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-   -   i'm back, need more buggy advice (http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/rc-1-8th-scale-buggies-244/11373372-im-back-need-more-buggy-advice.html)

Nitro Pop 01-17-2013 05:22 AM

i'm back, need more buggy advice
 
ok, anything anyone has told me so far, forget you ever told me it. please assist me by these standards, i need a 1/8 buggy (or truggy but i doubt truggy due to my budget) that follows a path like this

BUDGET: $600-$700

ELECTRIC/NITRO: electric

KIT/ROLLER/RTR: kit or roller perferably due to i want to use electronics

ESC: mamba monster max 2(waterproof), or tekin RX8

MOTOR: neu-castle 1515 2200kv(can be run on 6s)

RADIO: spektrum DX2s or DX3c (which is better, what should i go with)

SERVO: ???? (need most assistance here{would like waterproof if possible}, what would be 7/10[minimum. could be higher]speed and torque wise for both bashing and racing)

BATTERY: 4S lipo 5000mah or more with enough amps (Mah * C rating / 1000?) to spare for the motor-esc combo i chose that is roar legal(roar legal not neccesary though)

DURABILITY: 7.75/10 minimum

RACEABLITY: zero to moderate modification/additions/extra money to make it race/comp ready

PARTS SUPPORT: 7/10 minimum

AFTERMARKET SUPPORT(HOP UPS): (minimums) 6/10(amount of hop ups) 8/10(qualityof hop ups)




LIPO CHARGER: quality 7.75/10 minimum, something that can plug into a wall (no seperate power supply needed) and can charge (preferably 2-3 batteries at a time, but just 1 will be sufficient) Li-po/Li-fe/Li-whatever up to 6sand Nimh up to w/e is = to 6s in 2 hours or less (preferably 1.5-1 hour or less). (confusing part for me coming up) any other things needed, i'm guessing it has to be a balancing charger and maybe overvolt/overcharge protection and maybe discharge to minimum before recharging?

note: if i missed anything, ANYTHING else, please tell me and i'll make a spec above for it (under aftermarket support but before charger due to charger being a long paragraph)<br type="_moz" />

Foxy 01-17-2013 06:53 AM

RE: i'm back, need more buggy advice
 
Well first of all, you shouldn't really include batteries and charger in your budget for the car. You are severely limiting what cars are possible. Furthermore, the electric combos you mention are nearly half your budget on their own. You are definitely going to have to settle for cheaper (but no compromises, except waterproofing which can be done to any ESC) electrics.

So I'm going to try to aim for $600 with my recommendations WIHTOUT batts and charger. I'll recommend economical batts and charger at the end.

You'd prefer a truggy, but a buggy will do...ok...

Truggy:

Chassis: Hot Bodies D8T - $335 at amain, maybe slightly cheaper elsewhere
Conversion: Tekno V4 - $135 at amain
Radio: Flysky GT3b - $42 at hobbypartz (forget spektrum, they offer nothing over this $40 radio, and extra spektrum receivers are $40 minimum, extra receivers for the flysky are $8, this is agreat radio for anything from basic to racing use).
Servo: Hitec 5645 - $47 at amain
ESC: Turnigy Trackstar 150A - $68 at hobbyking
Motor: Hobbywing Xerun 2000kv - $85 at hobbypartz

That's $712 and is about the cheapest you could do a truggy buying everything new. If you pick up an already converted second hand rolling chassis on ebay, you will save a lot.


Now the buggy, much more realistic, as you noted yourself...

Chassis: OFNA LX2e kit - $200 at amain
Radio: as truggy.
Servo: as truggy.
ESC: as truggy (you gain nothing buying castle or tekin over this, I promise, at least, not in the ESC department, in the motor department, it IS worth spending more)
Motor: Tekin 2000kv Truggy motor (yes, the TRUGGY motor, its bigger and stronger, there's no kill like overkill ;)) - $160 at amain. You would still be fine with the cheap motor I mentioned above, but this WILL be better. Twice the price better is debatable, but you have the available budget now due to the phenomenal bargain that is the LX2e.

That's $520ish without charger and batts.

For charger and batts...

Charger: IMAX B6-AC (GENUINE, not clone) - $40 at hobbyking.
Batts: 4s: Turnigy Nanotech 5000mAh 35C - $53 each at hobbyking.
Batts: 6s: Turnigy Nanotech 5000mAh 35C - $82 each at hobbyking.

Options...

If you want to spend more on the chassis, an RC8Be might be an option, but it will offer little over the LX just for bashing and is double the price.
If you want to spend more on a servo, you could go for an XP DS1015, $100 at amain.
If you want to spend more on an ESC, and waterproof is important to you, you could go for the new mamba monster as you suggested, but its a LOT more money, again for little gain.

