Q-500 Racing Discuss AMA 428, AMA 424, and any other variants of Quickie 500 racing

BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

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Old 02-16-2009, 12:26 PM
  #1  
BobHH
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Default BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

Well guys I’ve had quite a bit of request for info on the BuckShot and seeing how most of the inquiries asked about its construction, I have been persuaded to do a built thread on her. So here goes. Feel free to chip in any comments or recommendations.

The BuckShot was designed to be an intro into Quickie 500 racing scene. It was specifically designed for the Quickie 25 class whereas the airframe would meet the AMA requirements for 424/428 but run the Quickie 25 class with the OS .25FX and minimum weight of 3-1/4 lbs. Every BuckShot that has been built that I know of has had weight added to meet the minimum.

She is quite tough and has been battle tested. I hit a pole with my first one and even though she was out for the race she could have been repaired. She is quite robust in the tail section (unlike the Vipers!) as attested by Vicman’s attempt to park his with one of the “V” tail fins stuck in the runway. He suffered no damage at all!!![sm=spinnyeyes.gif]

The design and construction of the BuckShot leans more toward the first time racer with all laser cut tab lock construction. The fuselage has virtually a flat bottom where it can be assembled on a flat surface insuring a straight and flat unit. There are 2 different tail configurations that can be built either standard tail or “V” tail. I’ve been working on a “T” tail version with Vicman but the first prototype has some linkage issues so the design is being changed.

The BuckShot also is available with either built up wing for those who are not comfortable with foam wings and the standard sheeted foam wing version.

I’ve found that many people have their own choice of hardware they want to use so the kits are supplied with no hardware or landing gear. We do list on the plans part numbers and manufactures of hardware that has been used successfully.

The foam wing version does not come with wing sheeting. Most people like to hand select their wing sheeting alone with leading edge material. So to keep cost down we have not supplied it in the foam version kit.

The kit comes with full size CAD plans and an assembly manual with pictures. So here we go!!!!
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Old 02-16-2009, 12:32 PM
  #2  
BobHH
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

Lets start the fuselage!

The BuckShot fuselage has been designed to be almost warp proof. It has a flat bottom in order to take advantage of a flat building surface. The fuselage design also includes locking tabs to insure straightness in addition to making it easier to assembly.

Remove all laser cut fuselage parts from their sheets. Glue the 1/16 plywood doublers to the balsa fuselage sides at their proper location.

NOTE: Make sure you make a right and left hand fuselage side.
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Old 02-16-2009, 12:42 PM
  #3  
BobHH
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

Now is the time to decide if you are building the “V” tail version or the “Standard” tail version. The cut outs are marked on the fuselage tail doubler. Cut through this line at the proper location before assembling the fuselage. After you mark and cut the balsa fuselage sides at this location then cut the skip line on the plywood doubler only before glueing it onto the fuselage. This allows the balsa fuselage sides to be sanded to the correct angle from the outside edge of the balsa fuselage to the bottom edge of the inner plywood fuselage doubler. Makes for a strong bond and less gap to fill between the tail and fuselage side.
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Old 02-16-2009, 12:52 PM
  #4  
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

Bob started with the fuse but I started with the wing on a built up version. Here are some pics of how the laser cut ribs look and laid out.
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Old 02-16-2009, 01:55 PM
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daven
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

Looking good, very nice.
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Old 02-16-2009, 02:00 PM
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

Mmmm... I love the way built-up's go BOOM when they mid-air. Lots of little pieces to flitter down. Looks fun, good luck!
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Old 02-16-2009, 02:15 PM
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

It looks pretty good. I would make the length of the ailerons a bit shorter to lower the risk of flutter, and maybe make the tab size on the bulkheads smaller so the "break here" points on the fuselage are stronger.
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Old 02-16-2009, 02:19 PM
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

It did make a loud pop when it hit 2 LOL.
Like Bob's the fuse is still useable. After hitting the pylon most of the wing was still there and it landed as good as anybody could expect. I'll take a pic of it later.
No worry of flutter at quickie 25 speeds. I liked it better than my Viper.

