Are there thermals in the winter?
12-05-2002, 10:19 PM
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Are there thermals in the winter?
I need a little help here guys,
My inlaws live in New Harmany Utah and it is about 5000 feet above sea level. I’m going to visit them and I want something to do while I’m up there and was wondering
if there are thermals in the wintertime. I’m going to visit them at the end of December and want to purchase a glider to fly at their house. They live in the country so I have plenty of space to fly there. The other question is, which glider to buy? Electric or a high start. I have not had a glider in a few years but I fly giant scale planes and consider myself an experienced pilot. I want a glider that is very manaverable but will thermal with ease. I plan on spending no more than 200 bucks for an arf and I have radio equipment. Any help would be appreciated.
My inlaws live in New Harmany Utah and it is about 5000 feet above sea level. I’m going to visit them and I want something to do while I’m up there and was wondering
if there are thermals in the wintertime. I’m going to visit them at the end of December and want to purchase a glider to fly at their house. They live in the country so I have plenty of space to fly there. The other question is, which glider to buy? Electric or a high start. I have not had a glider in a few years but I fly giant scale planes and consider myself an experienced pilot. I want a glider that is very manaverable but will thermal with ease. I plan on spending no more than 200 bucks for an arf and I have radio equipment. Any help would be appreciated.
12-05-2002, 10:33 PM
#2
Are there thermals in the winter?
There are thermals in the winter, although probably not as much as in the summer.
But thermals depend on temperature differential, not on absolute temperature, so on a calm, sunny day in winter, eventually thermals will develop.
As to your second question : I'd go with an electric, since it is much less hassle than a hi-start or a winch. I equipped one of my sailplanes with an electric drive beginning last summer, and haven't winchlaunched ever since. It's just more convenient, you are ready to fly at a moment's notice ( of course, you have to maintain your battery packs charged) , and with a charger which can be hooked up to your car battery, your number of flights is basically limited only by how long you want to be out at the field.
For ARF's with powerplant included, look at the GP Spirit Electra or the Aspire EP from Horizon Hobby.
Use the search engine here on RCU or here : E-Zone - electric sailplanes , there have been numerous posts about these 2 sailplanes in the past.
Hope this helps,
Michael
But thermals depend on temperature differential, not on absolute temperature, so on a calm, sunny day in winter, eventually thermals will develop.
As to your second question : I'd go with an electric, since it is much less hassle than a hi-start or a winch. I equipped one of my sailplanes with an electric drive beginning last summer, and haven't winchlaunched ever since. It's just more convenient, you are ready to fly at a moment's notice ( of course, you have to maintain your battery packs charged) , and with a charger which can be hooked up to your car battery, your number of flights is basically limited only by how long you want to be out at the field.
For ARF's with powerplant included, look at the GP Spirit Electra or the Aspire EP from Horizon Hobby.
Use the search engine here on RCU or here : E-Zone - electric sailplanes , there have been numerous posts about these 2 sailplanes in the past.
Hope this helps,
Michael
12-06-2002, 12:35 AM
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Are there thermals in the winter?
Does depend on temperature to some degree. In the colder areas of the country we get an inversion in the winter where it is warmer up top compared to ground level, so no thermals. Being at 5000 feet I assume it would be fairly cool there. There may not be much to work with.
12-06-2002, 02:21 AM
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Are there thermals in the winter?
Thermals in winter? You bet!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It's the temperature differential that causes the air to rise.
In the summer, the differential is less, as most of the air in a given area is closer to the same temp. Thermals that we can fly in can be hard to find.
On a sunny cold day, any warmer air mass that does rise(say over a parking lot or a black roof) does so with great gusto!!
This is due to a greater differential in the temp.
Think about it for a while and it should make sense, I know my explanation isnt the best.
Some of the fastest climb outs have happened in a light snow storm with clear patches of sky.
Snow comming down and my gentle lady climbing up though it like a home sick angel.
I live in a very large basin south of salt lake city, around 46oo feet, The soaring here is fantastic!!
Micha
It's the temperature differential that causes the air to rise.
In the summer, the differential is less, as most of the air in a given area is closer to the same temp. Thermals that we can fly in can be hard to find.
On a sunny cold day, any warmer air mass that does rise(say over a parking lot or a black roof) does so with great gusto!!
This is due to a greater differential in the temp.
Think about it for a while and it should make sense, I know my explanation isnt the best.
Some of the fastest climb outs have happened in a light snow storm with clear patches of sky.
Snow comming down and my gentle lady climbing up though it like a home sick angel.
I live in a very large basin south of salt lake city, around 46oo feet, The soaring here is fantastic!!
Micha
12-06-2002, 07:42 AM
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Are there thermals in the winter?
Hi,
thermals are independent from summer or winter. If there is a difference between the temperature on the earth and the temperature in the atmosphere thermals will be there. The best conditions should be there in spring or autumn because of their instable weather.
CU,
Armin
thermals are independent from summer or winter. If there is a difference between the temperature on the earth and the temperature in the atmosphere thermals will be there. The best conditions should be there in spring or autumn because of their instable weather.
CU,
Armin
12-06-2002, 08:16 AM
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Are there thermals in the winter?
