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I want to build a SCX10 Wrangler G6, but not sure on electronics...

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I want to build a SCX10 Wrangler G6, but not sure on electronics...

Old 08-18-2014, 04:11 PM
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DieHarder
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Default I want to build a SCX10 Wrangler G6, but not sure on electronics...

I'm looking to start into crawling. I really want to build a kit because I think it is the next big step in the hobby for me. I've done tons of research and I think I can do it. I know crawlers are expensive, so I have a budget of about $700-$750, that's tops. I don't like plastic gears in general, so the hardened gear set that is available for the tranny is on my list. I'm also going to purchase a stainless hardware kit for all the screws/bolts for everything. I really want a winch, so I've decided on going with the RC4WD wireless winch controller and the RC4WD Warn 9.5cti Winch. I have one question on the winch voltage though. It says I can run between 6v-11.1v, a fully charged 3S is 12.6v. Do they just mean 3S then? I figured I could just wire the wireless winch controller to the battery, but if it has to stay below 11.1v, I would need a Castle 10A BEC, right? I want to use this bumper: http://store.rc4wd.com/Tough-Armor-W...10_p_1083.html to mount the winch because I rather it be attached to the chassis by steel, not plastic.

So those are a couple of little extras that I wanted, since I'm spending $700. lol

For electronics, I have a FlySky Radio so I would just pick up a $8 receiver, no biggy. I plan to use a HiTec 5645MG servo and run everything off a Gens Ace Hardcase 11.1v 40C 5000mah battery. Here is where I run into a tough decision. (for me anyways) I can't decide which brushed combo to use. When it comes to this part of the build, I'm looking for high quality. The best I can find (without going sky hi prices) is the Tekin FX-R ESC and 35T crawler combo. Either the regular or the Pro version. I don't really know the differences, so that's another question. I want to go pretty slow but still be able to punch it out up to at least walking pace. I am close to completing a custom trailer to haul this thing around too. I want to be able to do some videos and precision crawling through tough trails.

The last 14 motors I've blown up have been brushed, so I'm quite hesitant about going brushed. I figure if I run 3S and something with decent quality, it should last a long time. Other hobbyists do it and I would like to also! lol Due to my budget I have the option to go brushless, but from what I've read, brushed is king when it comes so slow crawling/creeping.

So thanks to anyone who reads this super long post and responds, as I'm almost ready to buy, but just need a little help on a couple of things...
Old 08-18-2014, 05:14 PM
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1. For the winch, get one of these batteries; http://www.atomikrc.com/collections/...r-nimh-battery
2. Tekin aren't great. I've seen and heard horror stories of them blowing up while running in a fire. At our track, they one time had blown up 3 of them in 1 day!
Motor; http://www.ebay.com/itm/Novak-Ballis...-/330991597818
ESC; http://www.dollarhobbyz.com/traxxas-...xl-3s-esc.html
Old 08-19-2014, 12:21 PM
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I think you're on the right track but I suggest looking at a smaller 3S battery, something down in the 2000mAh range. I run a 2S 1600 or a 3S 1800 and a 3S 2000 in my trucks. As long as your'e staying with low-wind motors, the amp draw isn't an issue and run-time isn't either. The benefit here is that the lower mAh packs are physically smaller, thus allowing you to mount them in different places. A 3S 5000 is a brick and takes up a lot of space. It can be done but these small packs still run 45minutes or more at times.

Tekin, Novak, Holmes Hobbies are a few well-known brands. In my opinion a 35T will give you plenty of speed on 3S. I've run a 55T on 2S before and it topped out at about 7MPH. My guess is the 35T / 3S should clip the high teens / 20mph. I run a sensored brushless system in my trucks. One has an Integy 31.5T motor w/ a SpeedPassion ESC on 2S and the other (being upgraded at the moment) is a TrakPower 21.5T sensored system powered by 3S. As stated, it's still under partial construction but I expect it to have power to crawl but can "burst" to hop out of a tight spot when needed.

If you choose to go brushless then it has to be a sensored system. Unsensored systems will cog and are unpleasant when trying to drive slow. Brushed motors don't have that issue which is why they're a popular choice.