Bob has a bunch more fuse build pics to post to show how strong things are. I'll wait to see what he has before I confuse things.
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Old 02-16-2009, 04:23 PM
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

Vic’s is correct. My BuckShot hit the pole wide open right on the prop nut. Spencer, Vic’s son said it sounded like the bat hitting the ball at a little league baseball game!!

The fuselage stayed intact but it took 3 months to find the engine!!! ( Thanks Brain!) John’s went in after a mid-air nose first. Fuselage split a little but the engine also broke the mount. Have not found that engine yet!!! So they are tough!!


Now let’s talk about laser cutting. As you can see in the picture laser cutting is a great way to make a precise kit but it does leave burn marks. I recommend lightly sanding the burn off the parts to make it easier for the wood to absorb the glue. Do this on every butt joint you have to insure the best bond.

Test assembly the bulkhead, firewall, servo tray and wing hold down plates to insure everything will line up and fit properly.

We suggest using slow drying glue such as Elmers wood glue to assembly all the parts together.

After the glue has dried mark and drill the location of the Hayes motor mount on the firewall. Install 6/32 blind mounting nuts with appropriate screws. Add a little epoxy to the nuts to keep them snug in place.

Put the two fuselage sides together using clamps and/or tape to hold into place until dry. Make sure you lay the fuselage flat onto a flat surface.

NOTE: Do not install F6A and F7A if building the straight tail version.

Add top and bottom sheeting. Add servo hatch doubler. Sand to proper shape. NOTE: Remember the rules state no more that ¼ radius on the fuselage corners. So be careful.

We also recommend wrapping the firewall with layer .75 oz. fiberglass cloth and epoxy. This gives the nose a bit more strength without adding much weight. Lay the fiberglass cloth back to F3 location. Apply epoxy onto the sides and firewall. Lay fiberglass cloth over top gently tapping it with your brush to get the fiberglass saturated with the epoxy. Finally use a old credit card or squeegee to smooth out the cloth and epoxy while removing the excess epoxy.

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Old 02-16-2009, 04:38 PM
  #10  
BobHH
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

Here are some more pictures. Note the bottom hatch and recess for the landing gear (Note: Dave Norman’s speed secrets!) make it slick will make it fast!! [>:]Use some ¼ triangle stock at firewall and landing gear blocks. I recommend a slow drying epoxy in these areas. Again, I’ve bent some landing gear but never pulled it out!
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Old 02-16-2009, 04:41 PM
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vicman
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

I test fit what ever servos I plan to use into the servo tray before glueing anything. It's a lot easier to do before it's in the plane. I also build up the sub assemblies before gluing them to the sides.
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Old 02-16-2009, 04:52 PM
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daven
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

I like how you did your hatch, nice job.

I have had issues with Epoxy not penetrating the charr edges of the laser cut wood. Even after sanding most of the charr off.

I switched to Poly glues like Gorilla and glue everything up in one step, clamp, and let sit over night. It takes a little time cleaning up all the extra ooze and foaming of the glue, but solid as can be.

Just curious on the thickness of the firewall? It looks fine for a .25, but you may want to beef that up for the .40's. Personally, I like a full 1/2", but wouldn't consider anything under 3/8".
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Old 02-16-2009, 04:53 PM
  #13  
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

Dave,
I use Gorilla glue on mine
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Old 02-16-2009, 07:20 PM
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BobHH
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

Dave, the BuckShot uses 2 pieces of 1/8 plywood sandwiched together and tabbed into the fuselage. I feel with the addition of the fiberglass on the nose gives it extra strength. My first 2 BuckShots actually were silked and doped before painting with no fiberglass and even though both crashed so hard the Hayes motor mount broke the firewall stayed intake with no issues.

