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sandrail build up (hopefully!)

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Old 01-09-2009, 09:57 PM
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speedy.d
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Default sandrail build up (hopefully!)

i recently found a new addiction, one that in my opinion far exceeds crack and morning coffee.these guys building these awsome home made machines. in following these builds i have developed an itch to try a build myself. ive always liked sandrails. i have a freind in the saturday night stock car business, and has a pretty decent shop with all the tools of the trade. and after a post by drewcrew6 i have decided to try and attempt a build myself.
i have decided to go with a tubular steel sandrail chassis. it seems to me to be the best way for me to keep it simple. at this point i am open to all suggestions. this being my first go at a project of this level, i think 1/5 scale is my best bet. i want to build as much as posably can myself,but keeping it 1/5 scale gives me fallback sorce for parts in the 5b (drivetrain is my biggest cocern in this area).
as for suspension im thinking a trailing arm set up in the rear. for the front maybe a tubular a-arm set up. keeping it 1/5 or close to that also opens up a lot of options in the steering department as well.
here is a pic of what i would like my chassis to resemble.
as i stated before i am open to suggestions from all, and right now suggestions on what size tubing to use on such project would be great.
thanks, speedyd
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Old 01-09-2009, 10:49 PM
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Default RE: sandrail build up (hopefully!)

I spend so much on my RC habit I cannot afford drugs! LOL I all most cannot afford to eat. double LOL
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Old 01-09-2009, 11:11 PM
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da mad maori
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Default RE: sandrail build up (hopefully!)

right on man!!!
itll be hard to use tube steel and keep it 1/5 scale... your tube would have to be around 8-10mm dia......
finding that in tube will be hard and somewhat weak.. you might have to use solid 1/4" rod (easier and stronger)

if ya dreading the drive train then yer man by all means rob some baja5b stuff LOL

remember to post everything!!! pics, parts, drawings LOL
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Old 01-09-2009, 11:31 PM
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Default RE: sandrail build up (hopefully!)

http://shopping.netsuite.com/s.nl/c....t.A/id.5155/.f
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Old 01-10-2009, 12:42 AM
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Default RE: sandrail build up (hopefully!)

8 or 10mm tube will be ok as long as ya got a triangle to make it strong

for a drive you could make a locked diff and use a belt drive like the 1/4 scale sprints do

well you will prob have to use 2 belts to keep the in the middle of the car

i take it you looking at using a cy or zen engine ????

yes front hubs you can use maybe fg ones with ball joints top and bottom

sounds like a good project looking forward to seeing progress
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Old 01-10-2009, 01:35 AM
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Default RE: sandrail build up (hopefully!)

4130 Chrome Moly tube is super strong, extremely light and is available as small as.25"OD X .038"W here at [link=http://www.onlinemetals.com/]OnlineMetals.com[/link].
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Old 01-10-2009, 01:44 AM
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An example of how strong .25 X .038 4130 CMT is. Thats supporting about 200 lbs, but that 8 PT cage w/ hardware weighs less than 14 ounces... Using bare hands, its practically impossible for the ave grown man to bend a 6-8" tube of the stuff.
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Old 01-10-2009, 01:57 AM
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Default RE: sandrail build up (hopefully!)

thanks guys,
i was thinking that 1/4" would be pretty close to scale. and solid rod makes a lot of sence. thre will be plenty of triangles in the frame,. one of the mane reasons i want to stay close to 1/5 scale is so if i cant come up with my own drivetrain then the 5b will be my back up plan. zen or cy will be my motor basically due to the ease of mountig and the easy access to parts.
i want to mount the engine in a mid/rear fashion so i can keep the nose up while jumping.i also want to keep the front bulkhead area as narrow as ican so ican us longer a arms. it woould be really cool if i could come up with a scale vw style torsion bar front end. but that would have the same limitations that it does in real life limited suspension travel.
i dont know if it helps but in my mind its already done. and in reality ....well lets just say ive got a long job ahead of me!
btw a sandrail wouldnt be right without cutting brakes any ideas on that one?
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Old 01-10-2009, 03:05 AM
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Default RE: sandrail build up (hopefully!)

motionmachine,
that link is just what i needed. thats a nice cage also! they also sell t6 7075 sheets......hmm my fs could use a stronger chassis.

bentley,
do you have any pics of a belt type drive like you described so i can wrap my head around it?

well now the gears are turning and at this hour that can be a scary thing! i havent even started and you guys have already helped out more than you could know, hopefully i can be of some use to you all as well. thanks guys!
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Old 01-10-2009, 03:16 AM
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da mad maori
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Default RE: sandrail build up (hopefully!)

the hardest thing will be keeping your enthusiasm from start to finish LOL
i find it better to get all of the tricky parts out of the way first while your on fire then the easy stuff later
thats a strong cage there motionman, cheers for the heads up

it maybe a long road but its a buzz !!!!!!

you can always start with the rear end from a baja5b..(engine brakes gearbox and diff)
and build around that??
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Old 01-10-2009, 03:29 AM
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speedy.d
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Default RE: sandrail build up (hopefully!)

da mad maori,
the 5b rear assy. does sound like a good plan especialy considering that this will be my first project of this size.

what do you guys think about the trailing arm rear suspension?

this is just a thought, but i think it would be really cool to come up with a way to use one of the 4cyl oposed 4 stroke air plane engines, but price and practicality rule that one out.
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Old 01-10-2009, 11:18 AM
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Default RE: sandrail build up (hopefully!)

