ckangaroo70

My Feedback: (51)

I have owned the FMS, Great Planes G2, and Great Planes G3, and although these are all good simulators, I have my own ideas of what would make a great simulator. The technology is in place to have a Sim look, and react anyway one could imagine a good Sim should look and feel. Im would love to hear everyones ideas regarding what you think would make a good simulator. To start this off I will share my ideas.

As you start the Sim I believe it should run in "First Person" much like what you would see in a good video game like "Half-Life", or anyone of the many shooter or war games like "Call of Duty", etc. etc. "First Person" means that you see through the eyes of the character you run in the game or sim. First off the Sim should start with you in your Hangar(Garage). A garage wall in front of you at this point is only stocked with one Trainer Plane. You will have to earn Tokens as you advance to have money to buy other Planes. As you progress your Hangar will be stocked with Planes that you have selected to keep in your Hangar. You should also be able to previously equip each Plane before you add it to your Hangar. For Example: Radio Equipment, Engine, Hardware(A good place for sponsors to get there names used like Sullivan, Dubro,etc.). You should also have the option of using various sponsors decals upon your Plane if you so wish, or have a Monokote Box within your Hangar where you can change colors of any airplane instead of having to do it through a photo editor program. All these features though will have to be earned with tokens as your flying progresses.

Once you have decided on which Airplane to take, you should also be able to decide what field equipment you wish to use. You will start with the basics, and extras will have to be bought by using Tokens(I will give more detail into the Token thing later). Once you have selected some equipment, type of Fuel and amount with your starting funds(Prices based on Tower Hobbies Current prices, and updated each time game is loaded) you are ready to head to the field with your Plane.

Once you arrive at the field you need to first make your way to the AMA(Plug for AMA) frequency board. If you are flying online you will have to make sure someone else is not flying on that frequency, and even offline there should be Computer Generatated People (NPC) who are allready there flying aircraft, and not just frozen still photos. The environment and field activity would actually be going on around you, and in first person mode you should be able to walk around the field. You would also be able to taunt and torment other Online or NPC Flyers be giving "Know it all suggestions", or you should be able to offer kind words of encouragement for someone who is just starting, or to someone who has just crashed. You should also be able to go out and inspect crash sites because crashes should have a more realistic appearence in this sim and based upon type of crash, how fast, and how hard.

Now to get back on track....
After you have placed your AMA Card upon the frequency board, you are ready to place your Plane upon the Plane Stand. A smart computer Sim will not be easy on you here. There is any number of potential problems that could be facing you before you fire your Plane up. Plus you may want to experiment with another Prop or something at this point. In first person mode you turn your Radio and Plane "ON". In first person mode you take the ignitor and starter from your field box after turning on the power and fire the engine over after you have set your throttle on the transmitter. The Engine fires up easily, but you may find that it is running lean, or is running to rich, and you will have to tweak the needles which will be located just like they are on the specific engine you have chosen. Once you have tweaked the engine and you are happy with the way it is running, it is now time to check your control surfaces to make sure they are going in the proper direction. You may actually even have to adjust linkage if you do not have enough room to trim on the radio. Since you are in first person mode, it is always a good idea not to walk into a moving prop, and stay clear of flying Planes because in this sim you could be hit and knocked to the ground, or worse. Tokens will also be deducted for unsafe practices.

Now you are happy with the Plane, and decide it is ready to fly. The sweet thing about this sim is that the Instructor takes the field with you if you choose to use one. The instructor will stand by your side and give you instruction. This smart Instructor will take control from you when you mess up, and save you from losing tokens, because crashing Planes will be very hard on your Pocket Book, and Tokens will be deducted from you for each crash. A good sim will reward you when you do good, and make it rough for you to progress if you do not follow proper procedures.

If you are allready a good pilot then you will move on quickly to advanced, and have no trouble earning tokens to buy better aircraft, accessories, etc. If you are just starting out you will really have to earn your way.

My whole idea is that a sim should be as close to real experience as possible, and with todays technology there is no reason why it can't be. It shouldn't take the place of actual flying, but there it should be a heck of a lot closer than what it is right now. Heavier product advertising could be utilized within the sim to help offset some of the cost since most sims are currently priced fairly high. There would probally be some increase in cost, but a sim of this caliber would be in high demand.

I also think that there should be penalties within the sim. This way you are really trying your best, and not just crashing Planes because it seems like a fun thing to do, and in the current sims there is no penalty. Thus I believe a token system should be used. Every action within the sim will either add or deduct tokens from your account. Every item including Planes will have to be bought by using tokens, and you may find yourself at one point not being able to replace a plane you worked hard to design because you crashed it beyond repairs, and you don't have the funds to fix it. Light crashes will only cost you in repairs, but you might find you may not be able to fly the Plane until you have earned enough to make the repairs. A good sim has to have consequences in my opinion to be really good, and currently none of the ones out today do. If you are brave enough to do an inverted pass 3" off the runway, then you are brave enough to face the consequences should you crash.