Now on the "HoleShot" 424 and my 428 prototype I use 3 pieces of hard plywood notched into the fuselage side and top and bottom plywood. I like to use the slow cure epoxy on these areas because of a better bond and the epoxy has some flex which will absorb the high frequency vibrations seen with the larger engines.This with a double shot of fiberglass has even survived some grass cutting with the Nelson on a few occasions![:@] Here is a picture of the rough sanded fuselage before glassing. You can see the top notch of the rear piece of plywood.
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Old 02-17-2009, 08:21 AM
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BobHH
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

Ok, we've got the fuselage built and sanded. I would trial fit your favoritie landing gear on the mount. I've used the Viper gear or a standard aluminum unit from Great Planes. Part numbers are listed on the plans. The standard gear is a bit wider than the Viper and makes it easier to land without the wing walking sometimes seen with the narrower Viper gear. Once you have the gear fixed add 1/8 balsa to fill in the gap to make it fit glove tight and flush with the fuselage bottom. Another one of Dave's tips is to takes the landing gear and airfoil shape the front and back. In just a few short minutes you can taper the leading and trailing edge on all areas of the landing gear that stick out in the air stream. Again slick makes quick!!

Now on to the tail. Seeing how most people like the "V" tail but some are a bit intimidated by it I've tried to make it a little easier.

The “V” tail design takes a bit longer to assembly but we feel it gives the BuckShot a very stable flight path as well as lessens the amount of drag seen at the tail location. (We can debate that statement later[sm=bananahead.gif])

Assembly the vertical tail with elevator into one piece as shown on plans. I also cap the perimeter with a 3/16 square balsa stick which makes it a bit stiffer and a good edge to sand.

Mark the center of the leading and trailing edge with a pen or pencil. This will allow you to sand into an even airfoil shape for a smoother and less drag tail. Mark the center of the tail.

Before sanding put a piece of tape at the center section of the tail approximately ¾ inch wide both top and bottom. Do not sand this area. It will be used to insure the correct incidence for the tail. Sand to a uniform airfoil shape with the center line. Take your time and enjoy!!!

After sanding is finished make a cut on the center line of the tail. Cut the tail into two even parts.
Next cut out the elevators as shown on plans.

Sand the ends of the tail to the desired angle to prepare to join the tails together to make the “V” tail. Remove the masking tape from the area nearest the joint so the tail components will fit in the jig.

Assembly the jig to insure the proper angle for joining the tail halves. Glue the tails together. Again use slow drying glue to insure you can move the tail halves to their proper location in the jig. Make sure the jig in on a flat surface in order that the tail will also be true and straight.

Bend up a right hand and left hand torque rod. Solder the ball link to the end. NOTE: The pictures show the male ball link with brass tubing. I’m now using the female ball link which eliminates the need for the tubing. Just make sure you have nice shiny surfaces to solder to and use an acid core solder.

Carefully groove area on the bottom of the tail where the torque rods will go so the rod fits in the groove snuggly. Now I either give the torque rods a good waxing of auto wax or a light coating of oil and lay aside.

Mix up some 5 minute epoxy and add some micro balloons to make it the consistency of toothpaste. Fill the grooves with the epoxy. Next insert the torque rods into the grooves . I use a small piece of masking tape to insure the rods are in the middle of the tail. Smooth over the epoxy and set aside to dry. Before it is totally dry move the torque rods to insure they operated smoothly.
Sorry for the fuzzy pictures. I need to take some more on the next build.





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Old 02-18-2009, 10:17 AM
  #16  
BobHH
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

Well, I’m hoping I’m not going to fast or confusion anyone. If so chime in with your questions.

BY THE WAY Don Stegall will be offering sheeted foam wings for the BuckShot and HoleShot (424/428 Version) to anyone wanting to just get the fuselage kit from me. If you don’t have a vacuum setup and don’t like to mess with foam wings this is the way to go. You could be in the air with your BuckShot In a week!! So chime in Don and give us the info!!!