As far as the winch issue, there are of course a few ways to do it but I suggest the BEC regardless. It will allow more current flow and you don't have to worry about accessories draining your ESCs BEC circuit which can cause a shutdown. Just set the output to what your servos can handle. Otherwise some guys will run a separate power source to the winch if they want to deliver more voltage than the servos can handle. The ESC could probably handle that servo on it's own but I still advise running it off the BEC for assurance and reliability.
Old 08-19-2014, 04:48 PM
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I always recommend running a Bec where servo performance is important. From what I understand turning the wheels of a crawler on angled rocks can put a high load on a servo. The voltage of a typical internal 5amp Bec is 5-5.5v and can drop significantly under the load of a single servo, especially a stalled servo. With a 10amp Bec set to 6.5v (which a 6.0v servo can take) you won't see much if any voltage drop and will get maximum performance at all times.

Collector1231, While the Traxxas VXL3s esc does support sensored brushless motors it's a well known fact that it doesn't play well with all sensored motors. Are you certain the motor you linked is one it will play nice with?
Old 08-20-2014, 03:45 AM
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All I can say... Those tough armor bumpers are very heavy and can hinder the approach angles.

im running front and rear ones on one of my crawlers and it's no where as good at crawling as my other one with stock raised bumpers
Old 08-20-2014, 04:59 PM
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Collector: I've heard good and bad things about both Tekin and Novak. I own a Tekin Sensored 13.5T brushless that powers my TL-01 through a 4:1 GRU and I absolutely love the motor! It works wonderfully and even with the vents, it has stood up to lots of snow, and is still running strong at cool temps. I also own two VXL3S ESCs, one of which powers the Tekin sensored motor. I've bought the VXL3S in the past because of it's capabilities and high amp output. They run a lot hotter than I would like them to and I've had one short out, creating a burn hole in the waterproofing silicone, but it still works amazingly... I hear other hobbyists have similar issues so I'm kinda shying away from putting one in my new crawler. The Novak 21.5T sensored motor doesn't look bad though. I didn't seen that one...

After changing to lipo, NiMh is the last thing I want to use, sorry. I prefer to drain one battery pack if possible, thus the thought of a separate BEC. Thanks anyway!

BKoz559: Would like a 3000mAh battery be more reasonable? I'm not so sure I want to dive down to 2000mAh... I've read that people like putting the battery in the front to achieve more weight over the front axle to help with flipping and approach angles. That sounds like a better idea.

I've used a 55T Holmes Hobbies motor and blew it up on 2S. I think it was because it required more voltage. I'm thinking either 35T or 45T on 3S. If I were to go 35T, what brand (Tekin, Novak, Holmes Hobbies, etc) of ESC/motor combo would you recommend? I like the idea of a BEC, but I've never had to use one. I know how they wire though, so I might put one it. How are the Holmes Hobbies ESCs?

Overdrive: I think I will go ahead and plan on an BEC.

Phmaximus: Do they offer aluminum ones that have winch mounts? I've read that it's a real pain to try and mount a winch to the stock bumper, but maybe I read wrong. I don't like the idea of it most likely flexing and all that during a scale recovery. I want to take some footage of this thing, and plastic flexing bumpers aren't real cool when it comes to a scale video.

Thanks guys for replying so quickly! My computer was down last night, but I got her running good again, thus the late reply. Are there any other things that I should add, change, or don't need in my build description above? It's great to have active and willing members to turn to when I'm trying to figure something out. Thanks!
Old 08-21-2014, 09:24 AM
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Yeah, that battery would be fine. Those small batteries are a personal preference for me. But you want to place the battery at least ahead of the transmission. Some guys mount it sideways on the "up slope" of the chassis rails just behind the front shock towers. Some guys run them between the shock towers and make their own mount. Mine is small so I was able to place it ahead of the towers, practically over the steering linkage. Experiment and see what you like best. I don't really like the Axial front mounted battery tray option because it lifts the tray over the receiver box and raises the CG. Either mount ahead of the receiver box or relocate it and mount the battery as low as possible.

