dhal22

as the subject header says i am looking for 0-5% nitro and 20% castor fuel for breaking in my moki/mark .61. the owners manual specifically advises against using synthetic oil. of course i love the smell of castor oild anyway. any suggestions?

thx, david

Iflyglow

My Feedback: (79)

Dhal22,
All you have to look for is FAI fuel. That is composed of straight Castor and Methonal only.

hauckf

0% nitro, 20% castor fuel is "FAI" fuel. I think that Cooper Fuels sells it, and maybe some of the other manufacturers as well. Problem is, some of these other manufacturers, like Morgan for instance, call their 0% nitro fuel FAI even though it does not contain 20% castor, so be carefull what you buy. FAI fuel would be easy to make yourself. Just add 1 quart (32 oz) of AA castor oil, available at most hobby shops, to a gallon of methanol.

downunder

There are a number of fuel manufacturers in America that make true FAI fuel (Sig, Powermaster, Fox etc) or something very similar but as hauckf said, Morgan definitely isn't one of them even though they call it FAI fuel, avoid it like the plague . The problem is that most shops won't have it because of the limited demand. Mixing it yourself is by far the best way to go once you've found a supplier for both the methanol and castor.

Fuelman

My Feedback: (6)

David,
We make 20% castor/ 0% and 5% nitro fuel. We don't sell much of it due to low demand. I will be at the Perry Georgia show the end of Feb in the McGill building. If you want, I can bring a couple cases down especially for you.

sowega flyer

Fuelman-
Will you have fuel by the case for sale at Perry?

Fuelman

My Feedback: (6)

Certainly will, all popular blends will be there

sowega flyer

Great! See you there. Thanks.

noorizan

I blend my own fuel with 0% nitro & 20% castor oil for my 4C ASP 80 engine....its o.k

jetpack

My Feedback: (1)

For break-in, most everyone in USA can buy everything locally...

HEET gas line anti-freeze is pure methanol and can be bought by the 12oz bottle.

Castor can be bought at the hobby shop, look for SIG Castor Oil.

If you are going to just use it for break-in, medicinal castor oil can be used, however some suggest not using it because it is not grade AA and will cause carbon build up over extended use.


(1) 12oz bottle of HEET to 2.4oz of Castor = 80/20 fuel.

Calculator: 12 x 20% = 2.4

badger5964

My Feedback: (6)

jetpack,

As they say "do the math". Adding 2.4 oz to 12 oz methanol is not 20% castor because now you have 14.4 oz total.

Proper math is 20% of total. Since 80% will be the 12 oz methanol then the total will be 12 divided by 0.80 which is 15 oz total. The other 3 oz are castor. Your mix would be 16.7%.

Easiest way to get 20% is one gallon of methanol plus a quart of castor. Simple. Finding the methanol is the hard part.

Scott

[link=http://www.fayettevillercclub.com]www.fayettevillercclub.com[/link]

downunder

20% castor can be mixed in the following ways..
4 teaspoons of methanol and 1 teaspoon of castor..
4 eggcups of methanol and 1 eggcup of castor...
4 pints of methanol and 1 pint of castor...
4 tankers........................................... ....................................

jetpack

My Feedback: (1)

Badger your right![:'(]

That's a big OOP's on my part...hope nobody blew up a new motor![:-]

I should have thought better. I used to even do percentages as part of my job at one time...how it slips away...Thank you for the correction!

Downunder has the right train of thought also - a 4:1 mix. Much simpler for us with simpler minds. [sm=tongue_smile.gif]

Did I get the ingredients right?[sm=what_smile.gif]

YUKONFLYR

Methanol is usually easy to get depending on where you are.

When I lived in California, I used a speed shop in a major town and bought methanol by the gallon and brought my own jug. I ordered the oils from Sig.

Now living in the Yukon everything freezes up here including your car. I buy Methanol at the industrial supply by the gallon.

