Shark413

I have a CEN Matrix buggy with a OS .21 VZB engine and it is very fast. I had been playing with brushless motors for a while in my Revo and I was wondering how it would work in a 1/8 buggy. So I took my back-up Kyosho Kanai roller and put a brushless motor in it and powered it with a big 4S2P lipo. I went to my local track and had my brother drive the Nitro buggy and I piloted the Brushless buggy. The main straight is about 50-60 feet long, and I had previously clocked my nitro buggy at 34mph at the end of the straight (radar gun). We both punched it and the brushless buggy immediently shot ahead and pulled away from the nitro buggy. By the end of the straight the electric buggy was about 10-15 feet ahead. I could not believe how fast that brushless buggy was, the car was actually over geared for this track, and would have been even quicker if I lowered the gearing. Before I could check the speed with my radar gun I stripped all the teeth off the spur (plastic) and had to stop. Oh well, going back to my nitro buggy, I love the sound and smell of nitro in the morning.


Brushless car is the green one

Baja5BLST

I'd much rather hear which gets faster laps, than which one can go down the straight the fastest.
All of us know that electrics are faster in speed, but whether they go around the track faster, that is another question entirely, and one that is far more interesting to us.
If I wanted speed, I'd get a plane, drop in a brushless set, a 5C li-po, and watch it go 150mph.

dicko

the fastest rc car is an electric car at 136 mph. & the fastest RC surface vehicle is a boat at 140.9 mph (average of 2 runs), powered by electric. electric is faster, but nitro is cheaper to set up for the same speed. i run both & love each for their own.

junebug48

My Feedback: (138)

[8D]hi . i heard that electric 1/8th buggy's are faster on the track with brushless motor's in them then nitro's but have not seen any . thank's .

Coopz

Electric are a lot faster, ever seen a 1/10th 4wd buggy running a 9 turn Hurricane engine?

rrusso

actualy the fastest rc in the world is a nitro clocked at200mph,but the cars you are talking about yes a brushless is faster in a straight line,but that would only last for about 5 of laps,then your battires would loose there punch and the nitro wouldent.besides a electric would be too light to control at full blast and the nitro would lap you in a long race

GRANT ED

The 200mph car is a tether car which does not really count.
To answer this question by just saying a blanket statement "brushless is faster" is ridiculous. Without a shadow of a doubt I could put a brushless motor in a buggy that would be slower than the slowest nitro. There are many different power levels of brushless motor. You cant compare brushless to nitro without some kind of level playing field. You can get brushless motors that have the same output as 50cc gas motors. Put one of these in a buggy and of course it will be quicker, this is because it will be compared to a buggy with a 3.5cc nitro engine. For a fixed lowish price nitro would most likely be faster as the top end electrics are mega $$'s. Without a set of rules or at least parameters to go by the comparison is worthless.

rrusso

lol why notits rc and its nitro

RURC

You cant get the same speed out of nitro. That is why the BL set ups are the record holders. This is not a put down to nitro it is just fact.

46u

My Feedback: (3)

I agree electric is faster but has no solo! If they do away with nitro I will give up the hobby other then my Mini-Z’s in the house on my RCP track. Now on another note nitro is MUCH more popular!!!!!!!!!! Run what ever suits you and remember the main thing about this hobby is to have fun!

aangelet

Provided that you have some idea of what you are doing, electric is easier than nitro. It's also cleaner. I guess electric is the lazy man's route. Whenever I go out to the track, I on the average get almost twice the track time that my buddies do because I don't have to mess with anything. I just plug in and go.

One thing that I would like to address is the statement above about the battery in an electric giving out after five laps and then the nitro moving ahead. The guy that said that obviously has never run a lithium polymer battery. My truggy, with a 4S2P 8000mAh pack will easily run for half an hour and have as much punch at the end as it does at the start.