I will recommend wheel weights or steel wheels to help with the weight distribution. If you're going to use plastic wheels, weights on the front set will help. One of my trucks has a set of Integy black steel 1.9s while my Honcho runs either some GMade raw steel 1.9s or some RC4WD 1.55 "Wagon Wheels". The weight down lown helps prevent back-flips and generally helps the truck remain more stable.

I had "everything" up front for a while which worked but sometimes descending down a grade would cause the tail to lift. I then moved the ESC and receiver to the rear section and the truck feels balanced.
Old 08-21-2014, 03:40 PM
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Battery in front, ESC and maybe receiver in the back. Got it.

What if I did a Holmes Hobbies ESC and Motor combo? I hear good things about their motors but I haven't read much on their ESCs. What do you all think?

(For thread visitors) What combo does everyone run and what would you recommend for doing some slow crawling for the SCX10 based off your own experiences?
Old 08-21-2014, 03:42 PM
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I imagine steel wheels would have much more effect than little wheel weights. I will look into getting some after the build when I do different tires also. Thanks! Due to the budget, I am sticking with stock wheels/tires for now.
Old 08-22-2014, 12:22 AM
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Stock wheels and tyres are great... The stock wheels do there job without fail and the ripsaw tyres have great traction...
but, it needs wheel weights. Wheel weights are the single most effective upgrade for a scx10.

I wouldent stress about about the battery location in regards to COG. Yes the honcho style tray is high and above the steering servo. But realistically a 2s 5000mah lipo only weighs around 250g... Lowing 250g 30mm on a 1.81kg truck makes no noticeable difference

my recommendation would be to buy a Holmes hobbies torque master ESC and 2 cheap motors for experimenting. Ie. Axial 27t and a axial 35t. Then try the 27t on 2s and the 35t on 3s..... Then see what's more suited to your skill level. Because crawling is 80% skill 30% setup

Last edited by phmaximus; 08-22-2014 at 12:34 AM.
Old 08-23-2014, 06:33 PM
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I'm wanting to crawl slow and 3S is preferred for me, as I've blown enough motors on the 7v range. I'm pretty sure the G6 has Trepadors and I've heard those aren't nearly as good as the ripsaws, but do work. So I guess I will wear those down first, then upgrade.

I think I have some crawling strategies and that should help with my appearing skills, but we will see when I hit the trails! lol

27T seems like it would be just too fast. I want some good throttle control for this slow scale crawling, and I'm thinking 35T is my route. I'm feeling really good about the Holmes Hobbies ESC and 35T Expert/Pro motor. That or the FX-R and 35T, but the Holmes combo has like no bad ratings and I might just go with it. I've bought cheap electronics before with some luck (FlySky and PPP servos), but I haven't had good luck with cheap ESCs/motors. I think I will stick to my instincts and go with a more permanent setup. Thanks for your comment though!

What would you do for mounting a winch without using a heavy Tough Armor bumper?
Originally Posted by phmaximus
Stock wheels and tyres are great... The stock wheels do there job without fail and the ripsaw tyres have great traction...
but, it needs wheel weights. Wheel weights are the single most effective upgrade for a scx10.

I wouldent stress about about the battery location in regards to COG. Yes the honcho style tray is high and above the steering servo. But realistically a 2s 5000mah lipo only weighs around 250g... Lowing 250g 30mm on a 1.81kg truck makes no noticeable difference

my recommendation would be to buy a Holmes hobbies torque master ESC and 2 cheap motors for experimenting. Ie. Axial 27t and a axial 35t. Then try the 27t on 2s and the 35t on 3s..... Then see what's more suited to your skill level. Because crawling is 80% skill 30% setup
Old 08-23-2014, 08:30 PM
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Can't say there is any reliability issues with the cheap Axial motors. The RTR 27t variants seem super reliable and there are enough examples of the 35t motor on 3s to know it's safe. It's just the modified motors are more efficient and can be rebuilt so generally they are considered better... In short the Axial motors are not the best in the world, but they do there job well.

