Why do they hate DLG?
 

http://www.scipie.com/rc/images/general/no_dlg_700.jpg

Why do they hate DLG?
Seems every time I bring my DLG to an RC event or while visiting a flying site I get yelled at. Its gotten to the point where now I just leave it home.

Okay some examples...

NEAT Fair
Okay this is a BIG event & they have lots of rules. I realize standing out in the middle of the runway to fly my DLG isn't an option. I respect that. So early one morning before the main flying starts up, I decide to give the DLG a few tosses off to the side of the runway, out of the way of everyone. Sure enough, not five minutes later I see Mr Blue Jacket making his way over to me. "You can't fly that here".

Aerotow Event
Okay so my DLG isn't a five meter scale sailplane but it IS a glider. I spend the day aerotowing with my giant scale sailplane, having a grand old time. Then as the event is winding down, most of the flying is done I figure I'll give the DLG a few tosses. I head way off down the other end of the flying area, well out of everyone's way. I mean this is a sailplane event, they're cool with this right? Well nope... "Sir you're going to have to fly that somewhere else".

Club Visit
A buddy invites me to come visit his flying field. I pack a few planes & hesitate about grabbing the DLG. But he's never seen a DLG fly so I figured, okay I'll bring it. I spend the day hanging out at the field, chat with the locals, do a little flying & then as everyone is packing up & things are getting quiet I figure now might be a good time to demo the DLG. I walk up to the one guy who's still flying & let him know I'll be down at the end of the field flying my DLG for a few minutes. He's cool with that "Okay roger that". I fling the DLG around for 5 minutes, I can hear the guys in the pit area talking about it. Apparently they'd not seen one fly either, "whoa look at the height that thing gets", "look at the duration he's getting & with no motor". All sounded positive enough. So not five minutes later after I'm done, this member who's apparently just about to head home feels he needs to lecture me, "next time you fly you need to be at one of the flight stations. You can't stand wherever you please". I was about to point out that DLGs aren't like other RC planes & can't be flown from behind a flight station. I mean how do you launch with that safety netting thing right in front of you? And don't get me started about how I really don't think it'd be a good idea to land her in that area with other pilots standing right next to me. But I was a guest there & it was not my place to argue, didn't want to rock the boat & get my buddy in trouble. So sounding like a complete idiot I heard myself mutter "Oh okay, no problem".

So alright I get it. A DLG is different. It doesn't taxi, it doesn't fly the pattern & it won't do a go-around if the runway is busy. Its slow circling flight gets in the way of other planes as does the pilot who needs some space to launch & recover. But does that mean this class of plane can't play nice at events or club fields? Seems to me I get my head bitten off everywhere I take it. Its gotten to the point where I just fly it locally with my other DLG buddies but if I'm attending an event or whatever, I leave it home. Why do they hate DLG?

A sailplane is a stationary airborne obstruction to powered models. For that reason I’m hesitant to fly my sailplanes at my powered club field while others are flying their powered models. When I have flown my electric sailplanes there, I keep them completely away from the area that powered planes are using. I don’t fly DLG but I’m familiar with them. To be launching one anywhere close to powered models is asking for criticism. It is not so much of a hatred of DLG as it’s trying to fly sailplanes and powered planes together at the same time.

For that reason among others, a group of us who fly sailplanes, including DLG, started a sailplane club so we could have our own field dedicated to sailplanes.
　
Allan

I'm a member at two different clubs that both have breathtakingly beautiful, large fields. Both of them have power, glider, and helicopters flying... sometimes all at once.

Electric gliders predominate. Discus launched seldom shows up and when it does always has an impact.

Flying any model that has a portable transmitter (sounds odd to say that) can be flown from behind a screened pilot station. When clubs feel that safety requires pilot positions, and that's either screened or not, it is simple and easy for everyone to walk over to an open position and stay there for the duration of the flight. It's sensible to fly by the rules in place wherever you fly for a bunch of reasons.

At both clubs, they discovered with the advent of electric gliders, that the gliders often got in the way of established (and historical) flight patterns. They also discovered that it really was no problem to fly the gliders farther out when their altitude put them into the usual flying area the power models were used to inhabiting. Gliders aren't usually fast and often hang around one area. Unpowered ones often land soon after launch.

Launching a discus launched glider off the club runway wouldn't be a major deal if that was it and the DLG then joined the parade, flew about the same speed and just did maneuvers when spacing allowed, just like the "usual" models. But what happens with DLG's ? They are launched to about the level of the parade, level out and head at whatever direction the pilot thinks there is lift to be found, might make a couple of orbits (at about the level of the parade) and then tries to make it back to the runway. If any of the powered planes is running out of fuel about then.....