An electric 1/8 buggy is capable of much higher speeds than a nitro, depending on the battery and motor/esc setup. If you are building a buggy for running on a track, you really do want to keep things mild. I have to use my truggy as an example, because my buggy is setup for nothing but parking lot racing. I have my truggy setup with a Quark speed controller, a Neu 1512/1.5Y motor (very mild), with the 4S 8Ah pack. With this setup, the motor spins up to about a max of 25,000 rpms. I have it geared at 14/46 and it is just a tad bit faster than the fastest nitro rig I've seen at my track. If someone shows up with something that is faster, I just gear up a tooth or two on the pinion. The bottom end isn't affected much when I gear up because a brushless motor has more than enough torque to spare.

I just go for the extra little bit of speed just because I can, but it isn't the real advantage of running electric. The real advantages come with the instant power. Assuming that there are two drivers of similar ability, the electric will usually have the advantage. There is no waiting for the motor to spool up to get to the power band. The electric will accelerate more quickly coming out of turns, and setting up for jumps isn't as important. I can clear the big triple on my track from a standing start with 5 feet of runway. The acceleration is just monstrous.

As for all out speed, like I said, my buggy is setup for parking lot racing. We race at a local Academy Sports and guys show up with buggies, monster trucks, truggies, and a BUNCH of Jato 3.3s. There have even been a few on road cars like TC3s and 4-Tecs. I've never been beaten my a nitro powered vehicle. I'm not saying that there isn't a nitro powered vehicle out there that could be my buggy. I'm just saying that I haven't had it happen yet. When it does happen, I'll just move to a higher voltage system that will take more gearing.

Of course, going fast with a vehicle that wasn't meant to go fast has its problems. Problems like breaking the nubs off of dog bones, blowing tires off of wheels and the buggy flipping at 60+ mph, INCREASED wear on all of the drive line parts, etc.

RURC

That coming from someone that has built brushless 1/8 scale cars is offensive. Building one of these is not just like bolting a new nitor motor. How do I come to this conclusion, Ihave built no less than 15 1/8 buggies / truggies, also 3 HPI Baja's, 1/5 scale TechnoKit and more. Not to mention that I am in the process of a complete ground up design and build of the first factory 1/8 buggy for brushless. I assure that getting to the point where the buggy really works is not LAZY. I bust my butt to make it not equal too but better than the original nitro counterpart. And I mean better in every way I can. If the handling is not better then it is not right. You dont just bolt in a electric motor and hook up some batteries and go to town. Now what I do at the track is I gear to be just slower than the fastest guy out there. I do this because I assume that the fastest guy out there is running on the edge of the envelope for the track. I will make up any loss in speed when I go for over an hour with out a pit stop.

Nitro will not go away but if the sanctioning bodies get off their collective (wallet padded) butts and start working on races with brushless systems there will be no stopping it from becoming the top force out simply because of its power and speed. All rc is good and we have fun no matter which we go.

For the guy that would quit if nitro went away, well get over it and look toward the future. Things always change. Imaging if we were all still using PC's with the 8088 processor in them. Things change and progress this is the nature of man.

aangelet

RURC, Hey, I've built quite a few electric conversions myself, and after having run them, I can say that they are the lazy man's route.

When I was running nitro, I had to pack three or four boxes into my truck for a day at the track. Now, I only have to pack two. When I ran nitro, a day at the track was followed by clutch, bearing, and engine maintenance. I don't have to do any of that any longer. When I ran nitro, I used to have to run down off of the driver's stand every 8 minutes or so to refuel. Now that I run electric, I run for 30 minutes at a time and when it's time for a battery change, I'm ready for a break anyway. When my truck flips over on the track, I walk, not run to flip it back over. With nitro, you have to charge receiver packs, the starter box battery, and glow ignitor. With electric, all I have to worry about is the lipo packs and they charge so quickly that I don't worry about whether they are fully charged when I leave home. Electric large scale is a lazy guy's rc dream.

I don't consider the time to do the conversion to be work. I think it's fun.

I'm a die hard electric guy. I haven't run nitro in a long time and don't miss it. It just kind of ticks me off that I can't run in any of the points series or "official" races at my local track because my equipment isn't "legal." I refuse the run nitro just to conform.