Nitro Pop 01-17-2013 07:02 AM

RE: i'm back, need more buggy advice
 
can the esc-motor combos in BOTH run 6s without voiding the warrenty or otherwise screwing it up??

Foxy 01-17-2013 07:07 AM

RE: i'm back, need more buggy advice
 
Absolutely.

Foxy 01-17-2013 07:25 AM

RE: i'm back, need more buggy advice
 
Actually, I'm gonna go with this motor (since the other 2 are sensored and you don't need sensored), it's a well known good motor, and there are a couple on ebay. I would have mentioned it earlier, they usually have it at hobbypartz, but its out of stock. Yes, it'll eat up 6S and laugh :)

Here's a good priced one...[link=http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LEOPARD-RC-Model-4274-KV2000-Red-4-Poles-R-C-Inrunner-Brushless-Motor-Engine-/321026273591?pt=US_Character_Radio_Control_Toys&ha sh=item4abea83137]Leopard 4274[/link]

Nitro Pop 01-17-2013 07:29 AM

RE: i'm back, need more buggy advice
 
this is very interesting, as almost everything i've heard basically says "if it ain't castle or tekin, it just ain't no good"
same with the spektrum tx/rx that and futaba(for helis, but that's a WHOLE different world)

also im not sure about the servo, even the better one, it just seems lacking in torque, for an 8th scale, in my eyes 200 would be more suitable in a 10th scale. anything around
<b style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 13px; line-height: 19px;">Torque:[/b]<span style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 13px; line-height: 19px;">300-350 oz/in @ 6V
</span><b style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 13px; line-height: 19px;">Transit Time:[/b]<span style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 13px; line-height: 19px;"></span><span style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 13px; line-height: 19px;">0.15</span><span style="font-family: Verdana, Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 13px; line-height: 19px;">-0.075 sec/60&deg; @ 6V
also are there any videos you can link me to showing these speeds next to eachother like a 0.15 vs 0.10 vs 0.075 video?
lastly would i need some kind of voltage limiter/regulator for these as not to run 14.8 volts through them causing explosion/fire?? what is that even called? do most servos have them already?

(and im sure you might tell me 200 is all that's needed but i'm the kind that needs reassurance, insurance, backup, and spare so i need at least the 300 :) )<br type="_moz" /></span><br type="_moz" />

Nitro Pop 01-17-2013 07:32 AM

RE: i'm back, need more buggy advice
 

Quote:

ORIGINAL: Foxy

Actually, I'm gonna go with this motor (since the other 2 are sensored and you don't need sensored), it's a well known good motor, and there are a couple on ebay. I would have mentioned it earlier, they usually have it at hobbypartz, but its out of stock. Yes, it'll eat up 6S and laugh :)

Here's a good priced one...[link=http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LEOPARD-RC-Model-4274-KV2000-Red-4-Poles-R-C-Inrunner-Brushless-Motor-Engine-/321026273591?pt=US_Character_Radio_Control_Toys&am p;hash=item4abea83137]Leopard 4274[/link]
is that one better than both the tekin and the one you put for the truggy? is it like best of both, ie power and perfection of the tekin with a low price?

edit: forgot to mention earlier, that ESC looks pretty much like an RX8<br type="_moz" />

Foxy 01-17-2013 07:38 AM

RE: i'm back, need more buggy advice
 
OK, the Castle and Tekin snobs (I run castle in many of my cars by the way), are just snobs justifying their purchases.

Almost all the Chinese 150A ESCs have proved every bit as powerful and reliable over and over again.

The motors are another matter. Castle do make excellent motors, much better than the Chinese ones in most cases, however, you have to consider whether the extra 'quality' really equates to much for what you want to do. If you are not racing, it counts for sod all. I stand by that Leopard motor in every way, my friend has one in his RC8Be and it flatout tears stuff up on 4S let alone 6S.

As for the servo, again, you are going WAAAAY over the top on torque requirements.

A truggy needs 200oz-in, a buggy needs 150 or more. Also, torque rating is not the be-all and end-all of how long a servo will last. The quality of the internals is what really counts, and the internals don't get a lot higher quality than the XP DS servos. I will put anything you like on the line when I say over 200oz-in is nice, but not at all necessary at 1.8th scale in ANY application, including monster trucks. My 6S savage ran on one of those XP DS1015s until I got rid of it. That servo is now in my Xray XT8 (e-converted truggy). I've been using these servos in 1/8th and 1/5th cars for bashing and light racing for over 10 years, they have never failed me, not even a gear swap, and I have owned 7 (3 I still own and are going strong, the others were sold with models).

