Duval

Hello,

I am looking for an electric buggy under £100 to get into RC. I have come up with a list of Tamiya and Kyosho buggies (they are the only two brands tha I heard off that sell buggies under £100) but I am struggling to find and understand the differences between them.

Could you please give me some advice on the advatages/disadvatages and differences of the models listed.
Any new suggestions from other brands would also be welcome.


Kyosho Nexxt
Kyosho Sand Master
Tamiya Rising Fighter
(Tamiya Holiday Buggy) No longer considered because of poor performance
(Tamiya Grasshopper)No longer considered because of poor performance
(Tamiya Mad Bull) No longer considered because of "wierd"/"odd" handling buggy
Tamiya Super Fighter


Thanks in advance.

Duval

SyCo_VeNoM

The tamiyas you linked are all pretty ancient and their handeling pretty much blows

the Kyosho Nexxt is actually pretty new and came out like 2 months ago. I actually want one, but kinda am a tad broke currently. From what I read the sandmaster is pretty much the same thing


http://www.modelsport.co.uk/tamiya-p...products/28984 is pretty decent but its £20 over your limit, and can be made tought with some cheap mods, and unlike the others is 4wd (I actually have 2 of these and got my nephew one 2 years ago for xmas)


just FYI those are all kits, and they require radios, a charger, and batteries

nitrosportsandrunner

the holiday buggy has looks, but not alot of performance. especially if you run the stock 380 motor. its better with a 540 size motor, but thats adding cost.

As syco mentioned, they are all 2wd.
The mad bull is one of the weirdest models out there. If you go in reverse, the camber on the front wheels goes soo off that the wheels drag. Only tamiya would produce such and odd buggy.

I suggest searching youtube vids on the models you are considering. watching them run will help you decide what you want.

Also, consider where you will be driving. The driveway, street, grass, offroad, sand or packed? What the surface will be will have an impact on what model will be the most fun for you.

Duval

Thank you very much for your input. Is 2wd really that bad?

I know, this is the reason why I really don't want to go over £100.

Duval

Thanks for your answer.

Looks is not my main interest: so I'll take the Holiday Buggy off the list (grasshopper too? I think they have the same specs?)


That's the Mad Bull off the list too, then


Already have but to me it looks all the same. I am a newbie, and I canoot seem to be able to see differences between 2wd and 4wd in the vids.



My main interests are off road / grass .

SyCo_VeNoM

damn just was looking thinking the kyosho prices might have came down now in the US after seeing the UK hobby shop page. Nope the US has to pay 2x more for the Nexxt... They removed the kit from the US too, well I guess that makes sense seeing they had it priced $20 HIGHER than the RTR with no bonuses, or radio included...
Wonder if Kyosho will ever figure out why they aren't that popular in the US...



heres the diff in 2wd vs 4wd
4wd has better traction, handling, and can go more places.
2wd well is the opposite lol when turning the rear end likes to kick out, can have poor cornering skills, and can get stuck in grass easier to list a few things

nitrosportsandrunner

as syco mentioned, the DF-02 4wd buggy is a good chassis. Tho its a bit pricier, its worth it really.
They are tough enough to handle brushless power as well.

SyCo_VeNoM

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...arehouse_.html
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...23v_Input.html

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s..._GENUINE_.html (I think this will work in the UK, the charger will charge all battery types)

No clue what those cost in Pounds as I tried setting uk as my location but it still displayed in USD

Battery up to you if you want NiMh or LiPo. NiMh IMO is better for a beginner, but the batteries are pretty costly now, and the performance isn't there. LiPo has better energy density, lower cost, BUT can get damaged easily if you don't pay attention (specially on brushed ESC's if you don't have an alarm)
If lipo I know one on HK's site that fits in my Tamiya hornet, and DF-02.

the ubec is only needed if you get any of the tamiyas as the ESC in them will blow radios out. You will have to disconnect the red plug on the wire that goes to the radio on the ESC if you get a tamiya I can post up a pic from my hornet that I did it in.

