OkadaKeisuke

My Feedback: (1)

Hello,

I just picked up a C.G. Gentle Lady ARF today. I have been wanting to get more involved with gliders and sailplanes lately, and have read good things about this bird. One thing I was curious about was, is there a way to NOT permanently join the wings? I am lacking storage space and have never, until now, considered not permanently joining the wings. Just curious to see folks opinions.

~Noah

BarracudaHockey

My Feedback: (11)

You could probably engineer something, though it will just add weight.

da Rock

It depends on how the ARF design joins the wing halves. Some that look to be joined aren't permanently connected at all. I'll go look to see if the assembly instructions of your bird shed some light on this.

OkadaKeisuke

My Feedback: (1)

The directions indicate to join the wing halves together using the supplied wing joiner and 30 min. Epoxy. They also state to apply epoxy to the root wing ribs. It appears to be a pretty permanent joining.

~Noah

da Rock

OK, the instruction booklet shows a couple of things.

They join the wing with wooden joiners. The primary one is tapered and unless the cavity it sticks into fits like a glove, that's not a good material or design for holding glider wing halves together, especially without further support. About additional support..........

The ARF uses one bundle of rubber bands to hold the fuselage to the wing. It is positioned in the exact center of the wing. It would not provide any aide holding the two halves together, in fact, the rubber bands would work hard trying to get between the two halves.

That particular ARF presents a couple of problems for your idea.

If I were going to retrofit that sucker, I'd build a fitted wing joiner with aircraft ply and CF that fit the wing boxes exactly. The boxes would get swabbed with 30min epoxy before the fittings. The idea is to strengthen the inside of each box with an epoxy that is absorbed readily. Each wing half would then get an L shaped keeper attached to their top center. They would project slightly beyond the center gap. By sticking slightly over the other wing root, the rubber band bundle would actually work to keep both wings from moving away from center. Two overlaps on one side and two on the other would provide more than enough security.

It sounds more complex than it is.

The present design works perfectly well with a single bundle of rubber bands in the center. With a close fitting joiner that is reliably strong (building it yourself provides the reliability) and the L attachments, the new design ought to work just as good. It has in the past on at least one glider of mine.

OkadaKeisuke

My Feedback: (1)

Thanks Da Rock. This ARF came with a wooden wing joiner sandwiched between two aluminum joiners of the same likeness. I'd feel a bit out of my comfort zone doing as you suggested. I think I will follow the recommended setup as per manual. I'd rather make sure that this plane goes together right and will fly safely than to go out of my comfort zone and assemble it in such a manner that makes it more convenient for storage. In other words, I don't trust my building skills enough yet. Your retrofit idea is great though, and I may find myself using it in the future. Thanks again for your help!

~Noah

da Rock

Keep in mind that the wing rubberbands on. So if you were to build a new wing, it'd fit as well as the old one.

Find some plans for the wing for that sucker and all you'd need then is some time and some balsa wood etc. You would be amazed how easy a wing like that is to build. No ailerons, nothing much really. I used to build a wing a week just to try out airfoils. It's also a way to try longer span, different dihedral, etc.

It's funner than anything to do... just about.

OkadaKeisuke

My Feedback: (1)

Very cool! A wing a week! I'd definitely love to build from scratch... But I'd need to find more space first.

Art ARRO

My Feedback: (5)

Note that the original Gentle Lady was designed with optional removable outer wing panels. These were retained bymusic wirerods inserted into brass tubes at the junction. The joint was retained by simple masking tape applied spanwise. Full size plans and the construction article are available from RCMPlans.com. The plan # is 791.
PS:I'm unsure of the website address but someone can provide it if you wish to persue this further.

Art ARRO

jetmaven

Hey Art , good to see you here ! One prime question , how are you planning to launch this

BarracudaHockey

My Feedback: (11)

LOL Yea, I forgot about that.

I can remember driving around in my little Plymouth Turismo with the 2m wing from my Craft Air Drifter 2 sticking between the seats.

Art ARRO

My Feedback: (5)

Jet Maven,
I use a typical soaring hi-start to launch my "pure" sailplanes but this is a hassle at my local field, due to prevailing winds, other power fliers, etc. Also, the hi-start rubber is old and getting rather weak so I plan to replace it sometime this spring/summer.
I've also designed a power pod for electric motors that is held on to the wing center section by #64 rubber bands. The motor is an old, brushedLeisure 05 with a hot wind which gently pulls the GL to a comfortable soaring altitude. I'll probably replace this also with a brushless Speed 500 or equiv. this spring/summer also.Currently running a 3S A123 battery or a 6S NiCd ECU battery for power. The neat thing about the power pod is thatthe motordoesn't fill up will snow during winter flying. I've gotten some nice, long thermal flights on calm, sunny days here in CNY.
I fly sailplanes, both e-powered and hi-started, during the winter season when I'm not flying turbine jets. E-power is preferred when the air temps are below 50F. I enjoy both phases of the hobby.