I've been a glider guy forever. I love it almost as much as flying Warbirds. WWI and WWII fighters are almost as much fun as flying IMAC maneuvers. Back when soaring took off thanks to the technology allowing, every club I knew of tried to meld gliders with power. That was when highstarts and then winches were the launch methods. It never happened. At least it never worked for one runway.

Obviously, the primary reason back then was the mess the lines caused when they floated down. But they weren't the only reasons. All the rest of the reasons remain for DLG. Electrics have the legs to get to "their airspace". They also aren't landing and taking off every couple of minutes. They also are not committed to land no matter what whenever they have to land.

Trying to combine dissimilar flight envelopes can work, but not when there are way too many dissimilarities. Place them all at one place, on the runway for instance, and it's downright impossible to do.

Must be the club's?

I was flying a Rookie, it is a 2 channel plane that has a push button Tx. It is a "toy". I have a guy waiting for me to land that had his turbine powered Mig sitting there. He was watching that little toy plane fly and laughing at how well it did. We were joking I spent $20.00 and he spent how much on his.

A little bit later I get my glider tug ready. I lift my brothers Fling up to about 700 to 800 feet and release. As I am turning away and dropping, I here a guy behind me say we are breaking the 400 foot limit. The guy standing beside him says not a problem, there are enough spotters out, he was the club Pres. They had not seen a glider lifted on a cradle before.

We setup to launch a balsa profile F4 Phantom jet 2 channel glider. We use a 20 foot piece of tubing, 30 feet of string, 8 foot pole. Hook the string to the glider, stretch the tubing, on release push the pole forward as hard as you can. Launches it up a couple hundred feet. With 3 people on the runway, pits were full, no one cared. They enjoyed the show.

I can see launching the DLG, walking close to the fence to fly. Yet there are people who do not like aspects of this hobby, they are way to wound up and full of themselves.


Buzz.

BTW, both of my two perfect club fields have rules that would disallow DLGs in more ways than one. They both have designated heli airspace and pilot positions. The heli area does not overlap. Good thing around here is there has never been a conflict. The few people without glider experience who tried DLGs didn't stick with them. The ones with glider experience also were experienced with power and never got the DLGs out unless the field was empty.

A designated DLG area would work as good as the designated heli areas work. Unfortunately, the DLG guys can't get it done in the small space the heli guys use.

Face it, any model which does not fit the "norm" of what most of the modelers are flying is usually discouraged. Try flying: helicopters, quad copters 3 D, sailplanes using a winch or high start, or control line at an average RC field and you will usually have someone express displeasure with your activities.
Peter

don't know
 

I never had a DLG but they're fun to watch. I also do not belong to any club although once in a while stop-by two local clubs to chat and fly. I love this DLG video:
http://youtu.be/15NYgdVJRcQ Many times over I was told as a glider pilot to stay away from the general flying area due to a low speed of my glider. To people's surprise it flew faster than many of the power planes.
I guess it depends on what type of aircraft mostly flown in a club and historical interests.
On most fields I've been to - field mostly idle than busy. Why not fly DLG while everybody paused.
If someone don't like the type of models I fly - I'd take my dues and go fly elsewhere. It sounds like prohibiting scrambled eggs at a dinner time in a restaurant.
cheers,
Mark

Any pilot who feels he has to stand in the runway is going to cause problems. If you can't fly from the pilot stations, and the club requires it, you're going to cause conflict.

If your model constantly takes off and lands and the landings cannot be aborted, you're going to cause conflict.

As for glider speed being the only cause for conflict with power models, speed is just one detail. Consider how fast hotliners are. Yet their usual flights are like thermal flights, vertical paths predominantly. When the usual air traffic is horizontal, air traffic that is vertical is going to conflict. When those vertical paths are not predictable, as in the case of gliders in lift, they are even more annoying.

We've got to consider our impact on the established community. We should think hard about how we fit in and tailor our actions to the club's rules. Unpowered gliders and powered models really don't fit very well together.

