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-   -   Brushed motors, ESC's, and Turns (http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/rc-electric-off-road-trucks-buggies-truggies-more-147/10520440-brushed-motors-escs-turns.html)

ImTheJoker4U2 05-14-2011 07:39 PM

Brushed motors, ESC's, and Turns
 
I keep finding conflicting information, and I cant seem to find any straight answers.


What are turns?
What significance do they have?
Whats the difference between a 540 and a 550 motor?
Why do some ESC's only support certain motors?
Can they be modified to run hotter motors?


I have a Duratrax Sprint that says it will run 20-27 turn stock motors. What will happen if I run my modified 15 turn motor in it?
Ive already run it a few minutes and it seems fine......

Thanks for answering some noob questions in advance:)

FoamyVictim 05-14-2011 10:06 PM

RE: Brushed motors, ESC's, and Turns
 
Turns used to refer to how many times the wire was wrapped around the armature. The lower the number, the faster the motor. It works the same way with brushless, even though the motor is different in structure.

540/550 refers to the length of the motor. 540 is standard, 550 is larger/longer, which means more torque at the expense of weight.(bigger motor is heavier and takes up more space)

The motor limit is due to the fact that ESCs are rated for a certain amp draw. A low turn mod motor can exceed the power output of a typical RTR ESC. Sometimes the lower turn motors aren't as "High-performance" as others and won't overwhelm the ESC. If its working ok, then you should be fine. If the ESC gets hot, stop... you might fry it.

ThunderbirdJunkie 05-14-2011 10:10 PM

RE: Brushed motors, ESC's, and Turns
 
ThunderbirdJunkie feels it worth noting that because of basic physics and the natural torque of a larger motor, a 550 15 turn motor will draw less current than a 15 turn 540 motor, but will also make less raw power.

If you're running 1/10 scale 2w classes, it's getting harder and harder to find a good, rebuildable brushed motor. Trinity seems to have discontinued the old Speed Gems line (ThunderbirdJunkie has an old Onyx 2 in his B4.1), and everybody else has seemed to follow suit.

The parts seem to remain available, but it's only a matter of time before brushes, springs, and armatures dry up from a supply standpoint. We'll probably see a small cadre of motor builders that do it for S&Gs remain peddling these wares, but unfortunately (since ThunderbirdJunkie prefers the feel of a brushed system in a 2w buggy) brushless has taken over.

No biggie, though, since there's a Tekin 13.5/RS combo and a Novak Havoc 13.5 combo sitting on the desk waiting for parts supplies for brushed motors to dry up[&:]

FoamyVictim 05-14-2011 10:42 PM

RE: Brushed motors, ESC's, and Turns
 
I didn't want to get TOO technical on him... just some basics, but TBJ is correct.

ImTheJoker4U2 05-15-2011 05:39 AM

RE: Brushed motors, ESC's, and Turns
 
Thanks for the replies guys. I added some extra cooling fins, so we'll see if that works. If not Ive got an XL-5 on its way back from Traxxas I can toss in there that should support a 15 turn motor..

I bought a lot of "racing" motors and misc parts. This is kinda related, so I hope someone can help.

Some of them are unmarked except for numbers handwritten on the can (incedently one of them is a speed gem:))
Here what they say:

15.1
15.4
16.2
16.3
16x2
15x5

Im guessing that the 15 & 16 are the # of turns, what do you think the last number represents?

FoamyVictim 05-15-2011 06:30 AM

RE: Brushed motors, ESC's, and Turns
 
Well, since they are hand written, I can't be sure but I don't think so. If you look into the motor from the side, you should be able to roll the armature over until a little white label with a number is visible. That will tell you the "Wind" or number of turns. Not all are marked though, so if you're still curious, take it to a local hobby shop and get someone in the know to look for you.

Link119 05-15-2011 06:31 AM

RE: Brushed motors, ESC's, and Turns
 
Winds...<div>Its the number of wire strands, so a 15x4 is 4 strands of wire being wrapped around 15 times.</div>

ImTheJoker4U2 05-15-2011 03:30 PM

RE: Brushed motors, ESC's, and Turns
 

Quote:

ORIGINAL: Crapxxas19

Winds...<div>Its the number of wire strands, so a 15x4 is 4 strands of wire being wrapped around 15 times.</div>
Ok
So what is the advantage of a 10x2 vs say a 20x1?

Is a 15x4 equal to 60x1?? I thought lower numbers were what I wanted??

Im so lost lol



Update on the Duratrax Sprint ESC on a 15x1 modded motor:
So far, So good. Runs a bit warm, but thats what the extra cooling fins are for:cool:

ImTheJoker4U2 05-22-2011 04:36 AM

RE: Brushed motors, ESC's, and Turns
 
So which motor would be faster, a 15X5 or 15X1?

What are the advantages to more strands vs more winds?

myposrustler 05-22-2011 07:38 AM

RE: Brushed motors, ESC's, and Turns
 

Quote:

ORIGINAL: ImTheJoker4U2

So which motor would be faster, a 15X5 or 15X1?

What are the advantages to more strands vs more winds?
the 15x5 is going to have less punch off the line but more rpm if your on a high grip track the 15x1 would be good to exit the corners lots of power but on a slick track the more strands will give it less power to help keep the rear from brakeing loose

ImTheJoker4U2 05-25-2011 06:29 AM

RE: Brushed motors, ESC's, and Turns
 

Quote:

ORIGINAL: myposrustler


Quote:

ORIGINAL: ImTheJoker4U2

So which motor would be faster, a 15X5 or 15X1?

What are the advantages to more strands vs more winds?
the 15x5 is going to have less punch off the line but more rpm if your on a high grip track the 15x1 would be good to exit the corners lots of power but on a slick track the more strands will give it less power to help keep the rear from brakeing loose
That clears it up - Thanks!!:)

My last question is about motor timing.
I've read on how to do it (hook up a few AA's and turn the endcap while taking a reading on the multimeter) but I cant seem to figure out how to hook up the meter properly, or what an ideal reading is.
Which way do I hook it up (Top is parallel, bottom is series) and what do I set the meter to read?

http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m.../motortime.jpg


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