Now lets hear your ideas............................................. ....

rc-rodeo

Wow,

what a long story!
But my conclusion is, I do completely disagree.

I'm not interested in a PC adventure game with tokens, but in a RC simulator.

A garage with limited selection of models? Which models do you include?
There are many different preferences all around the world. And the Tower Hobbies prices do not affect me at all in Germany. And what about the free models added every day to the rc community?
How would you handle several hundred models?
And why should a real RC jet pilot be bothered with starting and adjusting a trainer engine?

Same for equipment and sponsor decals, the leading simulators are not only sold in USA.
So it's much more effective to add colours and decals by an external drawing program.

You have to make your way up by tokens to afford more aircrafts and equipment?
Do you think a competition pilot, who wants to practice 3D maneuvres, will accept to be patronized by a simulator? If you make the token system very easy, it's useless. If you make it hard, many will not agree, because they have different intentions.

Engine adjustments: Is it possible to simulate all the different factors, engine types, propeller sizes, air pressure, humidity, hours of usage, quality of fuel and so on? Perhaps it is, but will the effort be justified? I don't think so.

Although some simulators already simulate crashes in a certain extent, I'm not interested in this at all. I want to fly, not to crash, and I would accept a simple noise, if the crash detection program runs fine.

Penalties within the sim? Again, the most important topic of a rc sim is the flight physics, not a computer game attitude. The developers should spend their time in improving the physics and not to how to punish a user of the sim.

So if you would offer me such a simulator, my answer would be: No, no, no.

Regards
Rodeo
www.rodeo.onlinehome.de

STLPilot

My Feedback: (21)

The biggest problem Kangaroo you have yourself facing here is that RC is small, very small. Your talking millions of dollars in man hours to produce all of this and a market so small that it won't be a good business decision for anyone to create such a package.

Not even Microsoft Flight Sim goes into that much detail with it's AI engine and they have a market that's 100 times larger then RC industry. Not too mention that they are on the store shelves of Best Buy and Comp USA.

What your thinking is neat and probably in the future you will see such and animal. But not until the market demands it.

Now if you make a game that includes guns and bullets ... that will fly. For instance a grumpy ol man comes over to you and tells you not to hover over the runway and you whip out a HK and saw him in half, now you've caught the attention of the gamers and may have some sales.

It's all dollars and cents. Whose going to invest their millions for their millions and then some in return.

Anyhow ... if it does come out, I'll at least buy it.

Greg.B

Hi Kangaroo,

How much time did it take you to write all of that[X(]????

Are you feeling ok[sm=bananahead.gif]???

_____________________________________________

I know, there are only like 11 people here in the UK that do it[&o][][sm=tired.gif]! (no sorry it's my mistake it's 10[X(]!).

You too Dion, I get that all the time[]!(I also get told not to hover over the:Cat/house/helicopter/2nd Cat/Free flight people etc.....)

And he doesn't even know how much it will cost[X(]! Look at all of those 0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000[sm=greedy.gif]!

Fly-n-3D

The tokens, engine tuning, etc, should be options that you could turn on and off. The sim should have graphics like XTR, a wide selection of planes like AFPD, and an aircraft editor like G3. The sim should have a lot of events like pylon racing, limbo, etc. And like ckangroo 70 said, it should let you paint your aircraft in the sim and you should be able to put decals on it in the sim. You can have the option of it coming with a interlink controller or using your own. There should be a full version and a lite version. The full version should sell for $130 and the lite version $60. The lite version will be for people who dont want to pay a lot of money for a sim and the full version will have all of the features.

Fly-n-3D

And it should have multiplayer!

Lightfoot

My Feedback: (1)

I like several first-person adventure games, Heretic II being my favorite. I don't play them as much as I once did but still do occasionally when I get bored.

If I pay over $200 for an R/C flight simulator and get a first-person adventure game, I am going to be returning it to the producer demanding I get my money back. I will not go through different levels of play just to be able to earn the right to fly a particular airplane. Simulator and games serve two totally different purposes. When those purposes converge, I will quit buying simulators and just start buying games and save a bundle of money.

carlosponti

My Feedback: (1)

i would just like to see one come out with a linux binary. i have slowly been make an exodus away form windows and it would be nice not to have to dual boot.

Breakstuff5050

I think the ULTIMATE sim would be possible if the makers of AFP, Reflex, and realflight all came together to make a kick ass sim. Hopefully they all can take tips from eacch other on the physics, cuz they all have problems.

ckangaroo70

My Feedback: (51)

First off, for a Brickmason I type pretty fast. The ideas posted above were just my own. I was looking to see what others ideas of a good sim were, and not really a discussion of what mine are. I wasn't really asking if anyone likes my idea. I was asking what your idea is while sharing my own.

Call it what you may, but my own opinion is that a good sim like in real life should reward those who work harder than those who don't.


Who said a limited selction? Buy and put whatever Planes you want to put in there.

