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Another new 4x4 clone.. part firehammer part thunderbolt????

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Old 12-13-2008, 05:19 PM
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hellya
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Default Another new 4x4 clone.. part firehammer part thunderbolt????

this one is called the Falcon its a 4x4 ....and it uses firehammer/smartech parts and upgrades comes with a CY 27cc





.........................Alloy hopup parts................................


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Old 12-13-2008, 05:27 PM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone

Kind of looks like a Thunderbolt, but with firehammer parts.
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Old 12-13-2008, 05:31 PM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone


ORIGINAL: bhcvc

Kind of looks like a Thunderbolt, but with firehammer parts.
I think they are all related
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Old 12-13-2008, 05:33 PM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone

delete double
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Old 12-13-2008, 07:07 PM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone.. part firehammer part thunderbolt????

there's one on ebay $679 +shipping...looks like they raided the parts bins from sevaral models to make this one
more pics

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Old 12-13-2008, 07:15 PM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone.. part firehammer part thunderbolt????

looking at it , that's a pretty ingenious way of hooking up the transmission...the cloners are getting original, first the titan and now this...though the parts bins has definitely been mixed up, i see firehammer parts, thunderbolt/titan parts..dunno what the roll bar's off and probably an fs part or 2 in there somewhere.
love the front shock standoffs, look about as tough as snail eyes
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Old 12-13-2008, 07:31 PM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone.. part firehammer part thunderbolt????

ORIGINAL: mooman007uk

there's one on ebay $679 +shipping

If you order from the source....it might cost $300-400 per unit www.riverhobby.com
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Old 12-13-2008, 07:39 PM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone.. part firehammer part thunderbolt????

i like this, wouldnt mind one if they ever get to the uk
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Old 12-13-2008, 07:44 PM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone.. part firehammer part thunderbolt????

ORIGINAL: carty

i like this, wouldnt mind one if they ever get to the uk
Email these guys in the UK.... they already carry the buggy http://madabout-rc.co.uk
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Old 12-13-2008, 09:55 PM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone.. part firehammer part thunderbolt????

I definitely see firehammer parts and the engine faces the same way as the FH. I like it, along the other ones on that riverhobby site. They all look like they're Smartech-based, Too bad there's no prices on that site. Is there a US dealer for these?
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Old 12-13-2008, 10:41 PM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone.. part firehammer part thunderbolt????

I've given up on even trying to figure out who makes all this stuff now days. As far as I'm concerned a cheap clone is a cheap clone.
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Old 12-13-2008, 10:47 PM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone.. part firehammer part thunderbolt????

ORIGINAL: sheograth

I've given up on even trying to figure out who makes all this stuff now days. As far as I'm concerned a cheap clone is a cheap clone.
Funny thing is all the 1/5 cost about the same to manufacture...........HPI baja cost the same as a clone baja to manufacture.....FG cost as much as a firehammer to manufacturer.

when your making 1000s of vehicles bulk producing.... you would be surprized at what company really shells out and the huge profit margins on some vehicles

sometimes your paying the extra $$ for the name and reputation.

I'm not saying all clone are great because we have some chitty clones too
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Old 12-13-2008, 11:18 PM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone.. part firehammer part thunderbolt????

You're forgetting that the initial design costs are high - and that's why we pay more for certain brands. Yeah once it's been designed manufacturing is cheap - it's that way in most industries.

It will be a sad day when the entire 1/5 scale hobby is just a bunch of knockoffs and no one buys from the companies that actually do the R&D.
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Old 12-14-2008, 12:41 AM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone.. part firehammer part thunderbolt????

ORIGINAL: sheograth

It will be a sad day when the entire 1/5 scale hobby is just a bunch of knockoffs and no one buys from the companies that actually do the R&D.
I think we are already there..........this year the 1/5 hobby has exploded....every vehicle has a clone FG MCD HPI.... just wait theres more to come



people can either embrace them or fight them .......but there here and not going away
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Old 12-14-2008, 02:06 AM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone.. part firehammer part thunderbolt????


