rtr or kit how about...
10-26-2008, 09:48 AM
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rtr or kit how about...
unassembled? There seems to be 2 schools of thought on rc vehicles, rtr or kit. The rtr are nice but I would like to build my own, but the kits are usually hoped up versions with higher price tags and you still have to buy all the radio and electronics. Why not an unassembled version, the price of a rtr but you can also gain the knowledge and satisfaction that comes with assembling it yourself.
10-26-2008, 10:32 AM
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RE: rtr or kit how about...
The RTR's and ARR's are for people who don't have the time or interest in building, and they will probably only bash now and then. Kits are for the racer, and as such, don't come with an engine or radio because racers always have their own preferences for those. Also, the kits come with the top-of-the-line parts for racing and are more expensive, but cheaper than upgrading an RTR or ARR.
I have known a few people to buy an RTR and take it completely apart, and then reassemble it. They have cleaned the diffs and filled them with oil, used different grade oil in the shocks, change springs, etc. This allows them to become familiar with the buggy and learn its engineering and set up at the same time. It is also an inexpensive way to enter the hobby. If their interest remains in the hobby, their next one is usually a kit with all of the attendant up-front costs associated with kits, but by then, they're hooked.
I have known a few people to buy an RTR and take it completely apart, and then reassemble it. They have cleaned the diffs and filled them with oil, used different grade oil in the shocks, change springs, etc. This allows them to become familiar with the buggy and learn its engineering and set up at the same time. It is also an inexpensive way to enter the hobby. If their interest remains in the hobby, their next one is usually a kit with all of the attendant up-front costs associated with kits, but by then, they're hooked.
10-26-2008, 12:40 PM
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RE: rtr or kit how about...
ORIGINAL: huskerdually
unassembled? There seems to be 2 schools of thought on rc vehicles, rtr or kit. The rtr are nice but I would like to build my own, but the kits are usually hoped up versions with higher price tags and you still have to buy all the radio and electronics. Why not an unassembled version, the price of a rtr but you can also gain the knowledge and satisfaction that comes with assembling it yourself.
unassembled? There seems to be 2 schools of thought on rc vehicles, rtr or kit. The rtr are nice but I would like to build my own, but the kits are usually hoped up versions with higher price tags and you still have to buy all the radio and electronics. Why not an unassembled version, the price of a rtr but you can also gain the knowledge and satisfaction that comes with assembling it yourself.
The RTR-KIT would give the chop-shopper everything new in package, including the radio and electronics. So they can sell it as such and under cut the local RC stores and maybe even the distributors. And the makers in many cases have relationships with the distributors or do their own distibution. Chop-shopper can (I am not saying tehy always do) even undercut distibutor prices.
Is chop-shopping illegal? No. Anyone who buys any RTR or Kit buys it as his own to do whatever he wants to with it(except break copyright and trademark laws in the Western countries, laws that a few far East countries should adopt). The person who bought an RTR or kit is allowed to resell these as they see fit, in whole or in parts. But the RC companies do not really like seeing their attempted price structures being shattered.
10-26-2008, 04:15 PM
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RE: rtr or kit how about...
ORIGINAL: SAVAGEJIM
That isa concept, RTR-KIT, where you have everything in a kit, all you need to do is assemble it like a kit. But here is the problem: many companies are not necessarily to do so because it only incourages further chop-shopping on E-bay. What I mean by chop shop is somoen going ouut and buying an existing kit or RTR, then they disassemble the RC (or, in the kit, the parts are already taken apart). They then sell the individual parts for more, but just under shelf price of you local RC store. They still make a profit.
The RTR-KIT would give the chop-shopper everything new in package, including the radio and electronics. So they can sell it as such and under cut the local RC stores and maybe even the distributors. And the makers in many cases have relationships with the distributors or do their own distibution. Chop-shopper can (I am not saying tehy always do) even undercut distibutor prices.
Is chop-shopping illegal? No. Anyone who buys any RTR or Kit buys it as his own to do whatever he wants to with it(except break copyright and trademark laws in the Western countries, laws that a few far East countries should adopt). The person who bought an RTR or kit is allowed to resell these as they see fit, in whole or in parts. But the RC companies do not really like seeing their attempted price structures being shattered.
