DynaFlite Talon and other designs by KJM
02-20-2007, 09:09 AM
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DynaFlite Talon and other designs by KJM
DynaFlite Talon and other designs by KJM
This post appears in several forums and is in answer to general inquiries about production of my designs
I would like to thank everyone for the interest in my designs, and specifically those appearing in my profile gallery on the RCU website.
In answer to the general question of where to acquire these aircraft;
1. With the exception of the Talon, none of these designs are in production.
In answer to advice on getting these aircraft into production;
2. The Super Talon, Raptor, Squirt and Twist-O-Flex have been well promoted to Hobbico and others since 2005. There is just, no interest.
The state of the hobby is such that kits are, by popular trend, slipping into niche memory for the most part. RTF and ARF appeal to the contemporary modeler for many reasons. Regardless of your opinion of the trend, two truths are evident. One, this genre has opened the hobby to more enthusiasts. A good thing. And two, the subsequent rise in demand for materials has put significant stress on smaller producers of wooden kits. Prices are going up, and quality is suffering. This is a reality builders must face. It is the evolution we sat back and watched. We asked for it in many ways.
Now looking at it from a manufacturers perspective is complex. But of course, it falls to priorities. RTF and ARF are, all other things being equal, profitable. Demand is high, and overseas manufacturing has entered a competitive phase. Consolidation, better production techniques. It’s a one-stop-shop approach for many. Kit's, well, they are a mixed-bag. The Talon has been in production for twenty years, anyone care to guess whether it might be considered a profitable venture?
Kits are on a slow train to oblivion. And until demand for them increases, by actively requesting them and buying other designs, they will become very niche items indeed. You want a Super Talon? A Squirt? How bad?
Waiting for it to happen will only insure that it never does. But put a few friends together, each with 100k to invest, and you can take a hand in changing the course of history. Or, lobby, write,....make noise
Best regards,
Kevin J. McDonald
This post appears in several forums and is in answer to general inquiries about production of my designs
I would like to thank everyone for the interest in my designs, and specifically those appearing in my profile gallery on the RCU website.
In answer to the general question of where to acquire these aircraft;
1. With the exception of the Talon, none of these designs are in production.
In answer to advice on getting these aircraft into production;
2. The Super Talon, Raptor, Squirt and Twist-O-Flex have been well promoted to Hobbico and others since 2005. There is just, no interest.
The state of the hobby is such that kits are, by popular trend, slipping into niche memory for the most part. RTF and ARF appeal to the contemporary modeler for many reasons. Regardless of your opinion of the trend, two truths are evident. One, this genre has opened the hobby to more enthusiasts. A good thing. And two, the subsequent rise in demand for materials has put significant stress on smaller producers of wooden kits. Prices are going up, and quality is suffering. This is a reality builders must face. It is the evolution we sat back and watched. We asked for it in many ways.
Now looking at it from a manufacturers perspective is complex. But of course, it falls to priorities. RTF and ARF are, all other things being equal, profitable. Demand is high, and overseas manufacturing has entered a competitive phase. Consolidation, better production techniques. It’s a one-stop-shop approach for many. Kit's, well, they are a mixed-bag. The Talon has been in production for twenty years, anyone care to guess whether it might be considered a profitable venture?
Kits are on a slow train to oblivion. And until demand for them increases, by actively requesting them and buying other designs, they will become very niche items indeed. You want a Super Talon? A Squirt? How bad?
Waiting for it to happen will only insure that it never does. But put a few friends together, each with 100k to invest, and you can take a hand in changing the course of history. Or, lobby, write,....make noise
Best regards,
Kevin J. McDonald
02-20-2007, 09:59 AM
#2
RE: DynaFlite Talon and other designs by KJM
Kevin,
I am a part time sail plane flyer, mostly it's glow stuff for me. But I have relocated to an area with lots of wind and some decent slopes to try out. It is sad to hear your experiences in this industry, as I am a scratch and kit builder only. Never owned an ARF yet, don't plan to in the future...
That said, would it be feasible for you to distribute plans of your designs? The cost is pretty minimal, shipping is not too bad and it lets people have access to these great designs without a major investment on your part. You could even partner with one of the numerous laser cutting businesses to have them supply short kits to builders who are not interested in cutting their own parts. That's more work on your part, of course, but it does seem to be the way the kit industry is heading. I have bought a number of kits from small niche market suppliers, and to be honest they are light years ahead of the major suppliers. I am currently building a Goldberg Tiger 2 kit that I have had sitting for years. It is really pretty awful, with poor wood selection and less than perfect die cutting. The newer laser cut kits are generally really good, with nice wood and superb parts fit.
Mark
I am a part time sail plane flyer, mostly it's glow stuff for me. But I have relocated to an area with lots of wind and some decent slopes to try out. It is sad to hear your experiences in this industry, as I am a scratch and kit builder only. Never owned an ARF yet, don't plan to in the future...
That said, would it be feasible for you to distribute plans of your designs? The cost is pretty minimal, shipping is not too bad and it lets people have access to these great designs without a major investment on your part. You could even partner with one of the numerous laser cutting businesses to have them supply short kits to builders who are not interested in cutting their own parts. That's more work on your part, of course, but it does seem to be the way the kit industry is heading. I have bought a number of kits from small niche market suppliers, and to be honest they are light years ahead of the major suppliers. I am currently building a Goldberg Tiger 2 kit that I have had sitting for years. It is really pretty awful, with poor wood selection and less than perfect die cutting. The newer laser cut kits are generally really good, with nice wood and superb parts fit.
