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painting sig koverall

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Old 07-20-2010, 12:42 PM
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cloudancer03
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Default painting sig koverall

I finally am in the process of covering my sig 1/4 scale spacewalker..I choose to paint and use koverall fabric for a scale appearance.In fact I am going to put on a product called Pink-iTto make the seams realistic.but heres my question.I have gotten the fabric on and it came out great.but now I am not sure which way to go next.do I brush several thinned down coats of nitrate dope to seal the fabric .someone said you could substitute minwax polyacrylic?? as for painting I am thinking of using a simple latex .but is that going to be heavier than say using butrate dope.I am using a HVLP sprayer ..I want to use a base coat of white and stripe it after a fullscale I saw in florida.

would appreciate anyone who paints giving me your best ideas..as for power I am using a satio 150..
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Old 07-20-2010, 08:28 PM
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Default RE: painting sig koverall

On polyester covering such as Koverall either dope or waterbase poly acrylic will work well.
I still use dope for its ease of application and repair or touch up but their are several modern systems that get the job done using waterbase vehicles.

If you use dope brush on the first coat thinned around 50%. Nitrate is the best choice for the initial coat as it has better adhering qualities than butyrate. However on models I have used butyrate from the beginning successfully but it can be a crapshoot for base coat adhesion. It is one of those things that if it works great but if it doesn't then you have a reall mess to deal with. Just remember that you can't put nitrate over butyrate or latex paint but you can use either over nitrate.

I have a friend that used Minwax clear acrylic as the basecoat and filler coats on his Jim Pepino Waco. He used Krylon for the colors and things worked out very well.

As always the quality of sanding and filling will determine the bulk of the apperance on the finished job.
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Old 07-21-2010, 06:52 AM
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Default RE: painting sig koverall

I've used Koverall with Minwax Poly and latex on two 1/5 scale planes. I really like the water based systems, but there is a learning curve. You might have a look at [link]http://www.vaillyaviation.com[/link] for more info on using latex paint. He gives a very good tutorial on the subject. You will also need to consider a clear coat because you plan on using a nitro engine. I think you'll probably have to go with Nelson's or Klass Kote. Both are a little pricey, just so you know what you're in for
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Old 07-21-2010, 01:28 PM
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Default RE: painting sig koverall

I am going with a latex finish on my spacewalker.I am debating whether or not to brush on a thinned coat of nitrate dope..the appearance of the weave will make the finished model look even more scale as its a fabric covered plane.the base coat will be white and a color trim that I havent quite decided but I have a full scale pic of a spacewalker located in florida that I want to copy.because I am using a glow engine I will need to spray a clear coat of dope or polyurethane on the airframe to protect from fuel exhausts.


Idont want to close the weave much but I am pondering a coat of thinned nitrate first. the best latex according to valley aviation is benjaman moore exterior .theres an ingredient he suggestsd called floetrol or something like that to add to the paint.and crazy as it sounds use windshield washer to thin the latex..he said start with 20 percent and keep the paint gun pressure down.I will have to paint a couple boxes I guess to get the flow correct.

some ask why I am spending all this time and I have wondered myself but its something I wanted to try and so far the finished work is coming out well.I have spent more time on this model than anything else I have ever built but I enjoy the time spent too.
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Old 07-22-2010, 07:08 AM
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Default RE: painting sig koverall

Yes, latex thinned with Floetrol and windshield washer fluid. It works very well, but as I said, there is a learning curve. Once you get the latex to the right viscosity, it's a joy to work with. Each color has it's own characteristics so the thinning is not the same across the board. When it comes to the clear coat, you'll need something that protects against the nitro fuel but doesn't attack the latex. There's the rub! I suspect clear dope will eat at the latex, but I've never tried it. Nelson's or Klass Kote will work very well. Most poly-uerathanes will work over latex but have a tendency to yellow. That looks especially bad over white.
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Old 07-22-2010, 09:26 AM
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Default RE: painting sig koverall

yeah I agree .I dont want the yellowing effect.theres a learning curve with lots of things.before I paint the plane I suspect there will be several colored boxes.lol but I understand the adding of a paint conditioner and thinning the paint with a water based solvent.I have a new hvlp gun so wish me luck.my sons old car is sitting in my side yard ummmmmmm maybe he'll move it when he see's me trying my new gun on it.that'll get him to move it off my yard hehe.