Forget the high start. The rubber looses most of it's OOMPH (and yes, that's a technical term..... ) when the temp drops to 40F or so. I can't even imagine what it would be like at sub freezing temps. You'd probably stretch it out the 100 feet and get back about 10 feet before it just layed there like a gut shot garter snake and sort of oozed back to it's original length......
Winches are a lot of stuff to pack. A good speed 400 sailplane with 3 peice breakdown wings would be a nice traveling companion. Even better if you could engineer a 2 piece fuselage to go with the 3 piece wings. A model like this in on my "to do" list. I need something that can fit the whole shootin' match into a box that goes on the back of my motorcycle so I get my early moring ride in as well as some air time. The best of both worlds.
) when the temp drops to 40F or so. I can't even imagine what it would be like at sub freezing temps. You'd probably stretch it out the 100 feet and get back about 10 feet before it just layed there like a gut shot garter snake and sort of oozed back to it's original length...... Winches are a lot of stuff to pack. A good speed 400 sailplane with 3 peice breakdown wings would be a nice traveling companion. Even better if you could engineer a 2 piece fuselage to go with the 3 piece wings. A model like this in on my "to do" list. I need something that can fit the whole shootin' match into a box that goes on the back of my motorcycle so I get my early moring ride in as well as some air time. The best of both worlds.
12-06-2002, 03:53 PM
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Which speed 400 glider?
Do you guys have any suggestions on a great speed 400 glider that is an arf for about 100 bucks. I want something that climbs out with authority. I don’t mind upgrading the motor for a better one as long as it does not cost an arm and a leg. Is there such a beast?
12-06-2002, 05:13 PM
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Are there thermals in the winter?
Since I don't have topo map on hand at the moment, if they live in the flats you will still find thermals, they should be plenty strong in winter, if they live up in the mountains I recommend a sloper, since you can get some rippin upslope wind in Utah.
12-06-2002, 05:40 PM
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Are there thermals in the winter?
More info on inversions and such (it's a compulsion)...
First, in terms of the surface being warmer than surrounding air, heigh works for you rather than against you. Barring inversions, the air continuously gets cooler as you go up until you hit the top of the troposphere -- and that should be at twenty-something thousand feet in the winter, higher in the summer. So if your surface temperature is close to that of the rest of the earth (and even at 5000 feet, it generally is fairly close) but you're immersed in higher, cooler surrounding air (which in normal conditions you are) then you've got a bigger temperature lapse rate, more instability, and more impetus for vertical motion that someone at a lower altitude would have.
Next, about inversions... we all have 'em. Where I live, the surface temperature usually loses 20 degrees at night, which results in what's known as a radiation inversion (named for the heat loss method that causes it) that's up to a couple thousand feet thick. As the earth warms, the temperature profile gets "univerted" from the bottom up and equalizes its thermal energy by generating increasingly big bubbles of rising air.
Between 10 and 11 AM, the heat content has equalized up to the top of the inversion, the inversion "breaks," and the prevailing wind is allowed to dominate the local flow.
That effect where suddenly the wind starts to blow sometime late in the morning of what started as a pretty calm day is a sign that you had an inversion, and that thermal activity was present and destroyed the inversion, so the inversion affected the nature of the thermal activity, but it didn't keep th thermals from happening.
First, in terms of the surface being warmer than surrounding air, heigh works for you rather than against you. Barring inversions, the air continuously gets cooler as you go up until you hit the top of the troposphere -- and that should be at twenty-something thousand feet in the winter, higher in the summer. So if your surface temperature is close to that of the rest of the earth (and even at 5000 feet, it generally is fairly close) but you're immersed in higher, cooler surrounding air (which in normal conditions you are) then you've got a bigger temperature lapse rate, more instability, and more impetus for vertical motion that someone at a lower altitude would have.
Next, about inversions... we all have 'em. Where I live, the surface temperature usually loses 20 degrees at night, which results in what's known as a radiation inversion (named for the heat loss method that causes it) that's up to a couple thousand feet thick. As the earth warms, the temperature profile gets "univerted" from the bottom up and equalizes its thermal energy by generating increasingly big bubbles of rising air.
Between 10 and 11 AM, the heat content has equalized up to the top of the inversion, the inversion "breaks," and the prevailing wind is allowed to dominate the local flow.
That effect where suddenly the wind starts to blow sometime late in the morning of what started as a pretty calm day is a sign that you had an inversion, and that thermal activity was present and destroyed the inversion, so the inversion affected the nature of the thermal activity, but it didn't keep th thermals from happening.
12-06-2002, 06:08 PM
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Are there thermals in the winter?
New Harmany is pretty flat and at about 5300 ft. It is between St George and Cedar City. Nobody has any suggestions for a speed 400 arf glider?
12-06-2002, 06:18 PM
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Are there thermals in the winter?
I'd love to help, but haven't used them first hand... there are some out there. For instance, I'm pretty sure Graupner has an electric glider that size -- which I'd expect to be about hand-launch size for a 400 motor (something pushing maybe 55-59" span).
12-07-2002, 02:17 AM
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Are there thermals in the winter?