Duval

Arg, I'd really like to avoid going overbudget :S

Thanks for the input though.

Duval

Thank you very much for the help.
I will have to have a proper look at radios/chargers, batteries and whatever UBEC is when I'll make my choice.

SyCo_VeNoM

UBEC is a Universal Battery Elimination Circuit
Basically it eliminates the need for a separate battery on the radio. Why the tamiya TEU104bk ESC's don't have one(that ESC comes in all the tamiyas so far listed on this thread) I'll never figure out seeing every other tamiya esc has one built in. If one is not present the reviver will have full power from the battery being pumped into it which will damage majority of the newer receivers(a lot of the older AM receivers seemed to have them built in)

BTW in RC's budgets should be flexible cause honestly its almost impossible not to go over

EXT2Rob

My Feedback: (1)

2wd is not that bad. It'll teach you driving skills, the driveline is less complicated, therefore less expensive and easier to maintain.  If budget is your main thing, don't blow-off 2wd.

Duval

Decisions, decisions... :s

SyCo_VeNoM

but in the case of the ones he listed their shocks suck, the front shock towers on the 2wd tamiyas listed are prone to breaking if you jump em too hard. The 2wd tamiyas that were listed are more for nostalgia purposes than anything else.
Side note I found it was 10X harder putting together the hornets uhhh "easier" transmission than that od say my DF-02's full drive chain

Was going to say any, but I remembered the pain my stampede 4X4's center gear was to install will say that one is probably the hardest thing I've had yet to work on lol

Duval

I am more and more leaning towards the 4wd.
...and eat only dry bread with water for a couple of weeks to be able to afford ot :

Tamiya PLazma Edge
Tamiya Gravel Hound
Tamiya Rising Storm

They are all the same except the shell, right?

SyCo_VeNoM

and sticker sheet

Duval

So what else would I need to run the Plasma Edge?

Radio
Charger
Batteries: Yous said NiMh was advised for begginers (which I am), but said it was lower performace than LiPo which can be dangerous if not careful (what do you mean by not careful?), and how do you know what battery fit the model?

UBEC? Is it neccessary with this model?
Servos? (in the description of some transmitters it said: servo not included... Does it mean I need to buy it separately?


Sorry to bombard you with questions, but you already have been so helpful...

SyCo_VeNoM

for the 2 highlighted YES
servos you can use most cheap ones fine I think I have a futaba 4004 in my one(was the cheapest servo my HS had), and some cheap HPI RTR servo in the other(which I think is just a rebadged futaba 4004)
the ESC in the tamiyas puts out full battery voltage, and it needs to be brought down to 6volts which is what the UBEC does.

As for the LiPo batteries being dangerous if not careful is the battery can burst into flames if its punctured, charged when ran too low(very easily done in brushed RC's), charged too fast (this is not common at all anymore), or charged while damaged. Also constant monitoring is needed while charging so you can see if its gonna blow.
The fire from a LiPo also can not be put out by water(water will just increase the intensity) as it is a chemical fire instead they have to be smothered out with sand or I think its a class 3 fire extinguisher(in the US dunno if other countries use the same class system)
Personally I don't trust them, and for charging I use a US Army ammo can(that I got from a surplus store) to sit them in with the charger on top. so if they ignite I can just slam the lid fast and smother the fire out(some did testing with a similar can on youtube). I also store my batteries in another can that are not in use.

To use a lipo in a brushed RC it would also be recommended to run whats called a Low Voltage Alarm that will have a buzzer go off when one of the cells hit 3.2 volts (these are quite cheap)


As for knowing what fits the model in tamiyas NiMh 6 cell packs fit 7 cell won't.
In LiPo its trial and error as it took me trying 5 different packs to find one that works with minimal modifications to the battery compartment, and that didn't cause and problems with the steering. By minimal I mean just loosen a screw, where other batteries I tried required extensive remodeling like taking a rotary tool to the chassis and what now.

Duval

O.o, OK I think I'll start off with NiMh, or is LiPo worth the risk?