ORIGINAL: huskerdually
unassembled? There seems to be 2 schools of thought on rc vehicles, rtr or kit. The rtr are nice but I would like to build my own, but the kits are usually hoped up versions with higher price tags and you still have to buy all the radio and electronics. Why not an unassembled version, the price of a rtr but you can also gain the knowledge and satisfaction that comes with assembling it yourself.
unassembled? There seems to be 2 schools of thought on rc vehicles, rtr or kit. The rtr are nice but I would like to build my own, but the kits are usually hoped up versions with higher price tags and you still have to buy all the radio and electronics. Why not an unassembled version, the price of a rtr but you can also gain the knowledge and satisfaction that comes with assembling it yourself.
The RTR-KIT would give the chop-shopper everything new in package, including the radio and electronics. So they can sell it as such and under cut the local RC stores and maybe even the distributors. And the makers in many cases have relationships with the distributors or do their own distibution. Chop-shopper can (I am not saying tehy always do) even undercut distibutor prices.
Is chop-shopping illegal? No. Anyone who buys any RTR or Kit buys it as his own to do whatever he wants to with it(except break copyright and trademark laws in the Western countries, laws that a few far East countries should adopt). The person who bought an RTR or kit is allowed to resell these as they see fit, in whole or in parts. But the RC companies do not really like seeing their attempted price structures being shattered.
I understand where you're coming from but you can say the same about any R/C kit or even a RTR.
I think the reason why many manufacturers only sell assembled models is because its cheaper for them to sell just one version (rather than a kit and rtr) and also because they believe that is what the public wants. The only way we're going to be able to change this is by only buying kits. I personally haven't bought an r/c in anything but kit form in years except for ones that my brother insisted he wanted. For me, its kits and kits only unless I have no choice.
10-26-2008, 05:52 PM
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RE: rtr or kit how about...
ORIGINAL: drevil
I understand where you're coming from but you can say the same about any R/C kit or even a RTR.
I think the reason why many manufacturers only sell assembled models is because its cheaper for them to sell just one version (rather than a kit and rtr) and also because they believe that is what the public wants. The only way we're going to be able to change this is by only buying kits. I personally haven't bought an r/c in anything but kit form in years except for ones that my brother insisted he wanted. For me, its kits and kits only unless I have no choice.
ORIGINAL: SAVAGEJIM
That isa concept, RTR-KIT, where you have everything in a kit, all you need to do is assemble it like a kit. But here is the problem: many companies are not necessarily to do so because it only incourages further chop-shopping on E-bay. What I mean by chop shop is somoen going ouut and buying an existing kit or RTR, then they disassemble the RC (or, in the kit, the parts are already taken apart). They then sell the individual parts for more, but just under shelf price of you local RC store. They still make a profit.
The RTR-KIT would give the chop-shopper everything new in package, including the radio and electronics. So they can sell it as such and under cut the local RC stores and maybe even the distributors. And the makers in many cases have relationships with the distributors or do their own distibution. Chop-shopper can (I am not saying tehy always do) even undercut distibutor prices.
Is chop-shopping illegal? No. Anyone who buys any RTR or Kit buys it as his own to do whatever he wants to with it(except break copyright and trademark laws in the Western countries, laws that a few far East countries should adopt). The person who bought an RTR or kit is allowed to resell these as they see fit, in whole or in parts. But the RC companies do not really like seeing their attempted price structures being shattered.
ORIGINAL: huskerdually
unassembled? There seems to be 2 schools of thought on rc vehicles, rtr or kit. The rtr are nice but I would like to build my own, but the kits are usually hoped up versions with higher price tags and you still have to buy all the radio and electronics. Why not an unassembled version, the price of a rtr but you can also gain the knowledge and satisfaction that comes with assembling it yourself.
unassembled? There seems to be 2 schools of thought on rc vehicles, rtr or kit. The rtr are nice but I would like to build my own, but the kits are usually hoped up versions with higher price tags and you still have to buy all the radio and electronics. Why not an unassembled version, the price of a rtr but you can also gain the knowledge and satisfaction that comes with assembling it yourself.
The RTR-KIT would give the chop-shopper everything new in package, including the radio and electronics. So they can sell it as such and under cut the local RC stores and maybe even the distributors. And the makers in many cases have relationships with the distributors or do their own distibution. Chop-shopper can (I am not saying tehy always do) even undercut distibutor prices.
