zx11ninja

Hi all.


I am beginning my process to join you as an r/c helicopter pilot, but I need to borrow from your vast experience and knowledge. I have never flown anything before, and I am looking hard into learning to fly this summer. I have done some research, but that is all. Now, it is time to start buying, or at least start pricing. I believe in the adage, "You get what you pay for," so I understand that I will probably be spending around $1000 or so. I am prepared for that.

I am looking for a helicopter on which I can train comfortably, yet, one that I will not outgrow. What I want is a nitro helicopter that has full CCPM and 3D capability built in. I do not want to have to buy more parts to make it 3D capable. I want to spend the money once and be done.

The helicopter should also have, if possible, a belt-driven tail, metal rotor head parts (no plastic, if possible), metal frame, carbon fiber rotor and tail blades, etc.

On HeliHobby.com, I looked at the complete Hawk 30 system for $645. However, the turn-off is that you must add parts to it to make it 3D capable, if I remember correctly.

I looked at the Raptor 50, and I liked what I saw. I especially like the fact that, to make it 3D capable, you simply switch the original paddles to the lighter paddles that already come inside the kit. The Raptor 50 is described as the world's best selling helicopter. Therefore, buying one should not be a mistake, as I would be in good company.

Lastly, I looked at the Tiger 50's description. Again, it is a beautiful machine and sounds like a winner. Too bad it will not be available until August 2006 or something like that.

So, good people, based on the above or what is not above, what do you think a suitable helicopter for me would be?


A fellow poster said that I should buy quality individual components, as some combos ship with average components. He mentioned that I should get individually get a quality radio system, a quality engine, and a quality kit. So, I will have a little shopping to do.

Actually, before I even get the helicopter, I must first get the radio system, as I can not buy and use Real Flight 3D without a transmitter. However, I guess I do not have to get the servos immediately. What is a good radio transmitter which I will not outgrow and can handle any helicopter, including retractible landing gear?

So, any kind suggestions would be greatly appreciated.



See you in the sky.

-Z



P.S. They say that with a CCPM, you do not need digital servos (regulars will do), as all of the servos work together in a CCPM system. Could someone please elaborate on this concept and explain exactly what digital vs. regular servos and why that is important concerning the rotor head mechanics?

BarracudaHockey

My Feedback: (11)

3d and ccpm don't really go hand in hand, the Raptor is a fine 3d heli thats not eCCPM.

This can get expensive where crashes are concerned, many start out with wood mains and stock tail blades till thier flying progresses to the point they can tell the difference. Don't base your purchase decision on this, most all of the 300 dollar range helicopters ship with wood blades and stock head parts.

Do a search on helihobby on RCU and check them with the BBB in California is all I am going to say about them.

The Raptor 50 with an OS50 hyper will take you from hovering to advanced 3d. It will perform 3d w/o the addition of the lighter paddles but they certainly quicken things up, they are not however included in the kit. From a stand point of ease of building, technical info availability and parts availability this is a hard combo to beaat.

Its been available for some time but my experience with it was less than pleasing. Others have had success with it, the instructions and support are great, maybe after a few mods but its not really a 3d machine out of the box.

Id say get a Raptor 50 or EVO 50 with an OS engine, preferably the hyper, a good computer radio such as the 9C or JR 9303, good servos and a good sim. RealFlight 3 comes with a transmitter, its Reflex that requires one.

CCPM doesn't need digitals but like anything else, good digital servos make everything more precise, whats important is all 3 are matched if you go that route. All servos aren't created equal, theres cheap digital servos that I wouldn't use on a 50 like Futaba 3151s and theres good analog ones I dont' have any problems with in a 60 like Futaba 9202s. The best servos for a 50 are probably 9252s or whatever the JR equivelent is.
Here's a good PDF from Futaba that talks about the differences between Digital and Analog servos.

BarracudaHockey

My Feedback: (11)

Oh ya, for a great place to buy Raptors and combos check out http://www.heliproz.com a call to them and they will help you pick out the best combo to fit your budget and needs. They also sell Raptors with metal upgrade parts.

