freshflip13

I went to my LHS yesterday to get some parts for my science fair project and was extremely fascinated by the awesome cars and buggies they had. I asked the guy who helped me how much one would cost, and he said that to be able to race on a track, the lowest would be around $300(&i THINK he said that it was electric, but im not completely sure). My main question is which would be better to get, an electric or a Nitro? I see the races are in seperate classes but which is more popular(Indoors & also on dirt tracks) And also, the guy who helped me showed me this video on youtube(he's the one who one w/ the yellow car), are those electric or nitro?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uuk-NScJJVk

Thanks.

hpiracr28

for a beginner i would go for electric. nitro without experience can be a pain. you have to tune the engines at first and keep up with them more compared to electric. these days, electric is more chosen cause they are more efficient, faster, and are easier to maintain. i have had an electric and nitro and i must say that electric is much easier. just charge a battery and go with it. no worries about glow plugs and fuel and trying to start an engine. the thing that i liked about nitro was the ability to "start" your rc. how many kids in the neighborhood actually have a rc car that you gotta start lol. i thought that was cool. but nitro can become pricey. where i live 30% nitro fuel is $30 a gallon. but i ran mine a lot. so overall i would suggest an electric. i have a traxxas bandit vxl and i love it. fast, good acceleration, nimble, parts everywhere, easy to work on. and easy to use. paid about $300 for it. but they can go either cheaper or more expensive, depending on options and brand.

hpiracr28

oh and i forgot to say that the cars in the video are electric.

ThunderbirdJunkie

My Feedback: (3)

ALL RC cars are a pain, nitro and electric. That's why we love them.

For a starter setup, though, right now there are no inexpensive nitro classes you can get into.

That being said...that track looks like a parts breaker.

andybenton

im the guy thats going to be off the wall and suggest going nitro first, the learning curve is a tough one, but often times if you can take the time and have the patience to tune or diagnose a nitro motor, not to mention keep up the maitenence, and keeping it clean, then youll have the patience to work out a proper suspension set up, and over all make yourself a better racer.


i have raced electric and nitro, i started nitro, and i still use nitro for my planes, boats, and monster trucks... but all my dedicated race vehicles are electric....


good luck with which ever you get, and im sure youll find some awsome help and support here on RCU!
happy racin

378

My Feedback: (4)

I'm putting in another vote for Nitro, but with a caveat. You have to get one with a good engine in it. It is an absolute requirement. You get one with a poor engine and you are going to unfairly swear off nitro for life. My suggestion is Associated, HPI, and Traxxas. In that order. I had good luck with my CEN, but that's the thing. That was good luck. And I still sheared the crankshaft off two gallons in. I wouldn't advise a CEN for a newbie because of that.

You also have to be very patient. These engines can be very orny little things at times. Even the best of engines have a bad side. My OS .18, which I would say has reliability rivalling that of Toyota, still has those days where it all but refuses to start. But if you stay calm and don't panic they'll behave themselves. When they're running right you'll wonder why you ever considered a brushed electric in the first place.

LewAshby

Do you have good reading skills?
Are you mechanically inclined?
Do you get satisfaction out of spending the time to figure stuff out on your own?

4goodbuys2

Most likely you won't be able to run nitro indoors like on that track.
Short Course racing is pretty popular. That being said I have a HPI Blitz and love it, and I bought mine rtr with a coupon on tower hobby for $150.
So you can get into racing under $300

You may want to buy a used electric rc and a name brand used lipo charger I have a dynamite lipo charger, and a turingy lipo from hoobyking, but just make sure that you keep your lipo in a ammo can when your not using it.
You can probaly get a used HPI Blitz for under $100.

ElectricGuy007

If they have a box stock slash class there, he needs to start there and work his way up.
2wd buggy can be a hard class to start in for a beginner. It's a more advanced class.
And yeah that track does look like a parts breaker...I enjoyed the video however...