Is chop-shopping illegal? No. Anyone who buys any RTR or Kit buys it as his own to do whatever he wants to with it(except break copyright and trademark laws in the Western countries, laws that a few far East countries should adopt). The person who bought an RTR or kit is allowed to resell these as they see fit, in whole or in parts. But the RC companies do not really like seeing their attempted price structures being shattered.
I understand where you're coming from but you can say the same about any R/C kit or even a RTR.
I think the reason why many manufacturers only sell assembled models is because its cheaper for them to sell just one version (rather than a kit and rtr) and also because they believe that is what the public wants. The only way we're going to be able to change this is by only buying kits. I personally haven't bought an r/c in anything but kit form in years except for ones that my brother insisted he wanted. For me, its kits and kits only unless I have no choice.
10-26-2008, 07:52 PM
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RE: rtr or kit how about...
No diosagreements here, afterall, I abhore the RTR radios, they are all terrible, so kits with no electronics are for me. As a matter of fact, alot of teh RTR engines on may RTRs and kits suck too. If I do get a kit, I personally would prefer to buy a roller and go from there.
Now, I like the idea of companies making RTRs uin unassembleed kit form with everything you need to run, so the new person can learn teh RC intimately. If companies domt make them and people want them like this, it is up to us, teh consumers to demand it.
Now, I like the idea of companies making RTRs uin unassembleed kit form with everything you need to run, so the new person can learn teh RC intimately. If companies domt make them and people want them like this, it is up to us, teh consumers to demand it.
10-26-2008, 09:27 PM
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RE: rtr or kit how about...
ORIGINAL: Chris_RC
Because people are too lazy to do something other than run, run, run....
Because people are too lazy to do something other than run, run, run....
10-26-2008, 09:32 PM
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RE: rtr or kit how about...
^
True, but for me, the building is part of teh fun. I love the anticipation while I am building teh RC, and when I finally run it in for break-in, I have absolute satisfaction of my work. I admire the RC mroe if I build it myself rather than pull it straight out of teh box. [8D]
True, but for me, the building is part of teh fun. I love the anticipation while I am building teh RC, and when I finally run it in for break-in, I have absolute satisfaction of my work. I admire the RC mroe if I build it myself rather than pull it straight out of teh box. [8D]
10-26-2008, 09:51 PM
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RE: rtr or kit how about...
You can get a Tamiya Lunchbox and some cheap used gear off ebay for even less the cost of a Slash or Rustler even if you want to go cheap.
ALOT of companies make their RTR stuff cheap, but the only company that puts good RTR stuff out is Losi. When I get my xxxnt it came with a XR2i computer radio that has all the features of the dx2.0 only FM and a Mach .15RE engine which lasts long and has great power for racing. The 8ight and 8ight T come with a DX2.0 and Mach 427 engine. That combo is over $300.
ALOT of companies make their RTR stuff cheap, but the only company that puts good RTR stuff out is Losi. When I get my xxxnt it came with a XR2i computer radio that has all the features of the dx2.0 only FM and a Mach .15RE engine which lasts long and has great power for racing. The 8ight and 8ight T come with a DX2.0 and Mach 427 engine. That combo is over $300.
10-27-2008, 07:13 AM
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RE: rtr or kit how about...
Cobra26 and Savage Jim seem to make good comments (I agree, at least.....LOL). For the first time newbie, an RTR is a good deal as it comes with everyting, is assmebled, and allows pretty much instant gratification with a quick introduciton into the hobby. This helps keep people in the hobby and eventually they go for kits to obtain a better vehicle which they can personalize with their favourite radio gear, engine, etc.
This thread has gone quite well, but in similar threads I've seen a lot of kit-snobs. Keep in mind, if you run your RTR long enough, you will have dissassembled and rebuilt most of it in fairly short order due to broken parts and the installation of lusted hop-ups. So you will know as much about your vehicle as the guy who built the kit.
To be sure, better engines and radio gear are at your discretion when building most kits, but that can make the cost seem high for someone who is unsure where the hobby will take them.
My personal dislike for kits is that the body usually has to be painted. Any dope can bolt parts together....I've proven that.....chuckle. BUT, a good paint job just ain't that easy.
My personal dislike for RTRs is that once you are in the hobby, you may wind up with several vehicles. If all are RTR, you seem to wind up with an inordinate number ot cheap transmitters taking up space. It's nice to buy a good high end radio, and then only buy rcvrs and servos for your vehicles.
