RC HAWAIIAN STYLE

cananzi

YPC

Hi Maui John...........that is a very interesting picture............and 'take' on tail rocker..........your being POSITIVE.............the first I have seen.

Most guys would be running "NEGATIVE' tail rocker ....To keep the nose down/board from bouncing......like the Kyhoso boards tail wedge......and teh many JIMI rockers.

Positive rocker.........it is believed.......would only 'exaggerate' the nose lift and bouncing..........even rc boats run negative trim tabs to stop porpoising and nose lift.

When I built this board............I allowed 3mm (1/8") positive tail rocker......as it is easy to add rocker when the board is built, but not possible to remove.

I did expect to add negative rocker...........yet................the board runs sweet as it is.

I have a 5 degree thrust angle.......43% CG ..........and a different tail shape............it may also be the pod ......................

Dominic (Bro'Surfer)

Cananzi

John

I run a very small amount of negitve tail rockerroughlyafew degrees. I actually liked my board better with out the tail rocker in the small-med surf as it would throw the tail easyer and ride out etc but becuase i made this board more for conditions like you guys get i decided to go with the tail rocker.

Giving up your tail secrets!!Its very interesting seeing what you are using, not sure if its the picture angle but when ilook at your rail line on your board the rail looks like they are negitive compared to straight ,maybe this is giving you the same nose down effect still but allowing you to have a positive tail rocker.

So many possiblities with these things i guess thats what hooks people in to build a full custom.



Dom

how did the leopard go?

trippergreenfeet

Has anyone thought of using a flex tail setup like some of the old school board shapers used?

What are your thoughts, would this be of advantage if the tail was thin enough and had sufficient flex to enable tail rockler change at low and high speed? Or would the flex give the opposite to the preferred rocker at speed to stop the bounce effect?

kitekook

I was wondering if you could have beautiful full tail rockers with servo adjustable trim tabs

Step on the gas(electricity),the trim tabs extend, preventing the dreaded Tail hop.....off the gas and when using gravity on the wave face...trim tabs come back flush and you use that beautiful tail rocker to carve sweeeeet turns.


My first few boards had full tail rockers...they were sweet turning under their own power...nose went for the sky, motor hopped, and just plowed water under power.

That was all put on the back burner back then in an effort to get to the Surf...




edit: My current build: I went to great pains to make sure I was FLAT out the back..I use 5 deg vee for the first 5inches past mid point tapering to 15 deg Vee out the back the last 12inches....Nikki will let you know in about a week...

kitekook

Boardshark fans......
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1705862

kitekook

WOW! Look at all this foam...

http://www.surfertoday.com/videos/73...ead-surfboards

surfcurls

The Shark Board Looks stock, Yet Claims High Performance

Qoute From Listing
"Price is $100 + shipping.
Here's one in action"

The Video Is ACTUALLY From High Performance Dave / Spencer Mods With Kyosho.

So, if I buy this stock Shark board will I get the same results ?
Sounds like that is what he says...

Cananzi

Tripper / Kite

Where you been hiding these ideas?

Its all definitely worth a shot. I think karl is already doing the trim tab idea, I wonder what the results were.

trippergreenfeet

The flex tail idea popped into my head as soon as I read your last post.

There must be a definate thoery re thephysical effect at differents speeds using a tail like this, ie. water flowing under the flex area at different speeds creating a downward or upward force.

Maybe Dom with his boat experience can add some value to this idea?

YPC

Hi Guys

Its interesting to see the 'tail rocker' discussion and various views.

From my boating experience......there is no hard and fast rule........some boats run trim tabs.........some dont...........some run positive..........some run negative.......There are certainly a good number of 'other factors' that will contribute to the 'vessels' ride.

Hull design - CG - Thrust Line angle - weight - prop - motor power etc etc.

From my recent experience with the surfers........I am finding that Weight and CG plays a significant part in keeping the board down as well as a relatively flat tail rocker.........compensating for rocker by increasing the nose rocker.

As for the 'add on's'.........................I try to keep it SIMPLE............I have raced boats with power trim - power lift - ballast tanks etc etc...........you spend more time getting it wrong that right.................

I reckon we have seen enough 2 channel boards "ripping' to know they work..............its just a 'challenge' in getting it all right to start with.............negative trim should be the LAST RESORT.

Dominic (Bro'Surfer)

Cananzi

dom


Imo I think theres no right or wrong with tail rocker it depends what you want from a board.

Kinder like when surfboard shapers figured out that toeing in the fins on a thruster increased the boards turning ability .....yeah creates drag but improves turning performance. I think same applies for slight negitive tail rocker or negitive rails they create slight drag but improves the performance.


After seeing MJ's tail i am very keen on experimenting with that type of rail and tail design.

