jjl5590

Hello there!

Feels good to be back... I have been out of the hobby for about 3 years, thought I'd try and get back into it. I'll soon be in the market for a new RC once I've sold my current ones (Xray 808 .28 and Mini Erevo). I've owned quite a few over the years such as the Revo 3.3 and original ERevo, HPI Vorza, and a Kyosho Mega Force back in the day.

So as soon as I decided I wanted to get back into RC, I headed straight to the Traxxas site to see if they'd released anything new in the past few years. I was greeted with the new ERevo 2.0, and I thought it looked pretty good, even though it is pretty expensive. I enjoyed my old ERevo I sold a long time ago, however I did feel that even on 6s it didn't have the blistering speed a was after.

I then had a look over at HPI, but nothing new. I enjoyed driving the Vorza when I had it - I was actually using the Castle 2650kv motor on 6s for insane speed, which was not recommended as the motor could frequently exceed 60,000rpm if I remember correctly.

Whilst googling Traxxas, I noticed that they've become involved with a manufacturer called Arrma. After doing a bit of researching I am left with a slightly sour taste in my mouth regarding Traxxas. I also did some research on this company that was new to me, and I gotta say Arrma make some kick-ass kits! I was very surprised, and now the ERevo 2.0 has taken a back seat in my mind.

So! Apologies for the long intro, I've now got my sights set on an Arrma vehicle! Having researched them all extensively, I STILL can't figure out which one will suit me best... Price is not necessary an object if it is justified. I've "narrowed" my choice down to these:

- Nero (w/ diff brain)
- hard to get in UK, spares availability?
- heaviest therefore slowest?

- Kraton
- Looks decent, heard the Talion is faster

- Outcast (found one used for £350)
- Similar to Kraton, marketed as more of a 'fun' truck
- not really liking the stock bodyshell

- Talion
- Leaning towards this the most, potentially fastest.
- But looks like the cheapest (eg. no mudguards or centre brace) but is more expensive than Kraton?

- Fazon (can't find in UK)

Avoiding the Typhon as I'd like a change from buggies.

And that's my dilemma! I just can't decided which one to invest in. I don't race, only bash - typically in my local park which has a bit of everything, including asphalt. I'm terrible at making up my mind, so any help would be truly appreciated.

Cheers

RustyUs

+1 on sour taste!

Forget about the Nero.

Kraton is basically like taking the Talion and putting bigger tires on it.

The way I see your situation, and/or breakdown... do you want a monster truggy, or stunt truck? Longer wheelbase, or shorter wheelbase?

As long as you have a parts source, go for it!

bill_delong

+1 on sour taste, I'll never spend another dime on any Traxxas products until they release all their patents and stop making frivolous lawsuits

Be sure to check for parts... ARRMA recently went bankrupt and was bought by Horizon... it could take some time for parts distribution to be fully restored.

Other brands to consider are HoBao, RedCat and Losi.... do any of those brands have parts distributed in your area?

jjl5590

Thanks for the replies

Having been out of the hobby for 8 years, I don't understand why brushless vehicles have only now become mainstream. Why is everyone treating it like it's the new thing?

8 years ago I was running the E-Revo and HPI Vorza, both on 6s lipo. 8 years later and it seems nothing's changed, apart from the lipo discharge rate has improved slightly. Prices are still the same, performance is still the same, why the hype? Everyone's raving about crazy 6s power, but it's been around for nearly a decade... Am I missing something?

bill_delong

While brushless has been around for some time, there are some brands who have made vast improvements over the years. It's known that sensorless motors run faster top end for many reasons, however racers often prefer sensored for smoother throttle control in low speed sections... and some ESC's will dynamically shift between sensored mode and into sensorless when going above a configurable RPM setting. Telemetry has also been introduced which provides audible alerts for preset limits on temp and ability to record logged sessions for peak voltage draw/RPM to further tune for efficiency/power needs. There comes a point of diminishing return when having a higher capacity battery to provide more punch, but at the risk of adding too much weight which can be detrimental to performance and telemetry helps isolate these conditions to tune for optimal performance.