Sounds like u have a good idea on what u want, sounds like a solid plan

as for the winch... I wonder if it's as simple as bolting it to the bumper????
Old 08-23-2014, 09:17 PM
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Hey, forgot to mention these...

One of these BL combos would have a lot of low end torque...and defiantly worth a look.
http://www.hobbywing.com/product_show.asp?id=262
Old 08-24-2014, 06:53 PM
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I can try it with the stock bumper and see how it goes. Good point!

What shock oil weight should I run? I haven't a clue what's good for crawling...
Old 08-24-2014, 10:24 PM
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Generally start at around 30-35wt and go down from there, keeping in mind lighter oils will leak more. The big thing IMO is... build the shocks with zero rebound so it does not hinder flex.
Old 08-25-2014, 05:20 AM
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Got it! Thanks! I think I will try 30wt with no rebound. I hate leaky shocks and from all the big advertising that Axial does for these shocks, I have high expectations for their performance and seals. We'll see what all the big hipe is about... lol

Is the 3Racing winch or the RC4WD 9.5cti winch better? I like the RC4WD wireless controller and I'm willing to pay for it...
Old 08-25-2014, 06:21 AM
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I have the 3Racing winch. It works but I can't say if it's better than the RC4WD as I haven't made a first-person comparison. I read that the RC4 is a reliable unit and most argue that it is stronger. Again, all hear say.

I have Maxxis Treppadors, Pro-Line Flat Irons, Axial Rip Saws and RC4WD Mud Thrashers for my trucks. Overall the Rip Saws bite the best and are smaller diameter than the Maxxis and Pro-Line tires. The Flat Irons rank #2 in overall grip while the Maxxis and Mud Thrashers are about the same. Not to say the last two are useless; just when they are compared to the others they rank last. This is based on rock climbing more than dirt/trail riding. The Maxxis are a better all-terrain tire including loose dirt. The Rip Saws are useless in sand; for me they bite down on a rock face and I can get up sections my buddies spin their tires on. I notice more slipping with the other tires. Right now I'm using the Flat Irons on the Honcho the most and switch between the Rip Saws or Mud Thrashers ocassionally, depending on what mood I'm in. The Jeep will run the Maxxis tires.

I agree with the Holmes ESCs. Many guys speak highly of them and my brother runs one in his Wraith. No complaints. I have an Axial AE-2 in my toolbox that I ran previously and it works, I believe, just as well. Both are programmable with the "Castle Link" USB attachment. That's a $22 item but worth it. I still have a couple of the 27T Axial motors and while they will give you more wheel speed, they do slow down well enough to crawl. My brother was using a 55T Integy lathe motor. I think he finally traded out to a Novak but that Integy rolls right along.
Old 08-26-2014, 02:33 PM
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I hear good things about the Integy lathe motors, but I think they are discontinued?

Flat Irons could be an option eventually. I've read good reviews on the RC4WD Super Swampers also. What are some good steel wheels that are beadlocks so I can change tires occasionally? (for future upgrades)

Phmaximus: I think I might have found some alloy front bumpers, but not sure if they have the correct holes for the RC4WD winch. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Integy-c2469...item3ce5f2b9c3 I don't really want to drill mounting holes in it, and I have no clue if there is a screw in the way or what. I'm guessing the holes might be for the Integy winch. What do you think?
Old 08-26-2014, 07:18 PM
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They look alright.... But after some thought... If ur planing to really use the winch u might have to get the steel ones for durability issues
i think there is a tough armour bumper for the g6, it's narrower and lighter than the other one

ive got a few winches and I can honestly say the RC4wd bulldog winch is a lot more powerful then the others...

And if u get a controller be sure to get one that gets it's power from the battery not the BEC

here are my twins
Old 08-27-2014, 03:16 AM
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Something like this.... ?

http://www.rpphobby.com/product_p/rra01fbg6.htm
Old 08-27-2014, 04:06 AM
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I read the specs and the 9.5cti winch was listed as being stronger. I hear great reviews on them too. Yes, I plan to use the winch. I found some of the other Tough Armor bumpers that have winch mounts. I like the Winch Bumper w/ Stinger. But once again, is it much of a weight loss from the one we have been discussing? I can see where the Competition Stinger Bumper or the Stubby Bumper would be a lot lighter. Thoughts?