FoamyVictim

Electric is much easier to deal with. Once you get your setup right(not hard) its plug'n'play. There are so many things that make nitro tough to get into without a good experienced friend to help you along. So if you want to get started, start with electric. It'll be MUCH easier; that way you spend most of your time driving it, in stead of working on it.

MCSRacing

My Feedback: (2)

+1

andybenton

really, it boils down to personal preferance, electric being the easy way in, nitro being the ultimate in satisfaction when it screams past and all you can smell is purning nitro menthane...

LewAshby

The question nobody bothered to ask is: how are your neighbors / how is the neighborhood?

Nitros make a lot of noise and most times have to be used off-site unless your neighborhood doesn't mind the sound of a gas powered weed wacker going off day and night.

saucySavy

My Feedback: (2)

Thats a good point... I unfortunatly live in a neighbourhood myself, and have nitros. Some trucks with smaller engines are pretty quiet. I can run my firestorm in the street and it's barely heard in the house. My savage, on the other hand, is so loud that it willmake your ears ring when your trying to tune it. So for that i have to throw it in the back of the car and go off looking for a good bashing spot. That being said, i would definatly recommend electric for a noobie. Unless your willing to sacrafice big time and money almost every time you run it, its not for you. also,you should have a general knowlege of the motors in general and how it all works

4goodbuys2

A cheap Lipo battery will give you 45-60 min of runtime a $30 lipo.
A tank of nitro will give you 12-14 min of runtime.

Electric just plug and play, and depending on your brushless system you can go as fast as you want.
Nitro, you have to tune and maintain the same amount of time you use it you use it, and you also have to buy glow plugs, air filters, after run oil, glow igniter,pull starters, clutches.

LewAshby

Just because someone is experienced with electric doesn't mean that the transition to nitro would be simple. In fact, it may be even more frustrating because if the person doesn't have enough patience for electric then they are sure to fail at nitro.

4goodbuys2

Sometimes it's just the place that you live that chooses for you.

ElectricGuy007

Amen to that Chuck, Nitro you have to have a ton, I mean a TON of patience.
Tuning a nitro engine takes a long time...Many nitro racers I have met around here spend
an entire week just tuning a motor. I hate it when an engine needs to be pinched,
or buying a new engine is even worse, the first day your basically breaking it in.
They have to be set just right,
like in between lean and rich, but not too much of either.
I just dont have the patience for it, I wanna drive right now!....lol
Nitro fuel is expensive...it's not getting any cheaper..

I highlighted some key terms as I know a little bit about nitro, but not a whole lot.
I still prefer electric over nitro.

guys2nv

For a beginner w/ im assuming no rc exp what so ever-then electric is the way to go.

SyCo_VeNoM

hate to tell you they suck then
you have to tune it to the climate at the time and spending a week doing that is pointless
If it takes you more than 5 minutes after the motors warmed up to tune your doing it wrong.
and engine pinching is not needed for generally 5-10 gallons usually (unless your running it too lean)


Funny thing is the "I just dont have the patience for it, I wanna drive right now!....lol" line is used in favor of nitro most times cause who wants to sit looking at a battery charge for an hour or plan ahead. My nitros I can just grab them, grab the fuel bottle, run without waiting for a battery to charge, and run them as long as I got nitro on me without having to haul a charger around, or a pile of batteries

But now all that is said the cheapest to get into is probably stock SCT racing seeing you pretty much just buy the truck and throw it on the track.

FoamyVictim

Uh... what powers the radio in your nitro?... A Battery. Even nitros need batteries. Without turning this into a nitro VS electric fan-boi battle, you guys need to be more HONEST about nitro.

On top of constant tuning, you have to buy fuel on a regular basis. On that single issue, let's do a cost comparison shall we. Both require a charger of some kind, so that cost cancels out. One gallon of 30% nitro cost about $30. A battery from Hobby King cost $17, add shipping and your right back to $30. That fuel will last about what... a couple weeks, maybe a month if you run it infrequently. That battery has a great chance at lasting over a year, maybe longer. Who spent their money smarter?