Engiens don't last forever, so I don't consider that a big deal. Besides, quite a few kits come with engines anyway.
All in all, there's nothing wrong with a RTR at any time, but if you like building, then a kit's the way to go. Personal preference is the best guide in the end.
This thread has gone quite well, but in similar threads I've seen a lot of kit-snobs. Keep in mind, if you run your RTR long enough, you will have dissassembled and rebuilt most of it in fairly short order due to broken parts and the installation of lusted hop-ups. So you will know as much about your vehicle as the guy who built the kit.
To be sure, better engines and radio gear are at your discretion when building most kits, but that can make the cost seem high for someone who is unsure where the hobby will take them.
My personal dislike for kits is that the body usually has to be painted. Any dope can bolt parts together....I've proven that.....chuckle. BUT, a good paint job just ain't that easy.
My personal dislike for RTRs is that once you are in the hobby, you may wind up with several vehicles. If all are RTR, you seem to wind up with an inordinate number ot cheap transmitters taking up space. It's nice to buy a good high end radio, and then only buy rcvrs and servos for your vehicles.
Engiens don't last forever, so I don't consider that a big deal. Besides, quite a few kits come with engines anyway.
All in all, there's nothing wrong with a RTR at any time, but if you like building, then a kit's the way to go. Personal preference is the best guide in the end.
10-27-2008, 08:05 AM
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RE: rtr or kit how about...
If you really want to get a kit but want what a RTR offers, when you get it, take it apart and re-build it, that is what I did with mine and I learned how the car worked and such, the only problem was getting my belts and gears back in the right places, which was not hard....
10-27-2008, 08:55 AM
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RE: rtr or kit how about...
Getting a RTR in the mail just isnt as fun as getting a kit and trying to budget your time so you can spend every free second building it. Taking it apart if you broke a part just isnt the same. When you paint the body it becomes "your own" instead of everyone on the block having the same rustler paint job.
10-27-2008, 09:01 AM
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RE: rtr or kit how about...
I prefer kits as it is part of the fun to put them together . I like the old days where all you had was kits and you had to put them together . Even back then people didn`t want to build kits , I worked for a hobby shop when I was a kid just to build the kits that their customers didn`t want to mess with . Ahhh , the good old days 
To each their own .
To each their own .
10-27-2008, 02:15 PM
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RE: rtr or kit how about...
I agree. Kits are better IMO. RTR's are good for getting people into the hobby though. RTR versions are cheaper and for those just starting out its nice for them to have everything ready to go. I will always be a kit guy if I can though! The parts are of a better quality (suspension, etc...) and I like the tunability and adjustability of kit cars, RTR's just never seem to have enough options for tuning to satisfy me. I think I'm going to have to buy an RTR soon though
] I can't find the MGT 8.0 in kit form!!![:@] What was AE thinking, offer both![>:]
The parts are of a better quality (suspension, etc...) and I like the tunability and adjustability of kit cars, RTR's just never seem to have enough options for tuning to satisfy me. I think I'm going to have to buy an RTR soon though![] I can't find the MGT 8.0 in kit form!!![:@] What was AE thinking, offer both![>:]
10-27-2008, 03:47 PM
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RE: rtr or kit how about...
ORIGINAL: Chris_RC
Because people are too lazy to do something other than run, run, run....
Because people are too lazy to do something other than run, run, run....
10-27-2008, 05:34 PM
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RE: rtr or kit how about...
I love kit, I built an HPI R40 as my very first RC from a kit, and I am absolutely glad I did. Now I did buy a used HPI Savage that was more or less almost RTR, it was missing radio & electronics, and teh engine was shoot, but at least it was fully assembled. All I had to do was slap in my own electronics and rebuild the engine, and it was like firing up an RTR for teh first time, at least from me opinion.
Funny thing about my Savage, not to long after I got it in running operation, I jumped it off te roof of my garage and nose dived it into teh concrete driveway below. SO, I wound up haveing to disassemble it, almost completely, to take off teh ruined parts and put on new parts to repair it.
Funny thing about my Savage, not to long after I got it in running operation, I jumped it off te roof of my garage and nose dived it into teh concrete driveway below. SO, I wound up haveing to disassemble it, almost completely, to take off teh ruined parts and put on new parts to repair it.
