model-flying.com

I have been asked to design an new plane for a smallish company that produces quality kits. I will be designing a warbird of about 50" wingspan all wood construction. I am experienced in 3D cad and been a model flyer/builder for over 30 years. The question is, what should I charge for designing and test flying. The company wants a set price not an hourly rate.
What do you think?

stang

My Feedback: (1)

Easy enough it seems to me. I'd figure out what my time is worth multiplied by the hours I needed to draw this up and add a little "fudge factor". I would be inclined to just cover my costs in the hope of more work later should the design prove succesful. I would also ask for a percentage on each kit sold. You might make more money from that if it is a successful design.

model-flying.com

That all makes good sence but as they want a price up front, it's very dificult to work out the hours. It's like, how long is a piece of string. As you say, give a good price and I may get more work.

ppkk

If you are quoting on a fixed-price contract, I'd recommend you get the scope very clear upfront in writing (what is included and what is not.) It is difficult to get the hours right if you are not certain exactly what is included in the work. Once you have that, and if you are experienced with this type of work - which sounds like you are - then estimating your work basis the scope of supply should not be very difficult.

As to how to price it, it very much depends on what your intents are. If you want more such work in the future, it may make sense to be a little more aggressive now, but that very much depends on whether or not you have competition; you also have to understand that this first job would become the basis of any future work so consider that if you are planning on low balling it.

Regardless of what you decide to offer, realize that the company has a price they are willing to pay. Why don't you ask them straight out what they want to pay? They may not bite, but if they do, they will make an offer that is lower than their max, and this would give you a starting point to negotiate up.

RCKen

My Feedback: (9)

Another thing to consider is the scope of the design. Are you going to design the plane, give them the plans, and then you are done?? Or are you going to be required to work with them through any design changes that come up as the plane is tested?? If you are going to be required to work redesigns then you will need to think about that in your pricing. If you are going to design and walk away you can be aggressive in your pricing as others have pointed out above. But if you need to stick around through redesigns and changes I would consider asking for a portion of the final sales, as you are going to be a big part of the final product.

Ken

Ed Smith

If you have experience in 3D cad then you should have some idea how long it would take. This is an engineering drawing just like any other.

So, quote a firm price for the estimated hours at whatever the going rate is for engineering design. The quoted price is for the complete design. Any updates after should be charged at the going hourly rate. Do not do it for cheap because then you have established your rate. You will not be able to increase your rate later.

Ed S

LesUyeda

Caution. I used to build airplanes for people for fixed prices. I very shortly learned that the customer would take the approach that "while you're doing that, it won't take any more time to do this". The result was that there was always a minimum of 25% increase in the time I had to spend. I quit that, and worked by the hour only. Needless to say, the people that were looking for bargains were not happy. Eventually, the money I made was not worth the time I spent, and I quit.

Les

TFF

If you know the company well, then you know the volume and price of their kits. If they make 5000 of your plane I would want $1 for each. If they are going to make 150 you might be able to deal with them for X amount of their products or free use of their cutting skills for other designs you might come up with, because they are not going to pay $1000 if they are only going to sell $500 worth.

gsoav8r

My Feedback: (6)

I have to echo what a few have said already. Whats the scope of the job? Im having trouble understanding how the job could just be design and test fly. Sounds to me that they want a lot for little. Lets think about this a little.

Whos computer and CAD software? If its yours you might consider a use fee. None of that stuff is cheap.
Or is it thier PC and software?

If your PC and software and they have nothing compatible so they can make changes Id think your job may never be done as some others said previously.

3D design. My guess 160 hours or so. This is a no rush job. Interference and tollerance checks. Weight and balance estimates. Modeling plugs for molds that could be cut from a CNC machine (cowls, wheel pants, canopies, etc.) Do they want all that or even know its possible?

DXF files or similar?? Do they want all that produced for laser cutting. Who do they expect to figure out the best way to nest all the parts on the balsa and ply boards? That can eat up some hours.

You said they want you to build and test fly the prototype. How many hours does that take? 50 or so? Who's ponying up the building materials? What about all the goodies needed like an engine, electronics, retracts, oleos, wheels, etc??

Who is going to be doing the plans? Who is going to be taking build photos and writing the manual?

During the maiden and test flights (how many do you need?) do they want flight photos and/or video produced for their website? Who do you hire to help yo with that?

I know I left out some things but my rough estimate is... well... crazy.

About forgot. In the real world theres one thing to remember. Right, fast or cheap. You can only pick two.

Cheers,
James