seriously.the only thing I dont like is the gassing out takes a long time.thats why I was hoping to simply paint the koverall raw .but I guess I need to add a couple thinned coats of nitrate dope on the open weave?????some say no just paint if you dont want a smooth closed finish.and guess what color the basecoat was going to be ?yeah white with color striping maybe red or blue.
I am unclear but it sounded like I could use a water based poly ureathane to spray on the open weave as a primer???I used minwater poly water base on my se5a over monocote a couple years back and it made the shine into a matte finish and resists glow fuel..it just seems there are alot of angles here but I want to use latexas a paint.if I can paint it on direct into the koverallI can get a light finish.also the paint asorbs into the fabric and is very flexible to heat and cold and doesnt get brittle?but adding nitrate first to close the weave means waiting for a extended period for the gassing out .otherwise the latex will trap the gas and eventually lift the latex..

I still believe if I am not in a hurry I can get this thing right and be happy as I plan to build a warbird over the winter and want to cover with latex..
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Old 07-22-2010, 09:49 AM
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Default RE: painting sig koverall

I think I read on that Vailly site that he used Latex primer on Koverall and loved it. On my two Waco planes, I used Minwax Polycrylic after the Koverall was shrunk. I followed that with Auto body Hi-fill primer, several coats, then sanded most of that off. I was trying to completely fill the weave, but with all that and 3 coats of latex color added plus a clear coat, I can still barely see a weave. It looks pretty scale, I think.
This painting process can go pretty quickly once you get the process down. I had two windshield frames to paint after the primer stage. I mixed the paint, filled the gun, shot the paint and dried it with a heat gun. I repeated the spraying and drying 2 more times and then cleaned the gun. Total time was 35 minutes start to finish. Go after that car! Lots of practice area
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Old 07-22-2010, 02:40 PM
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Default RE: painting sig koverall

so are you saying if I shoot the latex directly on the koverall without any primer I will see most of the weave.??thats ok for me as the real spacewalker is a fabric plane and in doing it this way I probably will save some weight. you mentioned the water based minwax poly.I am confused ..do I spray it on direct to raw koverall let it dry and go ahead and paint the latex over that??
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Old 07-22-2010, 02:46 PM
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Default RE: painting sig koverall

is that the name brand yel for the auto body Hi-fill primer..I was going to follow vaily's directions and use benjaman moore exterior and possibly a primer too.

I never used koverall before .it went on so damn easy.I'll use it on my next big plane project as well.I was going to use nelsons covering and paint.but latex is cheap readily available and makes painting simple!
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Old 07-22-2010, 07:26 PM
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Default RE: painting sig koverall

I think the idea was to shoot latex primer directly on the Koverall, but that's not what I did. I shrunk the Koverall and shot it with Polycrylic. Then sprayed multiple coats of Hi-fill primer. The Hi-fill primer brand doesn't really matter, but lacquer based primers dry much faster. Just go to a local Auto Zone, Pep Boys, etc. Duplicolor is one brand but others work well. After the primer is dried and sanded and everything looks ready for color, you can shoot latex, provided of course, that you shot test runs on the car!
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Old 07-23-2010, 08:55 AM
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Default RE: painting sig koverall

cute cute..but my son did get a couple buyers and as soon as he pulls his scared hi blast radio out its off the property..not a great day for flying so I am going to hibernate in my workshop and finish covering.I'll let it sit at least a week and decide what color scheme to use.I'll stop in at NAPA and get the hi fill.Iwant some of the weave to be visible .I was going to shoot a basecoat of white but maybe go with another color first.some say by making the basecoat white then painting a color over it makes the color pop.actually the biggest problem with me painting is avoiding the darn bleeding under the tape..often its because I get inpatient and dont take my time and spray lite coats first letting the paint or dope seal the edges ..I also have a time trying to make round shapes and with this scheme I need to accurately make round shapes ..I am going to try a new tape "frog tape".low tack and really seems to prevent bleeding..

when you sprayed the min wax poly you used a laquer and not the water based stuff??I am trying to avoid long waiting for the stuff to gas out and figured water based and a heat gun will save time.??
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Old 07-23-2010, 01:10 PM
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Default RE: painting sig koverall