10-27-2008, 06:51 PM
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RE: rtr or kit how about...
What's with everyone having to jump their RC's off of their roof nowadays? Is that what all the "cool" kids are doing or what?[sm=lol.gif] If so I guess I'm not "cool."
10-27-2008, 06:54 PM
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RE: rtr or kit how about...
ORIGINAL: Barber420
What's with everyone having to jump their RC's off of their roof nowadays? Is that what all the "cool" kids are doing or what?[sm=lol.gif] If so I guess I'm not "cool."
What's with everyone having to jump their RC's off of their roof nowadays? Is that what all the "cool" kids are doing or what?[sm=lol.gif] If so I guess I'm not "cool."
10-27-2008, 07:02 PM
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RE: rtr or kit how about...
It sounds like a tempting idea, but their is really no need. I can go to my local BMX track and run it off of jumps that are 10-15 feet high which is similar to a one story roof. However, those are designed to be jumped and landed on!!! Launching off of my roof into the yard or driveway just seems foolish.
Plus my stuff is vintage and I don't like breaking it for no reason.
Launching off of my roof into the yard or driveway just seems foolish. Plus my stuff is vintage and I don't like breaking it for no reason.
10-28-2008, 09:28 AM
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RE: rtr or kit how about...
But if a guy doesn't have any gear building a kit will cost at least twice of a rtr. I think you miss out on a big part of the hobby by not building your car yourself. And the chop shop thing is easy to solve don't buy from those guys, they are ruining the hobby.
10-28-2008, 01:56 PM
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RE: rtr or kit how about...
What do you mean by gear, tools? A couple philips and standard screwdrivers are cheap and most kits give you allen wrenches if you need them to build the kit. That's almost nothing in $ spent.
10-28-2008, 02:10 PM
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RE: rtr or kit how about...
Ya sorry I mean if a guy don't have a radio and goes out and buys a cheap one your no better off than a rtr radio. I was just saying I think there is a void btw the rtr and the kit vehicles.
10-28-2008, 02:26 PM
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RE: rtr or kit how about...
Oh yeah. Duh!! I should've realized what you meant. Yeah, that is what makes the kits more expensive, and if you're gonna go kit route you don't want to buy the cheapest motor and electronics possible or your not much better off than if you'd gotten an rtr. People end up spending so much money on hop ups for their RTR's that it can't be cheaper in the long run though. My buddies RTR Rustler Xl-5 is now about a $650 truck and he hasn't even put brushless in it yet. RTR components are so much chincier than kit components that you HAVE to hop them up to compete. Whereas with my associated factory team kits I've never had to put any hop ups on and not only do I compete, I win!
RTR's are popular, because people don't think ahead about how much they're going to spend to get a somewhat inferior vehicle (as compared to many, but not all, kit cars) to perform as well as the kit car bretheren they're competing against. What really stinks is even after spending all of that money, they're never going to perform as well as a kit design. IMO. I still think RTR's are a great way to get people started in the hobby. My buddy with the Rustler probably wouldn't have gotten into it if he had to spend $600 up front, but since he could get started for about $325 he got into it. Now, he would never buy an RTR, but RTR is what got him started. Everything has its place and its uses.
I should've realized what you meant. Yeah, that is what makes the kits more expensive, and if you're gonna go kit route you don't want to buy the cheapest motor and electronics possible or your not much better off than if you'd gotten an rtr. People end up spending so much money on hop ups for their RTR's that it can't be cheaper in the long run though. My buddies RTR Rustler Xl-5 is now about a $650 truck and he hasn't even put brushless in it yet. RTR components are so much chincier than kit components that you HAVE to hop them up to compete. Whereas with my associated factory team kits I've never had to put any hop ups on and not only do I compete, I win! RTR's are popular, because people don't think ahead about how much they're going to spend to get a somewhat inferior vehicle (as compared to many, but not all, kit cars) to perform as well as the kit car bretheren they're competing against. What really stinks is even after spending all of that money, they're never going to perform as well as a kit design. IMO. I still think RTR's are a great way to get people started in the hobby. My buddy with the Rustler probably wouldn't have gotten into it if he had to spend $600 up front, but since he could get started for about $325 he got into it. Now, he would never buy an RTR, but RTR is what got him started. Everything has its place and its uses.