If you want a fuselage kit send me a PM and I will send info. Now back to the build…. Let’s mount that “V” tail!!!!!

After finishing out the tail it is time to install. Cut top of fuselage at the locations of between F6 and F6A as well as F7 and F7A.

Install F6A and F7A making sure they are flat against the bottom fuselage sheeting. This will insure you have the correct incidence for the tail. Here is where the unsanded portion of the tail I had you mask off comes into play. The “V” tail sits into the “V” formers F6A and F7A. Make sure they are positions firmly against the bottom fuselage sheet. This will zero in the tail to the wing saddle. This design though a bit different is for the guys who don’t have incidence gauges. Yep it does work as all of my BuckShots and HoleShots flying have used this method and all required not elevator trim at all during setup.

Epoxy into place and sand the top piece you have cut out to fit back in its location on top of the “V” tail. Install the top portions of F6A and F7A. Re-install the fuselage top piece and your done!!! What do you think?

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Old 02-18-2009, 12:04 PM
  #17  
BobHH
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

Now on to the wing!!! Let’s start wit the foam wing version!!

Of course if you look there will be many site showing methods of sheeting wings. But it made be more cost effective to get a wing already sheeted from Don. Remember to cover the center section about 12 inches to 24 inches in the center with fiberglass cloth both top and bottom.

Add the 3/16 balsa wing caps and wing tip. I’ve used 3 different types of wing tip construction. The plans show the single 3/16 balsa sheet tip with small ribs added for strength. This is the quickest way to finish it out. I’ve also used solid balsa carved/sanded to shape. Makes for a tougher wing tip if you are inclined to wing walk some times on landing. It can stand up to the abuse better. The final type is a built up 1/16 sheeted tip using the 3/16 sheet tip and applying the 1/16 balsa sheeting to. A bit longer to make but it is lighter than the solid. You decide!!![sm=72_72.gif]

Again on the ailerons I currently use the cut out type. After getting the wing sanded to proper shape mark out about 2 inches from the edge of the fuselage. Draw out a aileron 1-1/4 wide by 12 to 14 inches long. Allow for a ¼ Balsa cap to be installed on the wing and aileron pieces. Cap the ends with 1/16 balsa. Sand everything to proper shape. Then add your torque rods from the bottom the same as with the tail. Cut a groove for the torque rods. Wax up or oil up the rods, Mix up some 5 minute epoxy with micro balloons and insert the torque rods. Sorry, I do not have the pictures of this installation yet. I’ve done it many time this year but seem to forget to take pictures!!! Anyone got pictures that show this process please post them!!

Here is a picture showing the tool that John Gibson made me and dowels I use for my mounting holes. Cut the dowel to size, epoxy in and this makes a secure mount for the wing.
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Old 02-18-2009, 12:46 PM
  #18  
BarryReade
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

Bob, what weight glass cloth on the center section. also should it be constant like the cord or tapered? Wider at the Front or Rear?
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Old 02-18-2009, 01:16 PM
  #19  
BobHH
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

Barry, I use .75 oz on top and bottom of the BuckShot. I taper it slightly to the middle of the wing so it misses the ailerons. I cut a radius on each end to help blend it into the sheeting so you don't have that sharp line contrast if you are using film covering. Don puts plenty of strength in between the sheeting for strength of his wings. I do it on the outside basically to keep the fuselage from digging into the wing at the saddle.

Now on the 424 HoleShot version I use the .75 oz cloth but double it using say 12 inches on the bottom layer and 24 inches on the top layer. Also blending it in. The new 428s I'm currently building have this except I complete cover the wing in .75 oz cloth because I will paint them.

Funny, The 428 prototype that John is racing now is covered the same as my 424s and uses monokote covering. Monokote/Ultracote give exceptional strength if firmly sealed down to the wood.