Mark
02-20-2007, 11:01 AM
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RE: DynaFlite Talon and other designs by KJM
Keven,
I had a couple of Talons back when they were first released, along with an SR-7 and a BobCat. Of the three, the Talon was my favorite. I didn't care much for the BobCat, as it was slow and rather sluggish, but I still have the SR-7. Here in South Texas, we have plenty of wind, but the slopes are small, so these smaller designs work quite well. I can honestly say that I've had more fun with the Talon, than any other slope plane I've flown.
Just want to thank you,
Hank
I had a couple of Talons back when they were first released, along with an SR-7 and a BobCat. Of the three, the Talon was my favorite. I didn't care much for the BobCat, as it was slow and rather sluggish, but I still have the SR-7. Here in South Texas, we have plenty of wind, but the slopes are small, so these smaller designs work quite well. I can honestly say that I've had more fun with the Talon, than any other slope plane I've flown.
Just want to thank you,
Hank
02-22-2007, 06:02 AM
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RE: DynaFlite Talon and other designs by KJM
Thanks for the kind words about the Talon. If you want to build the SuperTalon, drop me a line. [email protected]
I'll send you the conversion book in PDF format
As far as the kit manufacturing suggestions go, they are all valid points. I have been round the block with regard to the different avenues. As is usually the case, success is proportional to the energy expended in acheiving it. I tend to blitz a subject, get the feel, and move on. In the case of the SuperTalon and my recent designs, I blitzed the industry for about eight months. The feeling was bad, and I moved on.
I should explain about my background. In what you might call the real world, I am an industrial designer. Some call me a performance designer. Its been a very diverse thirty years. But one of my specialties is designing and coordinating very high-tech prototyping, or model shops. Atari, Androbot, Rainsong guitars, Ocean Equipment and others. These are, and I say this with all modesty aside, ground up, modern RPD facilities. I've had several shops myself, and CNC is something of an obsession.
So for me, it's usually a matter of loosing patience negotiating with other shops on questions of producing my designs. If I am not hearing the tone I know represents commitment, I let it drop. Its a difficult thing to loose the self-sufficiant mentality. As a result, I tend to think in terms of putting an operation together, start-up style. In the case of kits, I am convinced that a venture could be put together that would garrantee a revenue stream from several sources, (job shopping the machines, etc.) but would primaraly be dedicated to producing a range of high quality kits. I've run the numbers till I'm blue, and it always comes up a winner over a two year term. There is no secret to competing with economic zones sporting labor cost advantage. You put together a CNC facility designed from the get-go to service low volume, quality product, todoit effeciently from both a material and labor standpoint, and you have a model of diverse income streams. Kits, furniture, toys, prototypes, models, whatever. This formula works. I am very close to it in my line. And can point to many success stories. But it takes a financial leap of faith. And I am not the money man, nor am I inclind to do much footwork to find one. If it drops in my lap, I will do what I do best. Make it happen.
Excuse the spelling and the pushy tone. Not meant that way. I am what I am. A little tired.......
Good flying
Kevin
P.S. Plans are a major chunk of work in their own rite. I may do this someday. Time......will tell
I just uploaded some pics of my last shop (Bad floor) and my Barn-bound Windtunnel (Bad ass), and a sample of my design work (Bad subject) But the power guys like it.
I'll send you the conversion book in PDF format
As far as the kit manufacturing suggestions go, they are all valid points. I have been round the block with regard to the different avenues. As is usually the case, success is proportional to the energy expended in acheiving it. I tend to blitz a subject, get the feel, and move on. In the case of the SuperTalon and my recent designs, I blitzed the industry for about eight months. The feeling was bad, and I moved on.
I should explain about my background. In what you might call the real world, I am an industrial designer. Some call me a performance designer. Its been a very diverse thirty years. But one of my specialties is designing and coordinating very high-tech prototyping, or model shops. Atari, Androbot, Rainsong guitars, Ocean Equipment and others. These are, and I say this with all modesty aside, ground up, modern RPD facilities. I've had several shops myself, and CNC is something of an obsession.
So for me, it's usually a matter of loosing patience negotiating with other shops on questions of producing my designs. If I am not hearing the tone I know represents commitment, I let it drop. Its a difficult thing to loose the self-sufficiant mentality. As a result, I tend to think in terms of putting an operation together, start-up style. In the case of kits, I am convinced that a venture could be put together that would garrantee a revenue stream from several sources, (job shopping the machines, etc.) but would primaraly be dedicated to producing a range of high quality kits. I've run the numbers till I'm blue, and it always comes up a winner over a two year term. There is no secret to competing with economic zones sporting labor cost advantage. You put together a CNC facility designed from the get-go to service low volume, quality product, todoit effeciently from both a material and labor standpoint, and you have a model of diverse income streams. Kits, furniture, toys, prototypes, models, whatever. This formula works. I am very close to it in my line. And can point to many success stories. But it takes a financial leap of faith. And I am not the money man, nor am I inclind to do much footwork to find one. If it drops in my lap, I will do what I do best. Make it happen.
Excuse the spelling and the pushy tone. Not meant that way. I am what I am. A little tired.......
Good flying
Kevin
P.S. Plans are a major chunk of work in their own rite. I may do this someday. Time......will tell
I just uploaded some pics of my last shop (Bad floor) and my Barn-bound Windtunnel (Bad ass), and a sample of my design work (Bad subject) But the power guys like it.