I agree da Rock,
It has been established well before RC took-off in masses. Full scale gliders do not do well with power planes as well. In case a full scale glider will show-up at JFK vicinity it will have priority for landing over 747 or A-380 and that where money will start leaking like hell.
The same goes for RC fields. But in good community there is always a room for all kind of activity. Like I've mentioned above if flights are on idle - DLG is not an obstruction and could be very enjoyable by onlookers.
I personally would not fly any glider or power plane when someone requested a flight of, say big scale plane before me. I'd rather enjoy watching first and fly later.
People are different and pilots are different. Some can not judge the distance, some have slower reaction. But after all we're all on the field to enjoy the activity and keep our "toys" in one piece.
DLG is not a culprit - ignorance and lack of discipline are.
Happy flying everybody!
Mark.

They don't hate DLGs, they dislike pilots who violate the field flying rules. And you listed them here in the "I get it" paragraph.

If you stood on the runway flying a heli they would like have given you the same answer.

It seems that your concept of a club field is a power club field that has no provisions for gliders. So, no, it will likely not be welcome there. Even an aerotow event is basically a power airplane event that releases gliders. The field operates as a power field not a glider field.

If you want to fly gliders, fly them at a glider field. Or work out an accepted area at the power club field where you can fly a DLG. Bbut don't expect a power only club to welcome your glider with open arms. Just not reasonable.

Now, if you can work out a way to fly it that is in accord with current flight rules, or get a designated area under different flight rules, then they probably won't mind.

Yeah "hate" is probably too strong a word but it serves this topic well in grabbing folk's attention. I've also posted this thread elsewhere & like here, have gotten some interesting feedback.

I think everyone agrees, flying DLG from a flight station at a busy "power club" is not a good idea. No doubt, what seems to be more acceptable/sensible is to designate an area for DLG, the same way most clubs do for helicopters. Or at the very least allow us to toss around our DLGs during downtime or between flights. What frustrates me is the unwillingness I've witnessed to even try to accommodate this type of flying.

Yes I do most of my DLG flying at my local facility where sailplanes are dominant. Its DLG heaven, I have it good, shouldn't complain. I think its because of that (I'm spoiled) that I'm so bothered when I'm told "you can't fly that here". And I totally understand why but that doesn't mean I like it. My goal is to get folks thinking about this issue is all.

I enjoy most aspects of rc modeling, been at it since I was a young teen.
I`ve seen this type of thing many times, not trying to be offensive but when somebody shows up with something that doesn't fit in with what everybody else is playing with you can't really get upset if they don't let you play.
First time I saw this was when I was racing 1/12 scale on road carpet cars, guy showed up with a 1/10 scale buggy with knobby tires, didn't want to listen to the fact that we run smooth tired cars on carpet, Couldn't really take the risk of him damaging the carpet in a rented space.
I'm most active in electric boat racing, used to be nitro but we lost our running spot due to noise. If a nitro boater showed up I'm sorry to say we wouldn't let him run. Don't want to lose another spot due to noise complaints.
I'm not much of a pilot yet, not even sure what aspect of flying I like more, but I do know I wouldn't bring or my heli or glider to the local flying club, I don't expect them to change the rules for me, I find other places to fly those models. To be honest I usually fly everything alone at a good friends farm, few hundred acres with nothing but the odd cow to hit and some trees along the fence lines.....I just really enjoy the relaxation of being out in the country early in the morning alone, no worries about my lack of skills interfering with others fun.
LOL 6 boats doing 60 mph around a 1/6 mile oval is NOT relaxing, a pile of fun, hands shaking, knees trembling excitement.....
Not saying you are guilty of any of these behaviors, quite the opposite actually. But some people seem the think the world revolves around them and the sun does shine out their butt! They just think the have the right to do whatever they want and really don't care how the repercussions effect everybody else.
Heli pilots killing themselves accidently, the current stuff surrounding FPV flying, a couple years ago a kid was impaled and killed by an rc boat, guy was running it at a public swimming area....
Sad.

You bring up some good points there & I agree introducing something that clearly doesn't fit can be disruptive or dangerous. Gas planes at an electric only field, giant 1/3 scale warbirds at a small public park & such. And you're right about people who feel entitled to do what they wish, wherever. On the flip side of course are those that are stuck in their ways & are reluctant to accept new ideas or work on ways to expand a site's ability to host a variety of flying disciplines.

i was looking at the dlg stuff as specific type of flying as with slope,thermal ( all types ),electric,gas,heli..car, boat, scale, whatever jandra, ya gotta go where its the best spot to do it continuously... jus thinking

In our club we try to accomodate as many types of aircraft as possible within reason. We had some problems with 3d guys who would pull right up in front of the flight stations and hover and smoke while 5 other guys are trying to fly. Put an end to that real soon. We have lots of guys flying electrics and offered an electric only evening mid week. The glider guys all use electric motors and fly high enough that they are'nt an issue too much and only a few mess with helis. We don't allow turbines because of the size of the field. I agree though you can't stand out on the runway, no matter where you stand you are a safety risk to yourself and others. I've seen enough landings and take offs that used up all the runway and then some.