Also check out Northeast Sailplane Products. Here's a link -
http://www.nesail.com/electric2.html
Look in their "specials" because they often have sales that are pretty discounted. They will also offer (translate = negotiate) better prices over the phone.
http://www.nesail.com/electric2.html
Look in their "specials" because they often have sales that are pretty discounted. They will also offer (translate = negotiate) better prices over the phone.
12-18-2002, 10:12 PM
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Are there thermals in the winter?
the flipper by dymond can be had with motor and on/off electronic switch, is verf arf, and has 3 piece wings. Break in the motor before you fly and it will do you well. The tail is removable as well.
12-20-2002, 02:40 AM
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Are there thermals in the winter?
HI are you doing turbo? I posted my aspire ep sailplane on ebay for $199.00 plus $30.00 shipping charge to your state. So here,s the offer , just for you, everything except the esc which only cost $29.00 from horizon hobby, and remember this plane has never been flown before has two folding props, charger, battery ,remote
tow hook for upstart launching, and i have pics of it also i can email you all of this for only $214.00 and this includes shipping also . Let me know what you think !
tow hook for upstart launching, and i have pics of it also i can email you all of this for only $214.00 and this includes shipping also . Let me know what you think !
12-20-2002, 05:26 AM
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Are there thermals in the winter?
think about it for a while this plane is RTF and if you have an esc you are set the control and reciever set up sells for $169.00 alone
ok ill make you a better offer how about $190.00 and ill ship the plane for free !
ok ill make you a better offer how about $190.00 and ill ship the plane for free !
12-20-2002, 03:33 PM
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Bruce
Get yourself a Zagi. That Delta wing is different and a lot of fun. Believe me, It is more challenging than one may think. Your time will be spent enjoyably trimming and mixing your radio for best flight operation.
A lot of fun down low and it will climb on a thermal.
Don't forget, you will need a charger for those batteries. I have one that I can loan you if you would like (it will keep your cost down). I am coming up there in a couple of hours.
Just let me know. If I don't hear from you I will know you are OK.
Cheers and have a Merry Xmas.
Bob
A lot of fun down low and it will climb on a thermal.
Don't forget, you will need a charger for those batteries. I have one that I can loan you if you would like (it will keep your cost down). I am coming up there in a couple of hours.
Just let me know. If I don't hear from you I will know you are OK.
Cheers and have a Merry Xmas.
Bob
12-20-2002, 06:34 PM
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Are there thermals in the winter?
Thanks Bob,
I actually have a great charger but I aapreciate the offer. How the heck are you? Did you get that os 160 running? You should see Gillman springs now!!! PAVED RUNWAY!!!!!! It is going to be the best club in the area hands down!!!
I actually have a great charger but I aapreciate the offer. How the heck are you? Did you get that os 160 running? You should see Gillman springs now!!! PAVED RUNWAY!!!!!! It is going to be the best club in the area hands down!!!
12-20-2002, 08:43 PM
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Seen it
Ive flown off of it Man it has to be the longest runway ever.
Lost my muffler somewhere out there in the dirt. The field is really nice and has a great bunch of guys who belong to the club. Several of which I already knew from Perris.
Yes, I am fine mate, just getting ready to go see Mum and Dad for the Hols.
Did manage to put some flights on the UCD3D yesterday, to close out the year
Bruce you would love one of those. low budget and a doddle to fly.
That 160 went together like a snap and is in my Balsa Nova. I think I have found that the 18/8 APC is best favored. At least on that 15% I got from you
Anyway, have a terrific holiday and see you in the New Year, maybe you will be knife edging that Zagi :stupid:
Man it has to be the longest runway ever.Lost my muffler somewhere out there in the dirt. The field is really nice and has a great bunch of guys who belong to the club. Several of which I already knew from Perris.
Yes, I am fine mate, just getting ready to go see Mum and Dad for the Hols.
Did manage to put some flights on the UCD3D yesterday, to close out the year
Bruce you would love one of those. low budget and a doddle to fly.
That 160 went together like a snap and is in my Balsa Nova. I think I have found that the 18/8 APC is best favored. At least on that 15% I got from you
Anyway, have a terrific holiday and see you in the New Year, maybe you will be knife edging that Zagi :stupid:
12-24-2002, 09:51 PM
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Are there thermals in the winter?
If you want a thermal plane and not a Zagi (I still recommend a Zagi!), check out the Kyosho Stratus 1600. I have one, flies great, will do better with a geared prop like most speed 400 thermal planes. BTW, the Stratus fits your 100 dollar max requirement. Well designed plane, and well built for the money. Likely has the highest value for the dollar for a thermal plane. If you don't install the battery tray in the Stratus you can squeeze in a 3000-4000 mAh NiMh pack. My review of the Stratus, thumbs up. Happy holidays!
Tower Hobbies; Kyosho Stratus
Tower Hobbies; Kyosho Stratus
01-02-2003, 10:30 PM
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Are there thermals in the winter?
RTe winter thermals. If U live near a body of water...& where the water temp is considerably warmer than the surrounding land..thermals will be present. Some of the most consistent/steady thermals occur here on Cape Cod.
