RC Fuels Nitromethane, Castor Oil, Synthetic, heli fuel, 4 stroke, etc...Fuel Q&A is here!

NITROMETHANE SUBSTITUTE.

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Old 06-06-2011, 05:26 AM
  #1
nitroairplane
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Default NITROMETHANE SUBSTITUTE.

I would like to make my own glow fuel and i came across this video on youtube http://www.youtube.com/user/TheSierr...24/ZlWG1WHiYCE and was wondering what percentage nitro fuel it was equvelant to so that got me thnking could the right mixture of petrol [gasoline] and ethanol be a decent substitute for nitromethane there are other substances that i think could make the petrol[gasoline] "lighter" and easier to ignite with a glow plug. Any suggestions or advice would be greatly appreciated.
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http://www.youtube.com/user/TheSierr...24/ZlWG1WHiYCE
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Old 06-06-2011, 08:13 AM
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Default RE: NITROMETHANE SUBSTITUTE.

Ethanol does not work well in model airplane engines. Second, it is extremely dangerous to use petrol in engines designed to run methanol/nitromethane/oil-based fuels. Nitromethane is much harder to obtain these days, after the Okalahoma City Federal Building bombing. The solution is to use lower nitromethane fuels, buy your fuel, or use engines set up to run regular FAI fuel (75% methanol and 25% AA castor oil). Please do not experiment with fuels. Ask people who know about fuels and do not use petrol for fuel, unless the engine is a regular gas engine. You might look up my old article on basic homemade model fuel on Google to get an idea, but please, no petrol for your own safety and those around you.
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Old 06-06-2011, 12:05 PM
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Default RE: NITROMETHANE SUBSTITUTE.

They used to use nitrobenzine many years ago before nitromethane became the stuff to use. But nitrobenzine is more dangerous and is toxic and a carcinogen too. 

You do not need any nitromethane in the fuel. We all like to just use methanol and castor oil or if you want a synthetic oil that will mix with methanol (motor oild will not mix with methanol). Klotz Benol is a good oil to use.  anyway most of the model engine work just fine off of no-nitro glow fuel.

You can also use denatured alcohol, where they use methanol to denature the ethanol in the denatured alcohol. Normally there is enough methanol in the stuff to allow the glow plug to work. You lose a slight amount of power with it, but it actually works pretty good.
This is handy if you live in an area where the local hobby shops tend to charge really high prices for the glow fuel.
Here is a video of a guy using 75% Klean Strip S-L-X Denatured Alcohol and 25% castor oil in his Fox .25 engine powered Delta Coroplast plane. It was really windy that day, so he kept the plane upwind.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfQIevaZ1Aw&feature=player_embedded#at=16[/youtube]

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Old 06-06-2011, 03:32 PM
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Default RE: NITROMETHANE SUBSTITUTE.

You are right, we did use nitrobenzene. It is also called Oil of Mirbane, and is the great smell when you open a fresh can of Kiwi shoe polish. We also used propylene oxide, tried ethanol (did not work well), very high nitromethane for speed events and rat racing, when we could mix up our own fuels. Down Under, they use about 3% acetone to aid in ignition of their model engines. I also made fuels earlier with Mobil Jet oil. Does not take a high percentage, but did not work all that well. Most countries use much less nitromethane than we do here in the States. I remember using Klotz Techniplate oil in the King Orange Internationals in Miami, FL when it was first introduced. It is a very good lubricant for model engines and I personally buy 30-gallon barrels of Klotz Techniplate, gallons of Benol racing castor and 5 gallon pails of nitromethane, and 55-gallon drums of M-1 racing methanol (VP Racing). Getting the nitro is a bit easier for me, I have a chemistry degree in my bag of degrees and have been mixing my own model fuels since I was 12 years old. Back then, I flew contest rat racing and combat, both control line. Could not afford radio control, had to get a real job to be able to do that. :-) In the earlier days, i raced with K&B .29 and .35 engines, before the more powerful .40s were introduced. Had Cox .010, 0.020, .049, OK Cub .049, old Forester? .99, Cyclone Super .60, you name it, I had it. Also had the gray metal case ball bearing racing McCoy .29 engine. redhead, NOT the $8 one in the plastic box, but the $15.99 racing .29. Had to cut down 8 x 9 props for that on my rat racer. Also had to bore out the diameter and re-balance the props. Could beat a lot of .35s with that engine. Last remembrance, at the King Orange Internationals, we used to go and get a conical plastic coated cardboard bottle of A & W root beer nearby on 27th Avenue in Miami, about where the Junior College is located now. The root beer was 25 cents for the quart!
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Old 06-07-2011, 06:47 AM
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Default RE: NITROMETHANE SUBSTITUTE.