Maintenance. Nitro engines have a clutch, glow plug, glow driver, and air filters. These things are consumables(the glow driver is either rechargeable, or needs a new battery periodically) Both have gears that wear out, so that cancels each other. You are STILL spending allot more time and money to keep that nitro going.

Performance. With an average brushless system, you'll see ALLOT more power. If you want more, many BL systems can handle 3S, sometimes even more. Have any of you nitro guys driven a 4S powered 8th scale buggy? If not, you CANNOT buy a nitro motor that even holds a candle to that kind of power. If you want more, you can always run 5S, or even 6S. That's when your RC is not only capable of speeds illegal to full scale cars... you can still go FASTER! All this, while never touching a wrench once you've built it. BL motors last a LONG time, far longer than any nitro motor. After that nitro guy goes through 6-10 gallons of fuel(theoretically in about a year) he'll either need a new engine, a pinch, or some kind of overhaul. The BL motor MIGHT need some bearings. That would cost about $10-$20... how much is a new nitro engine, or a re-pinch, or overhaul?

Don't convince the guy to start with a headache, for nothing more than a SOUND. Let him spend more time driving and playing with it, rather than spend hours tinkering and tuning just to run the thing briefly. If he wants to run longer, he can buy more batteries. A good setup can run for 10 minutes; you'll be mentally fatigued by the time you run 3 batteries.., that's an HOUR. After an HOUR, even your nitro's battery needs a charge.

Nitro is fun to compete with, not START with, despite how many RTRs are available in nitro. Start with something easy and FUN. Give yourself the nitro challenge later, when you get used to having hobby grade RC equipment.

SyCo_VeNoM

4 Energizer Alkaline AA's 20 for $10 swap em 2 times a year (unless I forget a radio on). 8 in my radio (no I do NOT use re-chargeables yet, I have had a rx lipo on back order for awhile)

If you really want I can take a pic of my savage, MT2, and jammin X1 CR with the radio box open and show you the energizer logo on the batteries in the battery holder

My glow plug warmer uses D-cell Energizer Alkalines. One usually lasts around half a gallon or so. Again I can take pictures if you want proof

So like I said I just grab them, glow plug warmer (sorry I forgot to list it), and my nitro and out I go. No worry about charging a battery.

Dunno how an air filter is consumable. You clean it off its good as new. I've not had to buy one since I started in nitro almost 2 years ago.


Never said anything about performance of BL vs nitro. BL hands down has more power

Maintenance is about equal IMO. Nitro once every few gallons you rip apart the engine, and rebuild (or just buy a new one depending on costs, smaller .15's are pretty cheap) electric you take apart the motor, replace the bearings, and clean it out.
Most electric lovers forget that technically charging batteries is maintenance, and takes longer than anything nitro related. I've stripped an entire nitro motor, polished it, and rebuilt it in less time than it took me to charge a 5200mah pack at 5amps...

Now lets get into non stock RTR's, and gearing. On my nitros I've never had ANY gearing issue. Never have I completely destroyed a engine in under 3 minutes from the gearing being too high. In nitro you turn a screw get more fuel in to lower the temps engine ok. Electric you have to buy pinions till you get optimal gearing (and yes I realize there is the gear calculator, but I've never got that damn thing to work right). Ive spent easily $80 on pinions I've used 1-2 times (wow almost 3 gallons of nitro) to get gearing right. I've also smoked a $30 ESC within 40 feet, and baked a $20 motor.

Clutch I'll give you, those go and can sometimes be a PITA to change. Easier IMO than cutting comms, and replacing brushes in brushed motors though.(remember electric is not only brushless)

And to the OP you should have posted this in the general forum, this is the electric section which is HEAVILY biased to electrics.