Too bad about the car/test panel! The Minwax polycrylic is water based clear. I sprayed that on first after the Koverall was shrunk tight. This was followed by hi-fill primer. After some checking, I can tell you I've used Duplicolor and Rust-o-leum. The Duplicolor is lacquer based, dries faster and sands easier, so that's the one I like best. The primer is grey but that's not a problem. The color coats went over it just fine, even the light cream color. I'll see if I can get a photo of this plane so you have an idea of all this stuff.
I had problems with bleed through on this whole plane and tried several things to remedy the situation. Part of the problem I think is the weave that we are covering is not a smooth surface. Just my .02. I did try the Frog tape with mixed results. Maybe you'll have better results. I had the best success with 3M fine line tape and black electical tape. Luckily, I had a tan pinstipe between the 2 colors and was able to hide the bleed through, which worked very well. If you try a search on paint bleed through, you'll find other methods that you might have some success with.
Once the plane is painted with latex color, you should let it cure for some time before a clear coat is applied. I waited about a month but I'm probably too cautious.
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Old 07-23-2010, 02:11 PM
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Default RE: painting sig koverall

a month?? man I want to fly it this year lol..your a bundle of joy with the tape too...you might be on to something with the weave at fault.I may just keep the trim stuff to an easy minimum..would love to see your plane..just finished the wing but am going to wait till I finish the fuse.I should have the fuse closed by the end of weekend.radio gear even installed so I am getting close.
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Old 07-23-2010, 07:20 PM
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Default RE: painting sig koverall

Photos as promised. It's an Ikon N'Wst kit of a Waco UPF-7. Behr latex paint with Klass Kote clear. I hope to have this finished for a fly in in Salt Lake in August. Work, work, work...
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Old 07-23-2010, 07:30 PM
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Default RE: painting sig koverall

BTW Cloudancer, Since you're doing a Spacewalker, you might enjoy these. I snapped them at Bomber field in Texas in June.
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Old 07-23-2010, 09:38 PM
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Default RE: painting sig koverall

did I tell you I was planning stitched ribs? I looked at 2 places..I have been talking to Pink -it.com and to-nite found a place "scale Rib & Stitch"

love the pics ..I sold my waco earlier this summer.it was a a old pica kit ymf..needed tlc and re-skinninng.

gotta get off having really bad storms .
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Old 07-29-2010, 01:51 PM
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Default RE: painting sig koverall

looked at moore paint since that was what vallincourt uses but heading to home depot and look at beher paint samples also.I think I mat use a primer automotive .sandable type and not too much letting some fabric show thru.then shoot the paint and finish with clearcoat for top finish.

how long do I let the koverall sit before priming..I cant imagine too long gas out in this heat..?
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Old 07-29-2010, 03:09 PM
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Default RE: painting sig koverall

hey yel914
who makes the two seater in the pictures and whats the wing size and motor you are usings ,thanks rye
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Old 07-29-2010, 08:13 PM
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Default RE: painting sig koverall

spoke royvallencourt and reviewd his latex paint instructions and am ready to shoot paint.but now am in a quandry as to which colors I want and what design.rather than make it complicated I want one basic color and one simple trim.
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Old 07-30-2010, 06:51 AM
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Default RE: painting sig koverall

Cloudancer, Those design details are a bear. I have a file of planes with color schemes I like, just for review in times like these. For the paint scheme, the absolute easiest would be a base color and a contrasting pin stripe from an auto body house. Beware-not all pin striping is suitable. IMHO, 3M makes the best. It sticks better that Prostripe and some other brands.
You can Poly C the Koverall after it's shrunk and let it dry in the sun for part of the day. Then it should be ready for primer.

Rye, The Spacewalker in the photos was taken at Bomber Field in Texas. I don't know anything about it, except it was very large, maybe a 12 foot wing span. On my Waco, I'll be using a DLE 30cc. Wing span is 72".
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Old 07-30-2010, 09:44 AM
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Default RE: painting sig koverall

when I spoke with roy vallencourt about stripping he said make the first few coats very light.also spray away from the edge.he has been using 3m .I gather theres a purple tape that is very good.

I was going to make my basecoat white but am re thinking that and maybe go with a primary color of red or yellow.I love diana cream and stipping could be a purplish kind.whatever I am hoping to be done next weekend and maiden sometime in august.
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Old 07-31-2010, 06:45 AM
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Default RE: painting sig koverall

Keep us posted-with pictures of course.
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Old 07-31-2010, 06:49 AM
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Default RE: painting sig koverall

be happy to share ..but today gone flying lol
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