Melololo

Hey bro, is this your surfer showed in the photo?
www.banggood.com/Wholesale-No_757-600-1-8-Rc-Speedboat-Remote-Control-Racing-Boat-p-48059.html
haha, to tell you the truth, im a vendor of rc stuffs and i've prtested this surfer before, very cool.
actually comparing the lifeless(never mind, this is a only word i can figure out ) model, i prefer somethig with a head at least.
lurk for so long, newbie say hello.

bearcave

Hi guys.

While you are on the tail rockerthing Ithought i might add some more food for the chew.

George Greenough was the ultimate flexy boarder. As a kneeboarder he could move his weight around and use his fins to balance/trim his flexy spoons in all size waves but as TGF said it may work backwards with an rc surfer.

I am not a fan of negative wedge.... its just not right..... then again at high speed maybe it is.
Useing a bi-fin with downforce to counteract a neg rocker could work but extra power needed to do this seems to be quick fix for bad initial design....

Anyway one of my boards is a board shark. I stripped it out but left the deck original with the feet, then mounted a 'lisa' just behind the feet for testing purposes. (The leaning dude isbroken butin storage for another day)

The nqd has a flat rocker, the kyosho positive with a tab, the std board shark positive rocker.....I have modified them all but on the shark Ifitted some brass tubes so i could make some different tails to attach and see what happens..... (see pics)

Facts are if the cg is around 50% which all my boards are the shark goes great with this no.1 shape of alloy sheet tail.... I was thinkin of a flexy tail and many other shapes but have yet to get there yet.... and then there is the water release factors around hard and soft rails, not to mention the razor thin rails of this tail!.

PS i have foundthe std shark with its hard rails almost the whole length of the board handles much different to the others.... i even filled in the cut-outs ofan nqd with foam then shaped them so i could get a softer rail through the board until the tail which made a big difference turning but....... Shark is flat to turn(2D) nqd also flatter toturn with filled in sidecuts but soft rails morereal... cut outs in rails along the length of kyosh/nqd must mean something but maybe they are saying....Vee vee vee.. please!

ANYWAY i hope i haven't boredyou with my thoughts. I have always thought agood hull and weight distribution with a3 channel radio flexing the tailwhen needed could be a go...

All the best guys.. Bear.

YPC

Hi Cananzi.............the Leopard motor is 'purring'..............I have only run one flat water test............ it has plenty of power and definitely pushes higher 'working' RPM.
I decided to do the initial tests with the 27mm prop..... thinking I would prop up to the 30mm ...but the 27mm it is actually fast and punchy enough for now......

Bearcave..........my boards have a Soft 50/50 rail up front....tapering to a Sharp tail rail............in the turn......the forward rail needs to tuck into the water, allowing water flow 'over' the rail and the tail needs to carve the water, breaking the flow over the rail with the sharp edge.

Simple way to seal the Drive shaft end- fit a piece of silicon tube ( tight fitting) over the flex-shaft/drive shaft protruding out of the stuffing tube. Press it against the rim of the stuffing tube....that should form a good seal without creating excessive drag.

'Sea-ling'........the batteries........ A quick way to seal the batteries is with some Prestick.....Duct tape......Insulation tape...............if you want your batteries to last...this is a MUST.......one dunk of salt water and your battery will be sure to corrode....which rhymes with 'explode'................

Prevention is BETTER than any CURE !

Dominic (Surfer)

PS - Melololo - that is definitely NOT my rc surfer..............LOL.............I'm South African..........and make my boards 'myself'

YPC

Hopefully........a simple DIY ' Video Camera' solution.....................some film will be better than 'no film'........

Takes five minutes to install, Cost $1 - and you have a 'camera mount'.......

Dominic (Bro'Surfer)

PS- I will be selling the KITS.................LOL

RC HAWAIIAN STYLE

bearcave

George Greenough is my hero , i was a kid at sunset Cliff's in the late 70ds when he would ride in the tube forever ,the rest of us were happy to stand up,



kite the way i combated the dreaded hop is,,, i moved were the prop up about a 1in. or 2ins. ,now the push is coming from farther up and can not hop .

MJ dom what do you think

kitekook

I noticed that while you were here in town...after Bro Down I took the dremel to my boards moved the pod and did away with the Jimi Rocker once and for all. Made an immediate difference....the board hopping was (is) gone, I found it slipperier through the water, longer run times for sure, and with the rocker flat out the back...pretty darn fast!

Such a little tweak made such a big difference...thank you for leading the way Bro.

RC HAWAIIAN STYLE

kite


its not me ,, its all of us were one big team,, dont matter what you ride,, as long as you ride like the wind


MJ

kitekook

Dom

I really like the camera mount...better than my helmet cam I think.

I noticed that you have a Canon...which model is it?

Do you know about CHDK ????

http://chdk.wikia.com/wiki/FAQ

Canon not very cooperative to suggestions made by its customers for software upgrades...so some pretty smart people have reverse engineered the firmware to provide more versatility.