Oh yeah, I remember as a kid being able to get a coca Cola for 5 cents at the vending machine. Comic books cost 5 cents. Several hamburger joints, before McDonalds existed, sold hamburgers for 5 for a dollar. I used to buy the McCoy .35 engines a lot as a kid, as they were cheaper than the better Fox .35's at the time. The McCoy engines didn't last as long though, but with lots of castor oil they were acceptable. But when you could buy a new engine, and get some comic books and a root beer float at the soda fountain at the pharmacy what the heck, the cheaper engine won out. I remember getting my first Fox .35 engine after Christmas when a rich kid got a plane and all the extras for Xmas. He came out to the lot were were all flying off of and didn't want any help. He promptly crashed his plane and left it in disgust. So I took it home and asked him later if he wanted it back. He said no. So I fixed the plane and flew the plane and Fox .35 for ages. I don't think I ever wore out the engine. It outlasted several airplanes. I had to replace the needle a few times after crashing myself too.


Here is another video of using denatured alcohol and castor oil 75% and 25% to fly a plane using a old Fox .25 glow engine. Plenty of power depending on how big of a plane you use with a engine.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VxxXmVthCsU[/youtube]

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Old 06-07-2011, 08:29 AM
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Default RE: NITROMETHANE SUBSTITUTE.

i only asked because i have been mixing diesel fuel for a while now and was just wondering about nitro.
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Old 07-24-2011, 08:58 AM
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Default RE: NITROMETHANE SUBSTITUTE.

Nitroethane works. Some Fox blends used it. Supposedly cheaper than nitromethane.

In the AMA regulations you notice tetranitromethane is banned (for good reason). But I never heard of anyone actually using it, even back in the old days. Note that the rules don't ban dinitromethane and trinitromethane, however...

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Old 07-24-2011, 09:05 AM
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Default RE: NITROMETHANE SUBSTITUTE.

Nitroethane works. Some Fox blends used it. Supposedly cheaper than nitromethane.

In the AMA regulations you notice tetranitromethane is banned (for good reason). But I never heard of anyone actually using it, even back in the old days. Note that the rules don't ban dinitromethane and trinitromethane, however...

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Old 07-24-2011, 03:29 PM
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Default RE: NITROMETHANE SUBSTITUTE.

Quote:
ORIGINAL: earlwb

Oh yeah, I remember as a kid being able to get a coca Cola for 5 cents at the vending machine. Comic books cost 5 cents. Several hamburger joints, before McDonalds existed, sold hamburgers for 5 for a dollar. I used to buy the McCoy .35 engines a lot as a kid, as they were cheaper than the better Fox .35's at the time. The McCoy engines didn't last as long though, but with lots of castor oil they were acceptable. But when you could buy a new engine, and get some comic books and a root beer float at the soda fountain at the pharmacy what the heck, the cheaper engine won out. I remember getting my first Fox .35 engine after Christmas when a rich kid got a plane and all the extras for Xmas. He came out to the lot were were all flying off of and didn't want any help. He promptly crashed his plane and left it in disgust. So I took it home and asked him later if he wanted it back. He said no. So I fixed the plane and flew the plane and Fox .35 for ages. I don't think I ever wore out the engine. It outlasted several airplanes. I had to replace the needle a few times after crashing myself too.




Dang Earl, that sure brings back some good ole memories. Life has been very good to me and I am very thankful.
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Old 12-01-2011, 03:30 AM
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Default RE: NITROMETHANE SUBSTITUTE.

call the local dragstrip and see if they sell racing fuel. a good one will sell or tell you where to buy nitromethane. its what thy run in funnycars, those v8 that do the 1/4 mile in 6 seconds.

nitromethane is simular to nitrous oxide, except nitrhmethane also has a fuel in it, so it will burn on its own. the stoicometric ratio is 1.7:1. gasoline is 14.7:1 and ethanol is some where about 6:1 (i think)
the other reason it is used (in the small stuff atleast) is the cooling effect the freed nitrogen has on the cylinder. its basically a liquid turbocharger, enables you to burn more fuel than the O2 from the air would otherwise let you.

but last i check a few weeks ago, a race shop in phoenix az was selling nitromethane for 20$ a gallon. if you buy ti online its triple that, cuz of hazmat. (40$)
its not that hard to get. just exspensive.
try the FAI mix. you might like it.
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Old 12-01-2011, 07:04 AM
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Default RE: NITROMETHANE SUBSTITUTE.

Why would you use ethanol when methanol is so much cheaper? Doen't pass the sanity check.
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Old 12-01-2011, 08:46 AM
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Default RE: NITROMETHANE SUBSTITUTE.


Quote:
ORIGINAL: Sport_Pilot

Why would you use ethanol when methanol is so much cheaper? Doen't pass the sanity check.
Around my neck of the woods, ethanol is far cheaper than methanol. Ethanol is about $2.50 a gallon and methanol $6-7 a gallon. SLX Klean strip is $15 a gallon. I havent had time to experiment, but I haven't any intention to use E85 or anything of the nature because of the gasoline in it.

There are very few chemicals that have a load of oxygen molecules in it like nitromethane does.
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