The geometry of modern racing designs have been completely revolutionized over the past couple of years. All current 2WD cars introduced to market are mid motor layout now, this goes against everything that was believed "standard" 8 years ago. Tekno has redefined the 1/10 4WD class with tons of new features that have never before seen in the industry. Tire technology has also changed drastically, along with a myriad of brands on the market offering countless blends of tire sauce for every imaginable track condition. We've seen dozen's of new aftermarket manufactures enter the market with support for custom lightened parts + ceramic bearings as Stock racing classes have completely taken over pretty much world wide. In support of stock racing, we've seen several brands push the limits of ROAR specs to where a stock 13.5T motor today is about the equivalent of a 10.5T motor made 8 years ago. The new standard for chargers is to have an IR checker included, this provides key information about the health of your batteries giving you an idea of when it's time to replace them before you start to lose performance.

Simply put, it would be like taking a knife to a gun fight if I took my current equipment and went back 8 years to any race club, on any track condition and I would blow away any driver of equal skill.

jjl5590

An interesting reply!

8 years ago I was running the Vorza with the CC 2650kv motor on a Turnigy 6s 5000mAh 30C lipo. It was a blast, very quick. And the buggy was super strong too. The whole package set me back around £500, which is cheaper than what would be today!

Would you say these new models are any better than the Vorza or Savage Flux?

bill_delong

From a basher perspective, I would agree that much hasn't changed in the 1/8 lineup, most bashers aren't interested in having improved handling characteristics offered by race grade designs, but just to give you some insight on what has become more general knowledge today that was considered "experimental" 8 years ago:

CVD vs Universals: CVD's offer better traction on smooth surfaces, Universals offer better stability in bumpy conditions... I carry both types of drive shafts and will swap out to the appropriate shaft depending on where I am running.

Bladder vs Emulsion: Bladder has pretty much gone the way of the Dodo, while they offer far more adjust-ability with pack, they tend to be very inconsistent and difficult to properly match up where Emulsion is smoother and generally offers more traction, and always provide the same pack every time.

HPI was once an industry leader, they had owned Hot Bodies Racing and were considered to be one of the best brands on the planet. Then Traxxas sued HPI for patent infringement, within a couple years of the lawsuit, HPI would go bankrupt and was chopped up, Hot Bodies would sell off to Neidhardt and RipMax bought HPI... the HPI you see today is nothing like the HPI you once knew 8 years ago. Soar used to be the manufacturer who produced the majority of products for HPI and they would split off into making their own line of race grade kits. Not long after HPI was sold, it was ARRMA who then became an industry giant, but it should come to no surprise that Traxxas would then file another lawsuit against ARRMA for patent infringement (now establishing Traxxas as a "Patent Troll") and then ARRMA would go bankrupt a couple years later... they were just sold to Horizon a couple weeks ago so there is hope that ARRMA may recover better than HPI.

That being said, I believe the ARRMA Typhon is considered a step up from the Vorza, there are also other new releases from basher brands like HoBao and RedCat too.

HongNor was another basher brand, but he retired a few years ago and the brand was discontinued completely, however RedCat recently brought back the 4WD SCT that is a direct copy from HongNor giving hope to see more of their designs make a come back

jjl5590

After watching a lot of Youtube videos, I think I will go for the Talion. I feel if I go for anything else, I'll be disappointed. Watching the Kraton pass speed runs at 50mph, it looked so slow. It won't give me the adrenaline rush I'm looking for. I was very unimpressed when I had my brushless e-revo on 6s many years ago.

That just leaves the Talion, which for some reason is more expensive than the Kraton even though it seems to be less equipped (e.g. no mudguards). Not sure why it costs more. I don't like the fact I'd have to immediately upgrade the Kraton's tires out of the box, which is another £60 straight away.

I'm also confused as to why the Talion V2 box stated 60mph, but the V3 box states 70mph?

The Typhon looks nice for speed, but I'd like a change from buggies having already owned a Vorza 6s, Hyper 7 6s, and Xray 808 .28.

EXT2Rob

My Feedback: (1)

They may have upped the motor RPM/volt (kv), or upped the pinion on the V3.
Mud guards aren't a problem...get some sheet foam from a craft store and some Shoo-Goo. You can cut the sheet foam to any shape/size and the goo is a great adhesive. I made mud guards for the front end of my SCT to keep the dirt slung from the front wheels from getting into the chassis.

MailManX

Another option is Team Associated. They make some pretty tough stuff. I bought a used RC8.2E a couple years and beat the crap out of it. Easy to fix with readily available affordable parts.

RustyUs

I couldn't agree more with an eBuggy for bashing, especially the RC8.2e, but I had to point out OP wants a change from that group of RCs .