I would definatly mix my own. I have also been able to keep mixed fuel good for a very long time by not allowing air to touch the fuel for very long. After mixing I pump propane thru the mix and also use the gas to propel the mix when filling the fuel tank as well. The propane displaces the moist air which can put water in your fuel. I use a 3litre pop bottle for the fuel and propane torch with the head cut off and a mini regulator for the pressure. I have had 3 cups of fuel remain good for over 5 years with this method. Plus side is no noisy pumps when filling your plane

XJet

Wow.. this is dangerous on *so* many levels.

Firstly, you should *never* put a poisonous fluid in a soda-pop bottle. If little kids ever came across this (which you can't guarantee they wont) the potential for tragedy is enormous.

Secondly, you should *never* use any kind of pressure to propel a flammable fluid. Any small split in your container or tubing will produce a fine spray of highly volatile mist that is incredibly explosive and can be ignited by the smallest spark (static electricity) or source of heat. Even worse, methanol/glow-fuel burns with a colorless flame so the first indication you would get that you're on fire is when your skin starts to blister.

Thirdly, using a gas such as propane is also a bad idea, since it is also flamable -- meaning any leak in the pressurization system will also create a huge fire risk -- right alongside all that highly volatile fuel in an easily melted plastic container.

Many people significantly over-estimate the effect of a little good old "air" inside their fuel container will produce.

It's really not that bad!

The thing that poses most risk to fuel going "stale" is excessive sunlight. It promotes the breakdown of nitromethane, methanol and sometines the oil being used.

Store your fuel in a cool dark place and you'll be fine.

Turn it into a bomb by pressurizing a plastic container full of it and I can't vouch for your safety at all.

liquid_TR

Damn!! propane???! wow.. at least use an inert gas like carbon dioxide or nitrogen canister. If you want heavier gas than oxygen, Im sure there is one out there that is inert..

Its a very nasty bomb you're making!

RICKSTUBBZ

Just to add a little on where to buy...

Depending on where you live, VP racing fuels is a good source for both caster and methanol. If there is a drag strip or an oval race track near by then VP racing fuels probably will not be far either.

Also, FYI, I have glow fuel that is ten years old, been kept out of the sun light and only sealed in original plastic jug, and it still burns just fine.

YUKONFLYR

Thanx X-Jet for the very informative reply, however I believe that your statements are way off base.

I don't find propelling a flamiable fluid with another flamiable gas a problem. Both are flamiable and proper safety procedures when fueling and defueling need to be followed or an accident will follow. The bottle that I am using now is stripped of any soda labels and with hoses coming out the top does not look like a soda bottle, just clear plastic. We also usually do not have unaccompained children running around everyones expensive airplanes. Most children at fields are accompanied by their parents, at least in my experience.

Do you leave your pump on after fueling your plane? I also do not. If you read my post I use a regulator, it is adjustable and I usually set it to 3 psi and then vent the pressure after, same as using a regular pump. I am well aware that Methanol burns without a visable flame.

Your last statement about a "bomb" is distrubing to me! If I were pressurizing the fuel bottle to 100 psi I would agree with you, at 3 psi and then venting the pressure after, my fuel is as safe as yours. If your fuel jug sprung a leak, fuel would vent and vapor would be flamiable, just like propane. Your comments make me sound like someone who has no regard for myself or others!! I the eight years that I have been doing this I have never had any problems like the ones that you have presented, mainly because I know how to be safe with what I am using. Also in the eight years I have been doing this you are the first ever to have any negative comments to the system. I have only had positive comments and questions to the system by those who have seen it.

For future refrence I have seen small soda bottles used as fuel tanks, and as pressure tanks for retract systems. They tend to be good right up to about 120 psi prior to failure. And before you ask, yes I have taken the bottles up to and to the point of failure prior to using one as a fuel container.

My current fuel bottle is my origional fuel bottle, at eight years old, it should now be a testament to the quality of the container.

Richard

YUKONFLYR

liquid_TR - I have looked for small carbon dioxide and would like to use nitrogen, however small canisters are not available like the propane torch bottles. Also my system has been in use for Eight years without any incidents at all.

No Bomb here, I vent the pressure after, same safety as using the torch, I turn the gas off after using it and the tank is at zero pressure.

I have also flown at several fields and as of yet no safety officer from any club has had any negative comments to the system, only questions as to how it works.
I have however had lots of positive comments to the system.

Richard