Art ARRO

jetmaven

Art , for what it's worth , in a world where you have would to make the wings into something that breaks down into sections , I'd personally make permanent the center section and do a simple , lightweight, box type ,plug in joiner at the polyhedral joint on the main spar with a simple anti rotation pin just behind the leading edge.
And I'm relieved to hear your power pod doesn't fill up with snow .

Art ARRO

My Feedback: (5)

Jet Maven,
This is how Carl Goldberg designed the Gentle Lady about 23 years ago when it appeared in RCMmagazine. I chose to build mine with a 1-piece wing but others prefer to detach the outer tip sections, at the polyhedral joint . The original RCM plans show both options.
I've designed an update, named "Wicked Lady",using a more modern airfoil (SD7037) and a V-tail. The wing will also have flaperons and reduced dihedral but still in 1-piece. It will be interesting to see how this version flies compared to the original.

Art ARRO

jetmaven

Post a picture if you can , sounds like fun

ARUP

X2

OkadaKeisuke

My Feedback: (1)

I too will be using a high-start. I did notice as I was finishing up this ARF, that it requires about 4 oz lead in the nose to balance. Is this peculiar to you guys?

~Noah

Art ARRO

My Feedback: (5)

GLFlyers,
The Gentle Lady does require a fair bit of nose weight ballast even when built from plans or one of the original kits. I hollowed the nose block to add lead shot and use a large battery pack- 4S Eneloop 2000 mAh made into a square configuration. Whatever you do, don't try to fly this Lady tailheavy or with the high start hook any further back than the plans show= about 90 mm back from the leading edge if I recall. Currently waiting for fair weather to fly mine- it's currently -3F in CNY.

Art ARRO

BarracudaHockey

My Feedback: (11)

Any long tail, short nose glider is that way.

OkadaKeisuke

My Feedback: (1)

Ah, ok then. I may consider converting to a pull-pull setup in the future. That will reduce overall weight and potentially eliminate some of the tail heaviness. However, I'd like to fly her stock first.
Also, it's real cold here in Maine too. I would be using black surgical tubing (5/16 O.D., 3/16 I.D.) on the high start. How is this tubing affected by the cold? I have only used it in the summer months. Also, I have a fair amount of space for launch, but was wondering what you guys would recommend for a tubing/string ratio. Would 50 ft/ 200 ft work? Until now, I have only flown sail planes less than 2M.

~Noah

da Rock

Depends on how cold and where you store it between uses.

When you stretch it out, the rubber compresses and if it's cold enough, humidity in the rubber can freeze. Trust me, it's a real problem to deal with. Your highstart has suddenly become worthless and un-coilable.

I once tried leaving it out before flying. I should have tried to unroll it before driving to the field.....

Sometimes it doesn't need compression to freeze. [:@]

OkadaKeisuke

My Feedback: (1)

It's in the 20's here today. I would keep it stored indoors. Would below freezing temps cause it to lose its elastic properties? I may just take a piece of tubing and leave it out doors to see what happens.

OzMo

My Feedback: (3)

I called my very modded GL a"Wicked Women" Heres the in the bones pic,
Mods:
AG airfoils
Full D tube ,I beam wing construction.
Pull Pull rudder
Extended the nose

Art ARRO

My Feedback: (5)

Noah,
I have NOT had good results with hi-starts in cold weather- ie, below freezing. They lose elasticity, become flaccid (deficient in turgor), and sometimes impossible to coil up. I discovered this while flying in Michigan winters before moving to CNY. I was content to hand launch my GL off a small hill to practise gliding, all done in sunny, calm weather. Finally ended up designing and building a detachable power pod with an 05 brushed motor and 6S 800 mAh MiCds. This would get theGL up to hi-start altitude for some soaring.
Also, if you plan to fly in the cold, you should give your R/C equipment (transmitter andmodel) a "cold soak" test for any problems. A range and control test are in order. Just place it outdoors for an hour or so before flying. I've noted that some servos slow down andnylon clevises become brittle and fail.
Think SPRING!

Art ARRO

OkadaKeisuke

My Feedback: (1)

Thanks ART.

Spring it will be then... As much as I can't wait to try out this glider! Patience is always the hardest part about flying. I know the Rx/Tx works in the cold well, I use them to fly some of my other electric powered models. I have seen some threads on RCU of people adding a motor to the nose of the Gentle Lady. It appears they remove the nose block and affix a motor mount in its place. I'm thinking I could do that at some point in the future. The motor should replace some or all the nose weight I added to the stock setup.

Well, thanks again for your advice. Sometimes I need someone to be my "voice of reason"!