, would it
slow the engine down at all? We also use a 80 / 20 mix + 10% nitro & of course
Methol. The oil content into 4litres is 18%.
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Old 09-12-2008, 02:38 PM
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Default RE: Fuels

Hi!
We use 17% all synthetic oil in our Q-500 428 class as the rules says so over here[8D]. I think it's just because thats the fuel that most of all resembles the fuel used in 428 pylon in the USA.
80/20 fuel is used in our "newcomer" class Q-500 since day one, at least since we started flying Q-500 in the early nineteens.
We use standard .40 engines like Webra GT .40, TT .40 SE PRO and OS FX.40 and use 10x6 plastic props.
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Old 09-12-2008, 02:57 PM
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ORIGINAL: djlyon
I find that frequently taking the backplate and head off and rinsing the engine with lacquer thinner goes nicely toward controlling it. A paper towel dipped in lacquer thinner will take the the varnish and carbon right off if it is not allowed to build up thick. If the varnish builds up to thick then you well have to remove the piston from the cylinder. Still clean it with a paper towel and lacquer thinner. It must be lacquer thinner, not any thinner will work.

I keep a can of NeverDull around for doing this. I small piece will knock the varnish off the top of the piston very easily and quickly.

No matter what you use to clean it up, make sure your motor is well-oiled before using it again!

Tim
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Old 09-12-2008, 03:54 PM
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Default RE: Fuels

I use 0000 steel wool on the top of the piston, and the head, but not the side of the piston. I leave that alone.

About every 20 flights, or two contests. At that time I also check everything internally (bearings, and re-verify head/sleeve settings), oil, and put back together with a torque wrench.

I use plain air tool oil in all of my motors. Sometimes Marvell, sometimes generic.
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Old 09-12-2008, 11:01 PM
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All sounds good, thanks guys.
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Old 09-13-2008, 12:07 AM
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ORIGINAL: jaka

Hi!
We use 17% all synthetic oil in our Q-500 428 class as the rules says so over here[8D]. I think it's just because thats the fuel that most of all resembles the fuel used in 428 pylon in the USA.
80/20 fuel is used in our "newcomer" class Q-500 since day one, at least since we started flying Q-500 in the early nineteens.
We use standard .40 engines like Webra GT .40, TT .40 SE PRO and OS FX.40 and use 10x6 plastic props.
jaka, i love the colour scheme you have done on your viper looks great. also do you guys only run the old 40,s and not the 46 size engines ?
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Old 09-15-2008, 06:54 PM
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Like Dave said about every 20 flights. I also use 0000 steel wool but only when the carbon has got to the point that Lacquer thinner and a paper towel isn't aggressive enough. Seldom happens after only 20 flights.

Denis
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