Now cheapest nitro I would ever recommend would be a Jammin X1 CR which is around $300 for everything (-nitro). I got one the thing is a beast, it is an older race model that was resold as RTR for newbies (why its so cheap). How competitive would you be I can't answer I doubt you would win any races with a RTR nitro seeing I doubt there are stock class's (I've never raced).

I started with nitro and found it very easy once I bought a new engine(one big word of advise is never buy used nitro engines when your new). I actually found electric harder to learn (and harder on the pocket)

Best advise is go to the track, watch some races, and see what you like. Than buy one. No one here can tell you what is popular to race by you (unless they live nearby). After you buy it start talking to people RC people are usually VERY helpful to each other, and will give you pointers.

BTW foamy that link to read more points back to this thread

378

My Feedback: (4)

I'll just leave this right here...

Seriously. I have a 500cc squeezy bottle. I can stop for two or three seconds, top the tank off, then go right back to doing donuts in my back yard. I can run for an hour straight if I want. If I have a friend with me, I can run even longer, as he can refill the squeezy bottle while I'm driving! Or, if I'm running solo, I can stop for a minute or so to refill the bottle myself. My engines are well enough tuned to behave themselves while I do that, I don't even have to shut 'em down.

I can literally run all day long if I wanted to and had the mental endurance.
Negatory. I adjust my needles twice a year. Quarter turn richer around october, quarter turn leaner around March. Of course I also make a minor tweak to the idle speed to compensate for the different mixtures. That's the sum total of all carburetor adjustments I have to make.

Oh no, I have to spend three dollars every two years on a glow plug! I'm gonna go broke!!!! [/sarcasm]

Unless your engine is out of tune these should last two to three years. If buying glow plugs on that timetable is a financial problem you can't afford RC at all.

Get a foam one. It isn't hard to clean and re-oil them, and they last the life of the engine. Paper filters suck.

Never used it in six years of running nitro. Never had any signs of engine malfunctions because of not using it.

Oh boy, one 15 dollar accessory that lasts for decades. Better take out a second mortgage for this one! [/sarcasm]

The cost of this + the fuel bottle + gallon of 20% is still less than or equal to the cost of a good lipo charger. If you can afford to run electric you can afford to run nitro.

If you're always buying pull starters then you're not using them right. I've never had to replace one in six years of running pull start engines. The key is to not rip the damn thing all the way out when starting. 6 to 9 inches, that's as far as you should ever pull. Oh, and a well tuned engine will fire off within five or six pulls every time. Many can do one-pull starts.

Again if you're going through these left and right it's a problem between controller and driver's stand. Clutches last just fine if you don't abuse them.


If you have a good engine and you don't abuse it these are simply false. It didn't take me long to tune my OS .18 CV-RX when I got it. 5 tanks to break it in, a sixth to tune it, and that was that. Didn't have to touch it again until the weather got cold.

Let's just go over my checklist when I go to play with my nitros.


1: Radio check
2: Fill the tank
3: Check glow starter.
4: Prime the engine
5: Radio check
6: Add glow starter
7: 3-5 pulls
8: remove glow starter
9: Install shell
10: Do donuts!

That procedure takes all of five minutes. It's not that big a deal.


That's fine, but do keep in mind that a good, well maintained glow engine is just as easy and reliable as any brushless setup you care to name.

Okay, I'm game.

Negatory. You can run alkalines. You can run NiMH AA's, which I've done before. 30 bucks gets you four batteries and a one hour wall charger. Good luck getting a good lipo charger for that.

Most people are fine on the cheaper 20%.

And you don't have to spend this. Every RTR I've ever looked at has had a AA holder with it. Either that or it comes with a hump pack and charger. Either way you don't need to spend this.

Maybe if you buy by the quart or race. A gallon of 20% lasts me about a year, and I run quite frequently.

The guy that didn't buy stuff he didn't need, that's who.