Warn 9.5cti Winch: http://store.rc4wd.com/RC4WD-110-War...ch_p_3734.html

Competition Stinger Bumper: http://store.rc4wd.com/Tough-Armor-C...10_p_2068.html

Stubby Bumper: http://store.rc4wd.com/Tough-Armor-S...10_p_2069.html

Winch Bumper w/ Stinger: http://store.rc4wd.com/Tough-Armor-W...er_p_3782.html


BTW- Are you running the Winch Bumper with Grill Guard on your SCX10 in the pic?
Old 08-27-2014, 04:09 AM
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Sorry, but I can't bring myself to spend $60 on a front bumper. I can't afford it. Looks nice though, just wish it was cheaper. lol
Old 08-27-2014, 07:26 AM
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Those are nice bumpers. It's something you can always invest in later.

In regards to wheels, I have a couple sets of GMade and an Integy set. The GMade look like they have a better overall fit & finish. The RC4WD wheels are real nice and many of them are replicas of real truck wheels. So, if you're trying to maintain a budget then look at some GMade as you can get a set in the upper $40 - $50 range. The Integy set was closer to $60 ( https://www.google.com/shopping/prod...ed=0CBwQ8wIwAQ ). I can't post a full web page because I'm on a work computer and it blocks "entertainment" sites so this is the Google search. Hopefully it comes up for you.

If you think about it, the Axial wheel weights are about $10 per wheel. So, their cost isn't much less than getting a set of new wheels. Plus, new wheels change the appearance of your rig.
Old 08-27-2014, 08:32 AM
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You are right about investing in them later, but I kinda want to mount my winch on the right bumper from the start and get using it without issues...

Thanks for the link. It did work, but those are aluminum alloy wheels, not steel. I will have to look at the Gmade wheels when I get a chance. But like I said, these will be for after I wear out the stock wheels/tires. I will buy better tires to put on one of these steels sets once I need them, or can't stand the tipping and rollovers.

I got one of Tower's emails and they are featuring the G6 Kit this labor day. It's one sale for $274.99 I think. I'm trying to find out if I can still get 11% off like they had for earlier this month. That would put the price down to about $245, saving me $55. Is that a good price? Or will Black Friday/Cyber Monday top it? I have enough saved to buy the Kit / Servo / BEC / Shock Oil from Tower. Also enough to do some of the other things. I need a little more than $100 yet to have enough for the whole build. Is it a go on the Tower order with that kind of deal?
Old 08-27-2014, 10:00 AM
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That seems like a pretty fair deal because I believe the kit was $299 or more at one point. Even if you're not a Tower member you can still use one of their discount codes posted on the home page. If you have a membership, you can get $35 off that kit and free shipping. I think they're still running the $1.99 membership trial so, if you aren't a member already, you may want to consider it. It's $9.99 a year otherwise. I always renew 2 years at a time.

I picked up my Wrangler Rubicon kit last year when it dropped to $249. I applied an additional coupon and had it shipped free. I added in a few small things and a $19.99 2-year membership renewal and the total bill came out to $250.44. The thing I notice with Tower is that they'll put current / popular models on a brief sale once in a while, like a holiday. Then it won't go on sale again for a long time, if it ever does again. Then if the product gets discontinued they drop the price significantly and you can potentially score a huge deal. But, you never really know when it's going to happen. I found the Traxxas XO-1 for $530 and I could apply another $80 coupon to it. I was going to take the deal but the next day they were all sold out. I waited too long.

Anyhow, you're right about those Integy wheels. I kept calling them steel but I was thinking about the inner ring. The wheel halves are anodized aluminum but I'm pretty sure the inner ring is steel. I feels dense and the color doesn't look like aluminum. But, I could be mistaken on that also. GMades have a steel outer face but the rest of the pieces are cast from another metal. Looks like the same stuff they make "Hot Wheels" out of.

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