The option I really like is the ability to take a photo every 1/2 second...the camera just starts taking photos until you stop it, run out of space, or battery.

Not all models are done, so you have to check the site there is a list.
Really easy to use once you have it down...tricky at first...just shoot any ?? if you like.

I like your set up better because I lose alot of shots because of framing...I have gotten better, but still, that best shot just out of frame.

I wonder if arm fatigue will be an issue? Maybe some sort of video shoulder support like they use for the DSLR's

Gonna try it for sure. thanks

rogue29

Thanks Surfcurls,
You have been on here for along time. How's your online biz doing. Has parts for these completely dried up. I started going through posts from the beginning and have spent 5 hours and i am only at page 49. Looks like guys are really just shaping there own boards or modifying nqd's. I have a board shark and was thinking about glassing joints into the best position on the board but his feet are part of the lid and that seems like a problem. If he is tweeked too hard it could crack the lid and let the water flow. I want to start on nqd first and will start shopping for the parts you listed...thanks. So is the board shark a waste of time to do something with. Maybe lose the surfer,cutting him off the deck and reglassing it shut and make a mount system and build my own surfer fig to mount. Any one out there done anything with board shark? I still have some reading to do on the forum and might answer my question when i get to it.
Thanks guys. Just moved from inland to more coast location, so now i can finally start building these things i have been hanging on to for 4 years now.

YPC

Hey Maui John....................

The prop position, from the tail, will certainly have a varying 'thrust' effect...although..the thrust line in relation to the position of the 'vertical' CG is really what will make the difference.

If the thrust line passes over the top of the V-CG - it will push the nose into the water....the further away....the greater the effect.

If the thrust line passes below the bottom of the V- CG- it will lift the nose.......the further away......the greater the effect.

IMO - the ideal is to have the thrust line as close to the bottom of the V-CG with the prop about 20% in from the tail.............to achieve that.......I have had to place the motor forward, half into the pod - run the shafts output point close to the hulls surface ( 30mm) this keeps the thrust angle at 5 degrees and runs the thrust line close to the bottom of the V-CG.
This setting reduces the 'leverage' around the V-CG...........reducing the Hop.

I still feel that a 'flat tail' is ideal.......any positive rocker will allow the nose to ride 'high'.....more than likely producing 'porpoising'

You mentioned that 'your current' board was the 'heaviest yet- it may be the weight that is running the board 'deeper' in the water......reducing the potential 'hop' from the positive tail rocker you have.

I prefer a board with a nose that is driven UP by thrust..........rather than DOWN by thrust ......which could either come from the thrust line been above the V-CG or To Much Negative Trim in the tail

A bit of bounce is better than a PEARL................

Dominic (Bro'Surfer)

YPC

Hey Kite.............if anything it 'looks cool'..............my kids all gave it the "WOW !.....that cool" rating.

THANKS FOR THAT LINK......I have the A800....which 'IS' listed.......I will be sure to upload the amazing features.

The nice thing about the camera been positioned ON the pistol grip radio......it can be left ON with the selected ZOOM and you only need to lift it up ' into frame' and push the RECORD button when you are about to Surf the choice wave...so you wont be filming unnecessary footage.

Between waves, you could rest your arm into your chest, although I dont think fatigue will be an issue...........the camera is light.

What about a small 'helium balloon'.......................LOL..........wouldn 't that look funny......LOL.........You could place a firm block of foam/sponge just under your left chest for your elbow to rest into...........that would help support the position.

Cant wait to try it..........I have a 16Gig memory card.......

Dominic (Bro'Surfer)

Bro' FILM PRODUCTIONScoming soon !

Cananzi

MJ

I also moved the thrust point forwards on my custom boards.
Also recently move it forward when i was doing that fiberglass NQD that i did, It worked pretty well. It helped the hop and also seemed to carve a little bit better.I am not a fan of the small boards anymore after going back from a 32inch custom back to a NQD its terrible.

Would love to see more pics of your tail ...your rails and tail have really got me thinking for a next board.


dom

I tryed a simular thing but i just taped it into place to see if it worked... it works well but my point and shoot waterproof camera doesnt film very clear. my footage looked like vintage footage
I should post some for a larf.....terrible digital camera!! lol

surfcurls

Dom,

Thats A Great Mount for a camera.
I'm working on a fish eye cam built into a 2.4 ghz TX. Lol

I Pesonally Don't sea the need to capture rides I take Rc Surfing.
Seems to distract the stoke I get Simply Rc Surfing.

My Rides Only Get Documented At The Bro Downs
Which is Great. Some Like To Capture Shots, I Just Wanna Rc Surf

GoPro Crew Mounted Cams On my Boards. That Was Coolest.
Thanks Pete !