Hope this helps.
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Old 02-18-2009, 03:13 PM
  #20  
BobHH
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

Now, for the guys who hate foam wings the BuckShot is offered with a built up wing.
Roll out plans and lay on flat surface. The BuckShot wing is built in one piece for ease of construction and strength. It is important to have a truly flat surface to build this wing on. The ribs have tabs to insure a straight and true wing. This can only happen if the surface the wing is built on is truly flat.

Pin down the 1/4 x 3/16 hardwood bottom spar. Pin ribs in proper location and add the 1/4 x 3/16 hardwood top spar as well as the 1/8 square sub spar to the top of the ribs. See picture.

Add the ½ ribs in their proper location. See picture.

Next install leading and trailing edge balsa sticks to end of ribs.

Finally install the 1/16 balsa sheeting and rib cap strips in the top of the wing.

Now the wing should be stable. Remove from your table, remove the tabs and lay flat again on your table. INSTALL THE HARDWOOD WING BOLT BLOCKS AND 1/32 LIGHT PLYWOOD WEBBING IN CENTER SECTION BEFORE SHEETING!! Then finish installing the 1/16 balsa sheeting on the bottom of the wing taking care the wing is still flat.

NOTE: Install the 1/32 light plywood webbing between the main spars. As for an additional precaution you can webbing the rear spar but I have had no issues with wing strength with just webbing the main spar on the outside.

Add wingtips and trailing edge stock, install aileron torque rods, temporarily install ailerons and sand to proper shape.

NOTE: Be careful during sanding as the minimum wing thickness is 1-3/16 very close to the spar location. Do not sand too deeply or you will not be legal in the minimum wing thickness rule.

Here are some pictures. Vic chime in with some of yours!!


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Old 02-18-2009, 03:19 PM
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BobHH
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

Also make for a purdy wing too!![sm=wink_smile.gif] Weight was around 8 oz.

Bob Harris
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Old 02-18-2009, 03:52 PM
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vicman
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

Pretty much summed it up there Bob, I used slo CA for my shear ribs to speed things up a bit. When I cut the shear ribs from the long strip of ply I used tin snips, again made a fast job of it. Once I had them glued in place the wing was pretty much solid from that point on. Sheeting and cap strips were short work.
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Old 02-18-2009, 04:26 PM
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

Thanks Vic. Hey the tin snips is a good idea. WISH YOU HAD TOLD ME EARLIER!!!

OK now you’re on the final stretch.

Finish up your build with aligning and drilling the wing bolts. Add the linkage. I’ve used 1/16 wire with carbon fiber rods for pushrods for the tail. Just make sure you have no flexing of this linkage. Install 4/40 blind mounting nuts for landing gear. Carefully position the radio gear where you have no binding of the linkages. Also protect the receiver with foam.

Balance the BuckShot at the location shown. This has proven to be the best starting point for balance. You may want to shift this point around after becoming familiar with the model’s flying.

Vic’s and John’s seemed to snap around the poles. Very quick and I swear they sped up in the turns!!! So here you have the BuckShot. A tough little bird and we have the carnage to prove it!!!!!

Again if you have any questions or suggestions about this build thread please chime in. We would like to hear from you!! Until then keep BANKING and YANKING!!!! And away from those killer poles[sm=lol.gif]


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Old 02-18-2009, 04:48 PM
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

I use a sharp pair of scissors on 1/32 and 1/64 ply. Much easier and cleaner cutting than an Xacto knife.


ORIGINAL: vicman

Pretty much summed it up there Bob, I used slo CA for my shear ribs to speed things up a bit. When I cut the shear ribs from the long strip of ply I used tin snips, again made a fast job of it. Once I had them glued in place the wing was pretty much solid from that point on. Sheeting and cap strips were short work.
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Old 02-18-2009, 05:04 PM
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Default RE: BuckShot Quickie 25 Build

I agree, a scissors cuts the light ply good, just don't use your expensive Kevlar scissors on it.
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