Because Tower is the biggest, and it was just an example. All my suggestions were just examples and opinions of my own, and as said before I was looking for other ideas besides my own. Not a critique of my own ideas, and what I would want in a sim.

I wouldn't!

A good jet pilot would have no trouble getting right through the "beginners" feature of the Sim and moving right to advanced where they would be messing with turbines and not .40 size engines.


This is your idea, and thats fine. This is why I started the post.

As I thought I made clear the sim I was writting about would be designed around my taste. Thats why I wanted to hear what others ideas are.

Then it would be a good idea not to use these features in a sim designed for you.

I myself always appreciate a good crash! Balsa crunching, and parts a flying! If you prefer just a "thud" then thats your taste and not mine.

I believe a sim is meant to teach. Yes Flight physics are important, but IMO it is best used to teach. A video game attitude would be to equip the Plane with machine guns so you could shoot the Flyers in the pits as you fly by! I reference certain computer games based on there graphics engines, and physics engines they use, and nothing related to video game content., but my wife calls the G3 and G2 a video game. I call it a sim, but she like you is welcome to call it what you want.

When I decide to get out of the Masonry Business to write software, I will try to remember not to send you a sales flyer.

ckangaroo70

My Feedback: (51)

Doctor says I may not last the week, and may just keel over anytime, but thanks for asking?

Fly-n-3D

Thats alot of quotes! Okay we need to make up our own ideas of the best sim.

Breakstuff5050

i think it should be nothing but manufacturer stuff in the editor, like every manufactuerer around for engines, servos, receivers right down to what smoke pump. And you cannot modify the stuff. so then if you cant decide on what plane you want you just match all the parts up in the sim with what you have at the house and see what is best! Or you can use it to figure out what performes best on your plane. Right now on g3 im afraid to trust it bc i dont know how accurate the were. But that would be sweet!

ckangaroo70

My Feedback: (51)

Now this is what I was looking for! Great ideas! As far as accuracy goes, I own the Great Planes Extra 300, Great Planes Cap 232, Great Planes Spacewalker, and the Super Sportster, and they fly pretty close on the sim as they do in real life when correct engine, prop, and same surface throws are used. I actually find the flight physics of the G2 and G3 to be pretty good. Its the graphics I find a little outdated for the times, and I personally would like to see a sim that could simulate other aspects that go along with Flying. Great Post Breakstuff5050!

ckangaroo70

My Feedback: (51)

Yes it should, and mine would!

RC330LXFlya

My Feedback: (3)

I think it should have two options when you start up the sim:
1) Sim Mode- just like the regular sims, you fly what you want to fly
2) Arcade Mode- Work up throug levels and stuff

this way you would get the best of both worlds

I like the idea of having manufacturer stuff available so you dont have to mess with making it up and then still not having it as accurate

ckangaroo70

My Feedback: (51)

Another great idea put forward!

Breakstuff5050

And then just for fun you can stick build your own plane and stuff, but make it easy to do, that would be cool for boring days.

4 stroken ron

My Feedback: (29)

I just bought a lottery ticket worth 5 mil. Is that enough to get this project off the ground?
Ron
You can thank me later

Breakstuff5050

Hey! Now we can buy out all the sim companies and combine them!

Greg.B

What you mean put all the Discs in the CD drive at once[sm=confused.gif][X(]!???

Breakstuff5050

noooooooooooooo silly, combine the companies and build a NEW simulator using all the sim companies, then we would have thegraphics of XTR, the editor and multiplayer of G3, and a G3/AFP physics engine. Then we got the best of the best, no arguments!

STLPilot

My Feedback: (21)

This is the worst idea I'm sorry. This is like asking Apple, Linux, Unix, to migrate with Microsoft. Or telling all the biggest cell companies to merge into one service so we don't get dead areas. You can't do that. For one thing it takes away competition. Now you have one simulator that has no challenges to overcome to improve. Since they are the best they don't have to EVER worry about improving because there are no other foundations to base their improvments off of, in this case the competition. Lets not even forget about the price increases, they will go WAY up. That is why they busted up AT&T, long distance prices were as much as .75 a minute for USA long distance back in the late 70's and early 80's. Now they are down to what ... .02-.05 a minute. This is all because of the high competition.

Now as far as I can see it AFPD is the best overall sim when it comes to the best features and overall sim for the consumer that I serve, if there was a better one I would be selling that one (this is just one man's opinion). But even AFPD can be improved just like all software can be improved until it never ends. Each company will be adding more "fluff" (which I think is what Kangaroo was looking for) and also better improved flight physics. When that happens I will shop for the best simulator again and offer that simulator to my customers, but for right now AFPD is it, but that could change.

Rick Delten

Smells like a salesman in here

Breakstuff5050

Its ok to dream, isnt it? Just imagine if they did combine and tried their hardest to improve as much as possible and keep the price as low as possible. That would be awesome!

Or maybe we can just combine Reflex, and realflight, since delux seems to be out of this world and better then any others. Then AFP will be the competition, I know Reflex G4 (or realflight XTR) would rule