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need info on wood glue

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Old 10-18-2006, 08:27 PM
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andrew66
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Default need info on wood glue

Hey, i was wondering which manufacturer makes the "best" wood glue? (im tired of CA fumes) I have some Pro Bond which is Elmers contractors grade that i use around the house, but dont know if its good enough for what we make. another thing, after the glue dries and cures, does freezing affect the strength of the joint? just wondering b/c i might have to store my plane/ parts in a garage until i can find a bigger apartment, and it gets darn cold here in the winter time.
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Old 10-18-2006, 09:32 PM
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Default RE: need info on wood glue

elmers wood glue (yellow) is good enough. Remember, the glue you are using is not really meant to give it superstrength. It's meant to hold the pieces together so that you can get the covering on and around the piece(s) in question. THAT is what gives it strength.

Epoxy is much stronger than CA for example but it's overkill for joining a stringer to a former. You just want it to hold it in place. There is very little stress on that joint.

Now, using epoxy to hold the firewall to the surrounding framework, that's a different story. Lot of stress there so something like epoxy is required.

Regular carpenters glue used sparingly is ideal for the general framework.

Can't answer about the cold as I store 'em in the basement.
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Old 10-18-2006, 09:33 PM
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Default RE: need info on wood glue

I frequently use Titebond amd Elmer's wood glues for construction. They work as well as CA and , IMHO, often times better than CA. They also are a little lighter in weight when dry than CA. The only "negative" is that they take time to dry so you will most likely need to clamp the parts until they dry (usually a couple of hours ).
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Old 10-18-2006, 09:58 PM
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Old 10-18-2006, 10:09 PM
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Default RE: need info on wood glue

ORIGINAL: voyager_663rd

Remember, the glue you are using is not really meant to give it superstrength. It's meant to hold the pieces together so that you can get the covering on and around the piece(s) in question. THAT is what gives it strength.


Huh? What?

I’ll agree that the covering ends up being part of the structural integrity but let’s not get carried away here. Based on your premise why not just use a glue stick for assembly, then cover. Tight, well designed joints and the proper amount and type of adhesive contribute way more to structural strength than what you cover it with.

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Old 10-18-2006, 11:44 PM
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andrew66
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Default RE: need info on wood glue

i generally like to see a joint break at the wood b4 or after the glue joint, not on the glue joint. I am just a bit leary on which ones to use. when i was in woodworking class, we had a new brand of glue in the shop (cant remember the name, that was 6 years ago) and scotch tape held better than it.
so, should i use an exterior-type glue just to be safe, not sorry. or should it not really be a concern of mine.
I wish i had a heated storage space and an actual work area, but right now just finding a place to live in alberta is a great challenge (unless you have lots of money).
It took my gf and i 3 months to find this place!
there are storage companies here, so I'll se if they have any with power
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Old 10-19-2006, 07:06 AM
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Default RE: need info on wood glue

Andrew66,
I have used both Elmer's carpenter glue and Titebond. Both are stronger than the wood itself. I even use them to attach firewalls without ever having had a failure. (Biggest engine so far is a Zenoah G-45.) I would not worry about the freezing, even though I don't know the exact glue chemistry, because the water will have long since evaporated.
Chuck
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Old 10-19-2006, 10:50 AM
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Default RE: need info on wood glue

Any of the aliphatics will work well. That is what most of the wood glues are such as Titebond, Elmers Carpenter glue etc and all make joints stronger than the wood itself if properly done. I have used aliphatics for firewalls on 1/4 scale with no problems or joint failures. In fact these glues are better than epoxy in some cases; those being using epoxy that get brittle. The brittle epoxys (not all are brittle) will shatter under shock or severe vibration where the aliphatics are slightly flexable and do not fracture under shock types of stress.
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Old 10-19-2006, 11:49 AM
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Default RE: need info on wood glue

ORIGINAL: Rodney

Any of the aliphatics will work well. That is what most of the wood glues are such as Titebond, Elmers Carpenter glue etc and all make joints stronger than the wood itself if properly done. I have used aliphatics for firewalls on 1/4 scale with no problems or joint failures. In fact these glues are better than epoxy in some cases; those being using epoxy that get brittle. The brittle epoxys (not all are brittle) will shatter under shock or severe vibration where the aliphatics are slightly flexable and do not fracture under shock types of stress.
Exactly. I have seen 10+ year old airframes (unfinished and never flown) that will snap the epoxy if looked at sideways. It's wood glue for the majority, and polyglue for the high stress areas all the way for me now! Epoxy is a great fuel proofer, and CA has it's place in certain things too.
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Old 10-19-2006, 01:12 PM
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Default RE: need info on wood glue

I'm wit you. I use aliphatic (yellow) or vinyl (white - actually "polyvinyl acetate") based glues where ever possible. The exception is where I am glassing with epoxy - like a wing joint - or for fuelproofing. I have embraced CA for lofting wings. It just goes so much quicker and with less chance of a cat jumping up on the board and flattening a rib while I slept (&%*@%#! cat!). Only need a few of the square rib jigs and you can walk right along the wing in minutes. Amazing.

Just make sure to use a lot of pins and/or weights with white/yellow glues. They have a lot of moisture and when laminating large areas, like fuselage doublers, it may warp the wood. I have a bunch of 1/2 and 1 lb lead ingots (I cast balls for muzzleloading) and they are handy as all get out for gluing on the flat. Aleens Tacky Cement is a thicker PVA (white) glue that can be thinned with water, but dries very flexible (and waterproof once dry) and is slightly gap filling as is. It's the dark gold bottle at craft stores (gives me something to look for when THE ADMIRAL is buying yarn).
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Old 10-19-2006, 01:17 PM
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Default RE: need info on wood glue

I have scratchbuilt many planes and find Weldbond an excellent glue. It remains slightly flexible unlike the yellow glues and as stated some epoxy glue. It also is excellent for gluing sheets using the masking tape method and makes great glue drop rib stitching or rivets. Far cheaper than hobby shop glues. Can also be used for contact gluing.
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Old 10-20-2006, 09:57 PM
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Default RE: need info on wood glue

Lee Valley tools published an article on the science of woodworking glues several years ago, with advantages and disadvantages of each. It does not seem to be on their website. Anyways, I use aliphatic resin (Lepage) and have never had a problem. Haven't used CA in 10 years.

LB
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