So do Electrics. your point? If this doesn't last at least three gallons you're not driving correctly. The clutch in my CEN MT2 was going great at three gallons before the last runaway saw it trying to move while I held it down and shut the motor off. Not only that but two new shoes and a spring cost 15 bucks. 15 bucks over three years is hardly a bank breaker.

A well tuned engine that isn't abused is going to get at least two, perhaps even three, years out of a plug. They're also, and you better call your mortgage broker for this one, a whopping three dollars.

One rechargeable glow driver that comes with wall charger has lasted me six years and still works flawlessly. So I don't see your complaint here. Maybe if you leave 'em on the engine while driving, I can see needing to replace them frequently then. But no, glow drivers are not consumables.

Stop buying paper filters. Problem solved. I use foam filters, which is the industry standard these days. A single quart of Dexron-III ATF has lasted me three gallons so far and it's still half full.

I've spent about 50 bucks over six years on maintenance and consumables for nitro. Sorry but I don't buy this one bit.

Uhh.....Have you actually looked at the reciepts for all that gear? You want to go that fast you end up spending three times what the car is worth. Doesn't sound like a very nice selling point to me considering just a couple of paragraphs ago you were prattling on about how it's cheaper to go brushless.

I call utter BS on this, dude. You put that much power through a car not designed for it and you ARE going to break things. IF you don't outright shred them, you'll wear them out a damn sight faster.

This will take closer to a decade. Glow engines don't chew through that much fuel unless you're running them eight hours a day, and if you're running that often they're likely your day job so running costs are a moot point. You'll also have three more in the pit box ready to go if the one you're using goes bust.

For a basher like myself the engines last years.

So? Your point? Everything wears out. That brushless motor will need an overhaul about that same time as well. Nothing lasts forever.

It's only a headache if you let it be. I went from Mini-Zs and toy grades straight to glow. I didn't step into an electric stadium truck. I didn't get a 1/12 TC. I went straight from toy grades to a 1/10 nitro monster.

You'd think I would have sworn it off entirely. After all you're sitting here saying they're nothing but a pain in the ass. But no. They're not. If I could buy a full scale car as reliable as my OS I'd never have to buy another car for the rest of my life.

I don't regret having chosen glow over battery. The engines are nowhere near as finickey as you claim. 99% of the time I went to run it was as simple as "Fuel into tank> prime > radio check > start > donuts!!!", I can do those donuts for an hour until my squeezy bottle is empty, and the other 1% had me wondering why the servos went ape when the glow ignitor rubbed the cylinder head.

Stupid AM radios...wish I could afford FM or 2.4...

Uhh...no. The alkalines in my radio are about a year old. The ones in the reciever box about six months old. That's about half a gallon and a quart, respectively.


Now are you done using rumors and assumptions to needlessly bash nitro? I don't care if I convert you or not, all I aim to do with this post is convince you that they're nowhere near as finickey as you claim they are. Do I hate electric? Hell no. Just this morning I was suggesting a friend of mine get a brushless electric and two 2s lipos. Specifically, a Traxxas Slash 4x4 VCL. It'd work great for him, since he's a bit of an idiot at times and lives at an apartment complex, and it would let him keep up with my nitros when we run together. The second battery would let him run for an hour as well, he'd simply have to stop for 30-60 seconds to swap it out. It simply drives me up the wall when people come in here and slam nitro using fallacies and/or experiences from junk engines.

ThunderbirdJunkie

My Feedback: (3)

Only saw the comment in 378's post...but to whoever said you need to charge an rx pack after an hour, ThunderbirdJunkie has run his Savage (pretty rough on battery life for the radio, no?) for eight hours straight.

guys2nv

Man don't drive the OP outta this hobby before he even get's into it guy's-For a BEGINNER w/o any experience what so ever in rc-Electric is by far the better choice again for a BEGINNER. I've been in this hobby for a long time and have had plenty of nitro's and electric's and electric is the much better choice.

Fresh-buy what ever you want it's your money.