ORIGINAL: hellya

Funny thing is all the 1/5 cost about the same to manufacture...........HPI baja cost the same as a clone baja to manufacture.....FG cost as much as a firehammer to manufacturer.
You forgot one thing: The cloners get money from their countries to do business where FG or MCD for example do not get any money to make their RCs. So, the cloners can make their RCs for considerably cheaper.
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Old 12-14-2008, 03:17 AM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone.. part firehammer part thunderbolt????

also, cloners will sometimes cut corners on cost. they will use cheaper materials than the original. their machines are also cheaper and aren't as precise. (by machines i mean the equipment use to make parts for the clones.
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Old 12-14-2008, 03:19 AM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone.. part firehammer part thunderbolt????

Are you saying that their manufacturing is subsidized? I know some industries in China are but I know it's not all of them. You may be right though, I just don't know.

In any case, I don't want to turn this thread into a clone war - its not fair to the original poster. Just thought I'd voice my thoughts

[&:]
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Old 12-14-2008, 11:19 AM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone.. part firehammer part thunderbolt????


ORIGINAL: sheograth

Are you saying that their manufacturing is subsidized? I know some industries in China are but I know it's not all of them. You may be right though, I just don't know.
Yes...well, at least in a under-the-table kind of way. Yes, certain industries deemed vital for development are subsidized, such as heavy industry, energy production, infrastructure building and maintenance and other essentials, and RCs, being a luxury, not a necessity, may not be on that list, but this is how it is done:
Lets say you have a company that makes airplane, Sheng Yang (I am completely making this name up for this example, this is not a real company). They get subsidies to do business. Now how the RC company can get subsidies is this: Sheng Yang has a sub-company, a subsidiary, called Joe Blow Racing. The mother company would funnel some of the subsidized money to its subsidiary, so thus, Joe Blow Racing is being subsidized subsidized (a two step process). Many companies are not really companies in thier own independent existence, many are sub-companies of a much larger network of companies. Kind of Like how General Motors is the mother car company and its sub companies are Chevrolet, Buick, Oldsmobile (now defunct), Cadillac, Saturn, etc.


Now, as for this specifc cross-RC, It definitely smells of Smartech/Nutech. And yes, I agree, they are becoming very creative by hybriding two existing RCs they have cloned.
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Old 12-14-2008, 12:01 PM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone.. part firehammer part thunderbolt????


ORIGINAL: hellya

ORIGINAL: sheograth

I've given up on even trying to figure out who makes all this stuff now days. As far as I'm concerned a cheap clone is a cheap clone.
Funny thing is all the 1/5 cost about the same to manufacture...........HPI baja cost the same as a clone baja to manufacture.....FG cost as much as a firehammer to manufacturer.

when your making 1000s of vehicles bulk producing.... you would be surprized at what company really shells out and the huge profit margins on some vehicles

sometimes your paying the extra $$ for the name and reputation.

I'm not saying all clone are great because we have some chitty clones too
I know FG make all their parts, and I mean all (ok not the bearings or engines), including alloy and plastic, in house in their german factory, paying higher wages, higher taxes etc etc.

I guess they learned from mercedes a few years ago when the automaker contracted out a lot of their parts production and assembly to cheaper shores (they thought they'd could make a couple billion more) and it bit them in the ass hard...build quality and reliability was crap, they lost business and more important their reputation went to the dogs...maybe not in the states cos they were still better than a caddy and it's all about the badge image there...but in europe they lost big to BMW and jag, only recovered in the last 2-3yrs.

So i would assume that fg's would be a bit more expensive to produce cos they don't farm out, however I'm sure there is still a large mark up.

hellya's right, the 1/5 scale market has exploded in the last 2 yrs in N.America and will continue to do so, how many different clone cars and trucks and parts bin mix ups came out this year from china? more than in the last decade probably.
I think the likes of fg have such a huge core business in europe that they don't care too much and maybe hpi think they have it all sown up over here, however with the overwhelming numbers of cheap imports they may get caught flat footed which would be a real loss to us all[&o]
i think most at risk of disapearing at the moment is MCD, 4x4's is the biggest growth area right now, fs sales must have hurt them pretty bad and now the redcat rampage (bought one...guilty as charged[&:]) is set to become no1 best seller.
And unlike the big 3 there'll be no government bailout for mismanagement and failing to plan ahead
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Old 12-14-2008, 01:22 PM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone.. part firehammer part thunderbolt????