If you really want a 300oz-in servo, you should look at the high voltage Savox ones and use a programmable BEC to run them at 7.4v. The servos will cost $120 ish and the BEC another 30-40. If you are into safety, you will want an external BEC no matter what you do, it takes all the servo load OFF your expensive ESC and makes the ESC run cooler and more stably.

I absolutely assure you though, a GOOD QUALITY 200oz-in is already overkill, especially on a buggy.

Foxy 01-17-2013 07:42 AM

RE: i'm back, need more buggy advice
 
Quote:

ORIGINAL: Nitro Pop


Quote:

ORIGINAL: Foxy

Actually, I'm gonna go with this motor (since the other 2 are sensored and you don't need sensored), it's a well known good motor, and there are a couple on ebay. I would have mentioned it earlier, they usually have it at hobbypartz, but its out of stock. Yes, it'll eat up 6S and laugh :)

Here's a good priced one...[link=http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LEOPARD-RC-Model-4274-KV2000-Red-4-Poles-R-C-Inrunner-Brushless-Motor-Engine-/321026273591?pt=US_Character_Radio_Control_Toys&ha sh=item4abea83137]Leopard 4274[/link]
is that one better than both the tekin and the one you put for the truggy? is it like best of both, ie power and perfection of the tekin with a low price?

edit: forgot to mention earlier, that ESC looks pretty much like an RX8<br type=''_moz'' />
Yeh, funny thing, from what I'm reading the last 2 years, that ESC is better than the Tekin. lol.

The Leopard motor is a well known high performance 1/8th truggy motor for a great price, so once again, it'll be overkill in the buggy. You won't miss anything over the other motors, though I wouldn't tell you you were wasting your money if you insisted on a Castle 1515 (2200kv), as its what I run in 2 cars and its a flippin incredible motor. Aside from that, the two motors I mentioned above are both sensored, which is just not needed with a sensorless ESC like the Turnigy, despite the fact it should run them without a sensor cable just fine.

Nitro Pop 01-17-2013 08:11 AM

RE: i'm back, need more buggy advice
 
so out of all 4 motors
the castle 2200
the tekin 2000 truggy
the leopard 2000
and the hobbywing 2000
which is the best bang for the buck? which is the best period? second best?

Foxy 01-17-2013 08:29 AM

RE: i'm back, need more buggy advice
 
Best bang for buck=Leopard
Best sensorless = Castle 1515 (my opinion, as someone who runs them)
Best sensored = Tekin

Second best sensorless = Leopard
Second best sensored = Hobbywing

My opinion, others may have other products in mind, but nobody will tell you that the Castle/Neu motors aren't the best sensorless ones at street prices, cos they pretty much are.

Nitro Pop 01-17-2013 08:33 AM

RE: i'm back, need more buggy advice
 
last thing, did you like my format?

sidequestion, what runtimes am i looking at with those 5000mah?

Foxy 01-17-2013 08:44 AM

RE: i'm back, need more buggy advice
 
Format? The way you laid out the original post? Yes, made it very easy to help you.

Runtime; non-stop racing, about 18 mins. Stop and start bashing, about 25mins to half an hour, depending how hard you are on it.

I get a half hour comfortably at the bash spot from 5000mAh (which is what I use too) with a castle 2200 and a middle-geared truggy (14t pinion, 46t spur). You should get more in the lighter buggy if you stop and start as often as I do, to either chat or help someone else, or set up a stunt, etc.

Oh, and you will get slightly (another 4-5 mins) better runtimes from 6S than 4S, all other things being equal, not sure why this is, but it just is. :)

Nitro Pop 01-17-2013 09:24 AM

RE: i'm back, need more buggy advice
 
i did the math and i'd prefer a 6500mah 35c pack anything you know of that's good, with a good price too (not over maybe $65-70 for 4s preferably about the same as the nano-techs)?

Foxy 01-17-2013 10:50 AM

RE: i'm back, need more buggy advice
 
You're asking a lot there, in terms of capacity at 4S and price. I know of no reasonably priced battery that matches the criteria, and a 'reasonable' price for such a pack would be 80ish bucks.

Here're some options...

2S in pairs...
Good: http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...Lipo_Pack.html
Cheap: http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...r_Lipoly_.html
May be of interest: http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...ePo4_Pack.html (gonna need some creativity to fit them I expect, but they are only slightly larger than usual, 52 width might be an issue, but woooo, 2 of these will give you good juice and runtime) but out of stock atm.

4S over 5000mAh is only really these (I checked some other Chinese makers and found the same story). Cheap though:

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...4S1P_30C_.html


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