For the numbers of servos needed, is that correct? "RC servos control the steering and throttle for your rc model unless you are using an ESC in which you will only have a rc steering servo only."
That would mean I only need one servo.

Thanks again for your help. It is greatly appreciated.

SyCo_VeNoM

ya just one servo needed


as for the risk of lipo, they cost less, can out put higher currents, and are needed in larger RC's that would melt a NiMh
Like I have 5 RC's that would literally destroy a NiMh battery probably in a minute

Duval

I am quite tempted to get LiPo straight away, but scared by "chemical Fire that get worst with water" O.o

Concerning Transmitters, any will do, even the cheaper ones?
I was looking at these four, and once again cant seem to find any difference but the look and number of channel (although I think I onlu need two for a buggy?)
http://www.modelsport.co.uk/ansmann-...products/36914
http://www.modelsport.co.uk/tamco-rc-2-channel-2.4ghz-radio-system-with-servos/rc-car-products/368365(with servos: so it is my favourite so far)
http://www.modelsport.co.uk/etronix-...products/38734
http://www.modelsport.co.uk/carson-r...roducts/368279

Any suggestions?

SyCo_VeNoM

they all have similar features basic, the Tamco looks like a rebadged flysky GT2 (which I linked another rebadge earlier from hobbyking). If it is indeed the Flysky it will do a good job (and they have insanely huge ranges)
I own a GT2 and its a radio that's not let me down yet.


as for the chemical fire getting worst with water look at grease fires they are chemical fires, and if you put water on them they kinda explode.
If you don't leave it sitting alone while charging(1-2 minutes to goto the toilet is fine), balance the pack, get the low voltage alarm so you don't run under, and just practice general safety its fine. The danger comes when people start taking the things for granted like I read people lost their house after plugging a pack in to charge, and forgetting about it and going to bed, Or charging it as the wrong sized pack, and leaving it unattended for hours. Basically its like most things once they got complacent it bit them in the ass.

http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store...dproduct=21001 is the only battery I can say will fit in a DF-02 from my testing.

Here's a pic of the battery in the tray, and a pic of my DF-02 with a fair bit of aftermarket parts, and mods (I got more now on that one than pictured )
Pretty much when running with a brushed motor all that shiny blue stuff isn't needed that I got, but as I run a pretty high turn BL motor I needed the aluminum to remove some of the slack that is in the stock parts cause at really high speeds it would get extremely unstable prior(remember I stated it was never meant to go anywhere near where I pushed it to ). Also the wing the mount was also modified from another buggy. 3rd pic is of my brushed DF-02 which is pretty much stock outside the tires, body, and knuckles.

ohh yea forgot you will need a soldering iron to solder a plug onto the ESC, as the stock tamiya plug is a piece of crap. The plugs are generally cheap. seeing you are new, and don't have anything going HXT4mm (or whatever the battery you choose has) would probably be the cheapest.

Duval

OK choice done for the radio!

One day, I too will have shiny parts in my rc

You got me confused with the plugs: I need to change the plug from the RC's esc to be able to fit with the battery. Are Deans and EC3 plugs used for that? If yes which one would you adivse?

Without you,I would have been completely lost when I'd receive my car. Thx again!

SyCo_VeNoM

plugs whichever you like
I use the traxxas plugs as my 1st electric ESC had them, and I got them for my battery, then my next battery then my next ESC seeing I didn't want to buy anotherbattery and wanted em interchangeable, and keep goin
If I had to do it over again I'd go EC3 I've used em for for my chargers power supply and found em pretty easy to solder, and they have a good connection.

Duval

Thank you for the advice, I'll get EC3.


Should be one of the last time I am bothering you... Well until I receive the car and struggle to assemble it


I am in the process of ordering everything:

is this UBEC ok? http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...Reduction.html

and this charger?http://www.modelsport.co.uk/ansmann-...products/38402

and could you give me an example of alarm needed for LiPo batteries?

and would I need anything else beside the radio, chargers and items listed above?