Hey Speedy.d Glad I could encourage you to try this Just keep in mind that in your "golden years " even if this was not a success it could be! LOL
Kidding aside at some point you will probably get discouraged because something didn't work out. The key is to take a step back from the project and start looking at unrelated stuff, you would never guess some ideas or solutions have came from looking at powered handicapped wheelchairs and handicapped controls for cars or pocketbikes/pocketfourwheelers. Heck for this stuff I broke out legos from when I was a kid just to try a rear axle idea to see how it moves and play with steering ideas. I like watching mythbusters just to the test rigs they build (the explosions are always fun to).

Good luck and I will be watching your build for sure! then again I watch all the hombuilds.

Drewcrew6
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Old 01-10-2009, 11:53 AM
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speedy.d
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Default RE: sandrail build up (hopefully!)

some time this week im going to try to come up with some basic drawings,and see where that takes me. that link that motionmachine posted is a huge help.you just gotta love one stop shopping!
im thinking 33" to 36" would be the length to go with.
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Old 01-10-2009, 11:58 AM
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Default RE: sandrail build up (hopefully!)

LOL, Drew and I have more in common than i thought! Speedy, he makes a good point, Legos are lifesavers. I have done the same on many occasions, break out the collection, test a design and go from there. They are all correct in teh discouragement department as well. Heck look at me, 4 years on one design alone, guess I'm the posterchild for discouragement. But, if you want something don't let it get away from you, besides look at how much help your getting already. Thats why i keep coming back, these guys are great.
As for your actual design, I'd say go for the trailing arm. Adjusting the Baja rear end for that will be nothing, and it will certainly be a little bit easier to build. Keep it man....looking forward to some more progress!
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Old 01-10-2009, 04:17 PM
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Default RE: sandrail build up (hopefully!)

Maybe this link will inspire you and others to build your dream machines. [link=http://usera.imagecave.com/motionmachine/H20/]A Rednecks Wet Dream[/link].
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Old 01-10-2009, 05:23 PM
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Default RE: sandrail build up (hopefully!)

you got me, when i clicked on the first pic for few i thought i was looking at 1/1 vehicle. yes, those did help i like the use of the fg parts very nice! thanks for the pics!
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Old 01-10-2009, 05:34 PM
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Default RE: sandrail build up (hopefully!)


ORIGINAL: speedy.d

you got me, when i clicked on the first pic for few i thought i was looking at 1/1 vehicle. yes, those did help i like the use of the fg parts very nice! thanks for the pics!
Actually, I used 1/10th scale T-Maxx driveline and suspension parts but I left enough redundancy in the design to change to just about any driveline and/or suspension.
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Old 01-10-2009, 06:25 PM
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speedy.d
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Default RE: sandrail build up (hopefully!)

[
ORIGINAL: motionmachine


ORIGINAL: speedy.d

you got me, when i clicked on the first pic for few i thought i was looking at 1/1 vehicle. yes, those did help i like the use of the fg parts very nice! thanks for the pics!
Actually, I used 1/10th scale T-Maxx driveline and suspension parts but I left enough redundancy in the design to change to just about any driveline and/or suspension.

o.k. so you got me again! the wife gave it a big thumbs uptoo, and she'spretty hard to impress! lol
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Old 01-12-2009, 04:27 PM
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Default RE: sandrail build up (hopefully!)

after drawing some scratches down and gazing for hours at my FS. i have decided that for covinience i am going to use an fs/mcd rear diff and enclosure along with their tranny/brake system. i have decided on my chassis being made from 70775 and it will bolt into the sandrail frame much like you would a floor pan on a real one. when i can get some drawings made up that someone other than myself can tell what it is i will post them.
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Old 01-12-2009, 07:14 PM
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Default RE: sandrail build up (hopefully!)

Here is a site that may have some stuff to help you out. I have bean planning to build one myself but I don’t have time money or a work shop [:@] planning was to use aluminum brake line for frame don’t know how it would work but you could look into it.
http://www.sdp-si.com/
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Old 01-12-2009, 08:11 PM
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speedy.d
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Default RE: sandrail build up (hopefully!)

thanks pinky! so far all of the links have proved promising. i am also thinking that 36" is going to be the length i build it to.
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Old 01-12-2009, 08:42 PM
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da mad maori
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Default RE: sandrail build up (hopefully!)

36" (910mm)....... thats a decent size
i would have thought a hpi bajass transmission/diff would have been stronger??
i have a 5b and the diff is bulletproof (haven said that, im rebuilding my diff today

mind you i havent broken my mcd diff either so im guessing they're ok.....
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Old 01-12-2009, 10:32 PM
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speedy.d
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Default RE: sandrail build up (hopefully!)

with that set up i think it will give me more versitility in as to the distance between my motor and the rear diff. i run my fs pretty hard with a 28.5 on it and it has held up great. i dont want the motor mounted as far foward in the chassis as the mcd, but yet a little farther foward than the 5b. im also checking out some home cad software for windows xp, if anyone has a recomendation for a program they use that would help out .
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Old 01-12-2009, 11:13 PM
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Default RE: sandrail build up (hopefully!)

I'd love to see some scale sand cars in this hobby, the closest thing I've seen so far is the RC4WD cage for the Baja - which does look pretty darn good.
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Old 01-13-2009, 02:54 AM
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Default RE: sandrail build up (hopefully!)

Well I draw blueprints for a livening on Autodesk CAD so I use that but there are plenty out there
Autodesk has a free 30 day trial and I have herd good things about Google sketch but never used it.
http://sketchup.google.com/
http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet...&siteID=123112
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