You know why they don't like gliders at power fields?

Because we don't need expensive fuel and they do. :D

Because we know how to use the force and they don't. :)

Because we can sneak up on 'em and they never hear us coming. :o

*smile* @ aeajr

I like da vid too

Da demo
 

I was demonstrating to the guys at the local field and the look of Bewilderment they gave me was quite interesting..LOL..I'm also the only most avid sloper and thermal pilot on island...one guy even asked me Why i fly with no motor..so I tease them and say I got rid of all my electrics..the look I get is priceless..:eek:..but yeah I feel its the unknowing that bothers them as well as the cost we dont spend to get the most from the hobby..theres a guy that has an attitude about cost, if you're not bringing to the field an aircraft costing a grand or more then your not enjoying the hobby.. " IT's Da Flying Man....FFFlllyiinngg..so to me it all works regardless..5oz or 50lbs - 10" ws or 100" . its all about what you enjoy and just because its not thier bag - they should'nt Dis it..anyways I'm going flyin tomorrow

I don’t understand the problem our club membership averages between 80 and 100 members each year and I have seen them make room for just about everything to fly even the odd time guys get nostalgic and drag out their old control line. Kids have shown up with their parents and if we find the kid has a bloody Air Hog there is always time when everyone will sit it out for a bit to let the kid out on the field to fly the darn thing. I have been to events that are so busy that an unusual configuration or model might only get to fly at a half time show but at a regular flying day at the field I have never known there to be no time to accommodate everyone. Sounds more like an attitude problem than anything. I have even flown free flight and gently assisted RC from my field with the blessing of all of those there. I have seen many times someone who is going to maiden a plane ask if he can do the maiden in clear airspace. No problem what’s 10 minutes or so out of a flying day. We even like to let a student doing his wings test to have all of the field and airspace to himself. If you as a club do any of these things you most certainly can sit back and enjoy a few minutes watching the antics of someone flying DLG.

On that note if you are flying something out of the ordinary don't just walk out and surprise everyone by putting it into the air. Talk to them, explain what you intend to do and what the expected flight envelope of what you have and most likely a provision for you to fly can be made. When visiting other clubs (I do a lot) I have never been told I could not fly my unusual models as long as I discussed the model before hand and made clear my intentions.

Dennis

Come to our field.

You can do whatever you want ... so long as you take the responsibility for it.

I hope you don't mind but I was teasing my friends at the field with you're three reasons but the response was quite funny, especially when I used the force ....LOL:D

I agree with your thoughts concerning talking to the guys and letting them know what I'm up too...I don't ever just pull up and throw my planes out even though at the field I fly, I could....thats just not cool..but with me I don't bother throwing out as I go where I can fly all I want..besides with DLG, I'm looking for the challenge of an unknown spot anyways. besides thats the thing about DLG, being able to fly in unknown areas looking for lift..having said that, if I go to a power field, I want to fly power to run the pattern with the boys..what I usually do is slope/thermal/dlg before going to the field so that my day is comepletely filled with all the types of flying I do..I also understand that alot of you guys live far from flyiing spots and thats another set of circumstances...

Forget about flying DLG or most gliders for that matter at any model flying club. While some members would be OK with it most will have an issue.(club rules or not!)
One reason I stopped flying at clubs was all the heir-achy within the club members themselves, especially when it came to the models they fly.
I now fly smaller electric models and DLG gliders (responsibly) at large local parks in my area and never looked back.

In all my years of flying and the many clubs I have visited both in Canada and the USA I have never been made to feel unwelcome including some of my weird stuff. I have a Lazy Ace I can carry pure gliders aloft and release at altitude. I will invite most anyone to try their hand at flying a Gentle Lady released from the glider tug. You would be amazed at how many who have never flown a glider step up to give it a try. I explain any 40 size trainer has no problem getting most 2 meter gliders up. I even show them glider towing using Velcro instead of a tow hook allowing the two to separate if something goes wrong on the tow. Proper attitude and having patience goes a mighty long way. If there is no interest then that is fine as well and I fly the other planes I have brought. There are very few down days when I am out flying.