BTW, what motors and escs are you running in the 1/5 scale stuff? What battery configuration? I've been wanting to do something really big. Maybe and FG or something.

With your 1/8 scale stuff, do you go motor forward or to the rear? Single or dual battery packs? Just looking to compare notes.

dbuggyracer

i am a nitro guy all the way but if you give 2 guys at equal driving skills and had a race i would think the electric would win just becouse of the smoother power band it makes the car more controllable driving out of corners and such but it is really hard to say but to me 8th scale is all about the nitro smell and sound they arent nothing like it. i would say get your car fixed and let somebody drive the nitro with equal skill as you and see who wins.

aangelet

I used to feel like that about nitro and originally got into the whole brushless thing for the performance. I now appreciate electrics for much more than just the performance. I actually find the smell of nitro annoying now. I don't miss the noise either.

RURC

Well we will all it a point where we cannot agree. I consider the electric systems to be more tolerant but not easy. I assure that the way I build them there is nothing easy in them. Yes I go to the track with less junk then before but that is because I have spent tons of time getting the rest lined out so it looks easy. I spent 15 years with Porsche Motorsports in Germany building and tuning race cars for hte most demanding races in the world. Electric is not easier than fuel powered.

I fail to see what is lazy about this. It seems to me that you have become smarter not lazy. Remember the saying "Work smarter not harder". You are there now. You are smarter not lazy.

It is fun but I also have to build to my clients needs and wants. This presents special problems in the builds at times.

I feel your pain in this. I have been running the bodies crazy on this. Until they get paid off (like they are now) by BL electric manufacturers this will not change, unless the racers demand it. And they are lazy because they are comfortable where they are now and cant handle change in any aspect.

I have run Lehner 2230 motors and New Bam and a Plennberg Bolito (sp?). All have used custom 300 amp Schulze controllers. 6 cell lipo at 20,000 mah. The Technokit used a Mamba Max with a 1512/1Y/F with 5 cell lipo 10,000.

Both depending on the client wants.

chickenfart

I reckon its about the whole package, I dont dislike electric or anything, but I've seen them race and its so boring, no smoke no noise, just cars zipping around quickly. I appreciate their speed but come on, you electric guys have gotta admit that nitro's are pretty spectacular to watch, I'd rather be down at the track with a nitro any day. Theres no feeling like burying the trottle and hearing your machine crack into life and seeing everyone turn around to try find what is making that noise.
I'm sure nitro guys could also gear up a tooth or two as well, or up the nitro content, or put a different pipe on or just get a bigger donk thats faster than yours, your claims mean nothing. I can also say that no electric has ever beaten my nitro where I race......means nothing.

That ones an insult to the guys that broke that record, thats impressive, how the hell do you control an rc car at 200kmh, I don't blame em for tethering it!

Theres always gunna be this debate but I think that they both have thier merits, some people don't like stuffing around so they go electric, some people love the nitro experience. It comes down to personal preference, at the end of the day its about what you love to do, personally I love nitro's......the next guy may like electric.....who cares as long as we can all get along and have a great time, the day i'm not having a blast is the day i quit.

aangelet

chickenfart,

Where have you had to opportunity to run against an 1/8 scale electric? Your statements really just reflect your ignorance of what a brushless system is capable of.

I'm glad that you enjoy the noise so much, but it isn't the noise that gets the vehicle moving.

I'd also like to point out that going up a couple of teeth in a nito rig doesn't yield the same results as when you do it with a brushless system. Going from a 14T clutchbell to a 16T clutchbell will yield a better top end, but at the cost of bottom end. With a brushless system, going up two teeth or three teeth adds a lot to the top and the sacrifice on the bottom is negligible (to a point). Electric motors don't have to wait to hit a powerband. 100% of the torque is available as soon as the rotor starts turning.

As for my comments about speed being meaningless, the title of this thread asks, "What's faster Nitro or Electric?" If you've never been beaten by an electric, you've never run across a brushless that was setup for speed.