ORIGINAL: mooman007uk

...and now the redcat rampage (bought one...guilty as charged[&:])...
At least you bought one and have one, so no one will have the right to negate you if you say anything bad about it.

Likewise on the other side, since you also have name brand non-clone RCs, no one has the right to call you a clone fan boy either.
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Old 12-14-2008, 02:17 PM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone.. part firehammer part thunderbolt????

the redcats not really a clone
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Old 12-14-2008, 03:59 PM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone.. part firehammer part thunderbolt????

ORIGINAL: kidd

the redcats not really a clone
I own one of those too......If MCD parts work on the Rampage its a clone.......I have bought all the brandnames and the clones 1/5 vehicles over the last 5 years ...except for MCD

MCD has been way overprice since they came out..... they have been making money hand over fist ......we get charged $1500 for a plastic rolling chassis....thats just rediculious

ORIGINAL: SAVAGEJIM


ORIGINAL: mooman007uk

...and now the redcat rampage (bought one...guilty as charged[&:])...
At least you bought one and have one, so no one will have the right to negate you if you say anything bad about it.

Likewise on the other side, since you also have name brand non-clone RCs, no one has the right to call you a clone fan boy either.

In other threads you have jumped on me for defending the clones......I have owned almost every 1/5 vehicle Brandname and clone.... unitl now cause the clones are just busting loose with alot of vehicles
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Old 12-14-2008, 04:21 PM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone.. part firehammer part thunderbolt????

I concur, the rampage appears to be a hybrid clone, cross between the MCD and smartech titan. Appears that they have done a good job though considering all the positive reviews and experiences had by owners, mine will be here next weekend so i'll reserve my personal judgement until then.

I agree with MCD being overpriced for stock plastic stuff, and in monster form there are lots of owners diaspointed with it's durability, guy i run with had one, broke constantly which was enough to put me off, I know evo3 is supposed to deal with these issues but i still wouldn't buy one...by the time you spent out to get it running you could buy an all alloy fg 4x4 competition. It's my personal belief...which may be worthless...that MCD are going to struggle to stay in business unless they lower their pricing. when they were the only 4x4 on the market one had to pay to play, now it's a different story.
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Old 12-14-2008, 04:28 PM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone.. part firehammer part thunderbolt????


ORIGINAL: hellya

In other threads you have jumped on me for defending the clones......I have owned almost every 1/5 vehicle Brandname and clone.... unitl now cause the clones are just busting loose with alot of vehicles
Then, I charge you to defend your non-clone RCs just as hard as you defend your clones.

As I said in that thread, you made your point and where your stance lies, ad also not to force your stance on clone defending on everyone else. Some people will like the clones, others will not.

When I said to mooman007uk: "...so no one will have the right to negate you if you say anything bad about it."
I meant that he has the right to express what faults he has found in his RC. On the other hand, that also gives him the right to praise its strong points as well.

BUT I never intended to imply that ANYONE has the right to force their opinion on anyone else. Also, what I meant by "negate" is no one will have the right to say "you should try a clone before you pass judgement," because he does own one, runs it, and is not making assumptions whatever he says, good or bad.

Also, I too am going to join the ranks of a clone owner. It is just a matter of time before it comes in, and I will give it a run through its paces and give it just as fair and objective run as I do any of my other RCs.
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Old 12-14-2008, 04:39 PM
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Default RE: Another new 4x4 clone.. part firehammer part thunderbolt????

Look at all my threads dude.......I been here for years before Hpi was even in the 1/5 arena....I have helped many a person with their FG and firhammers when compatiblity was an issue...and what needed to be purhased to make the vehicles more bullet proff

I have heard the clone arguement since I signed up on RCU.......First it was there is no way a Firehammer is as good as a FG marder.....but it was and is just as good.....Peoples minds set dont change

You can see some of the vehicles I have owned here..... www.fg-hopups.com although I dont sell parts anymore
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