Also http://www.ronlund.com is Ricks, great prices and awesome service.

http://www.onlyraptors.com

zx11ninja

Hi all.


Barracudahockey, once again, I am in your debt. As always, you give great advice. Good look for the warning on HeliHobby. I don't need drama in my life ;-)

You forgot to post the PDF file from Futaba for the discussion on analog vs. digital servos. I'll check back for that.

Can an Airwolf fuselage fit on a Raptor 50 frame?

Sorry to belabor this, but I read that in eCCPM, the servos work less hard, as they work in unison instead of having each servo tied to a certain function. Is there an advantage to having the aileron, elevator, etc., being individually controlled by one servo vs. eCCPM, especially where stability and future 3D flight is concerned?


Thanks.

-Z

im_a_rcav8r

If I may interject just one thing.... If you have a local hobby shop that sells heli parts, try to get a bird that they have parts for. My shop sells every thing for the EVO and the Raptor... I chose the EVO .50 because for the same price I got carbon fiber main and tail blades (was on sale) When pricing don't forget to compair apples to apples. All metal bird will cost way more but may not be as good a fit for what you want... Talk to a lot of people who fly in your area. Find out what they fly and why they made that choice.

happy hovering!!!!

BarracudaHockey

My Feedback: (11)

http://www.futaba-rc.com/servos/digitalservos.pdf

As for the ccpm debate, I'll give you a perfect example. I have a mechanical mix Hirobo EVO50, my buddy has the same bird, same engine and servos but its ccpm. Unless you fly one, land and fly the other you would never know there was any difference. The very slight differerence in feel may be because of the ccpm or just the way he set his up but if you just flew one then the other without being told, you would probably never know the difference. In no way would I term it better, just slightly different.

The Century Bell 222 fits the R50 so I see no reason the Air Wolf wouldn't.

James A Culp III

On the subject of Heliproz, they sell the raptor 50 (Titan now) in a package with the OS .50 Hyper and a bunch of their metal head parts (less the head block) if you just 'gotta' have metal. Frankly the metal in the head other than possibly the head block isn't necessary but it looks spiffy. I think this upgraded Raptor 50 package is called a Hyper-raptor or some such in their online catalogue.

Welcome to the addiction,
James

BarracudaHockey

My Feedback: (11)

The nice thing about their veloci raptor and hyper raptor packages is that they include all the stock parts, you can build it stock and replace as needed.

pcinc

My Feedback: (29)

Here is my .02 cents on it. You will need help taking on this hobby. Help with learning to fly,help with building the chopper and help with programming and setting up the radio. Go to a local field and see what everyone there is flying. Ask someone there for advice. I found the Raptor 50 to be a good all around machine capable of learning on as well as doing 3D (others doing 3D, not me!) The parts are at most LHS and readily available at the popular online stores. Compared to some of the other brands, prices are pretty reasonable. I don't think it's the absolute best machine out there but it's pretty hard to beat. Check out some of the online forums and you will see what I mean about availible help. Same goes for the radio choice. I would see what everyone near you uses and go with that. JR 9303 or Futaba 9C are both winners. You will need help in the set up and it's much less fustrating if you have someone familiar with your radio. The most important of all is a decent Sim and practice, practice, practice. I took it up about a year and a half now and have been bit by the bug (read: addiction) hard. I also never have flown RC before and found it useful to get a trainer plane and get some stick time on it. It was mucheasier to learn and fly the plane and it all helps your brain to hand coordination. Don't be afraid to get into a small foamy either.I found that to be a very useful learning tool. I had it in the back of my car all the time and could stop at a field on the way home and toss it into the air for 15 -20 mins with little to no preparation time. I see your on the Eastern side of the state. Any time you want to drive across and get together we usually have a couple of us out on any given day.
Good luck with your choices. Drop a note anytime you want to hook up.
Peter