GRANT ED

It does not count because it does not hold the record. Having a car on a wire that runs around in circles is not RC. They could not steer it. To qualify for the speed record they must make two runs, one in either direction through a speed trap. That car was incapable of complying with the rules.

dicko

Chickenfart, is it KPH or MPH?? 200 KPH is only 124 MPH, that's slower than the record electric. RC is RC, if it's on a string it's not RC.

j_blaze

I say if electric 1/8 is so much faster, where is it? I only see nitro at the track or in magazines, I haven't seen 1/8 races buggy or truggy on the pro circuit yet. I can't even find a video on youtube. I only see small electrics here and they fly, losi, kyosh and AE. They are smaller and can't make the big jumps. Nitro is way more complicated, specially tuning the engine. with electric, once you have the right batteries, charger and motor/esc combo, you're pretty much set, but it is so quiet. I like nitro myself.

rrusso

lol you guys are a riot.electric things mixed with dust[X(]thats a disaster waiting to happen.a nitro beats a electric around a track 9 times out of ten.they are too light.if you are raceing in a straight line in parking lots thats a different story.and about lipos how about raceing a supercherged rb 5 with a 16t on boat fule.. lmao.i garentte you loose.mine as well compare apples to apples here not apples to oranges[X(]

aangelet

You guys that don't have any experience with brushless just don't have any clue.

j blaze, the reason that you don't see them at the track all of the time, is because large scale electrics are relatively new and aren't roar legal, yet. Since you don't see it on the track, I guess that's supposed to mean that it isn't better. I can remember when it wasn't legal to run the latest and greatest 3700 nimh cells. Did that mean that they weren't better? No. All it meant was that the sport hadn't caught up with the technology yet. If you can't find any videos on youtube, you haven't looked hard enough.

rrusso, I've been running brushless for a few years now and run in sand and dirt all of the time. I'd say that my electric stuff handles sand and dirt much better than my nitro stuff did. As far as electrics being too light, I don't know what you're talking about. I'm talking about electric 1/8 scales. As far as all out speed goes, you can supercharge, turbocharge, or feed nitrous to whatever nitro engine that you want. There is an electric setup that will take it in a straight line run.

Here's a link to a video of my 8ight T that is setup for the track. It's running a mild 9XL motor with mild gearing.

[link=http://s154.photobucket.com/albums/s265/ajangelettejr/?action=view&current=DSCF0303-1.flv]Electric 8ight T[/link]

When was the last time that you saw a nitro truggy pull a wheelie.

RURC

This always ends up here. Pety arguements about semantics not facts. You cant judge the fastest by the smell or your feelings. Basically ou have to get to the cold hard facts of what is what in the RC world. I really love it all, nitro electric; brushed, brushless; nitro methane, gasoline; it is all good fun. However at the end of the day the records are and continue to become dominated by brushless electric. The boat and car records are owned by electric. The quickest planes are electric as are the fastest accelerating helicopters. this is learned at the Jet Fest in Lakeland Florida. I cannot find information on the absolute fastest planes but I will continue to look but I can only see that electric will not win in a vs jet area. The jet will be faster due to the expansion of the fuel rate being able to over come the rpm of an electric. The facts are that electrics are and continue to set the records. I have even seen brushless electric 1:1 cars blow the doors off Ferrari's and GT1 Porsche's. It is not that electric is better it just has different strengths.

rrusso

lolno feed back on raceing around a trac a.thats what i thought[X(]take your brushless to a trac and run against some nitros.you will get lapped.and they are too light to control at high speeds.you would be all over the place with that thing.and dont have the weight or power to make the double and triple jumps.nitros have more torqe,that is a FACT.stap a brick to your brushless it will keep it on the track longerall a brushless does is burn out in the loose stuff.there is no weight to get enof grip.as far as your electronics loveing dirt that is a joke esc hate dust.run with me for a day at a sand pit and your can would be full of dust,and your esc would malfunction.im sorry a modded rb can turn 45000 rpm.with alot more torque than a electric could dream of.you are in a dream world if you honestly think a brushless can beat a good nitro around a track.[sm=punching.gif] ask any 1[:-]