Quandry

Some very useful tips in this thread!

I picked up an NIB kit recently and have it squirrelled away for the next winter build.

How are all of the Dogs in the forum going anyway?? Sound off!

sidgates

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Mine is still in the work shop waiting for engine install. Most owners I have talked to have rehinged the flaps on bottom side to get more flap travel. Instead I elected to cut out the Speed brakes and make them operational. I hope to see how this works out within the next month.

red76ta

Sid, let us know how the speed brakes work out, please! (pic's too!)

Mine is still waiting for the 3.5 hour drive and a good weekend weather forecast to get maidened! I hope to fly it soon at Farview, in Pennsylvania and work on my waiver there too!

Happy flying,

sidgates

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[QUOTE=red76ta;11806935]Sid, let us know how the speed brakes work out, please! (pic's too!)

Mine is still waiting for the 3.5 hour drive and a good weekend weather forecast to get maidened! I hope to fly it soon at Farview, in Pennsylvania and work on my waiver there too!

Happy flying,[/QUOTE

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Will report maiden here.

Rod_Hart

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Mine is getting closer. I still need to install my wren and finish radio install. Maybe by the end of next month.

Rod

sidgates

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I am hoping one would be flying at Ft. Collins in June.

Quandry

Rod - your dog is looking great!

Sid, I really liked the speed brake setup you made! the door re-inforcing and servo tray look like true craftsmanship. Any chance you would offer the components as a DIY kit? I would love to install that on my dog also.

sidgates

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Quandry,
I made (have) molds for making the inside cover for the speed brake install. My design isn't very scale like but functional. Originally I had intended to mount the servo inside the fuselage but found it more work than I wanted to do.

This is link to a video on the speed brake. I may have posted this earlier:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUhBHUJBQ8o

My modeling time is at a premium right now but I might find time to lay up the molds. You can contact me at:
[email protected]

Quandry

Thank you Sid, I will send you an email.

Best regards,
Geoff.

red76ta

[QUOTE=sidgates;11806973]Absolutely, just don't know when...I forgot that this is a holiday weekend and a funfly at another area club the following week. (My first trip to Joe Nall last week was fantastic!)

Quandry

Hello chaps, I am considering power options for the Dog Sabre. I see a lot of folks are running Kingtech K80's. I already have a VT80 in another bird so instead of sourcing another 80 size turbine I am thinking of installing a K100 in the Dog. It seems that the difference in spec is not that big between the two? also if I want to take that turbine off to a different frame in the future it seems a 100 should give a lot of choices.

Kingtech K80
Diameter: 95.25mm ( 3-3/4" )
Length: 254mm ( 10" ) - including starter
Weight: 1304g ( 2 lb. 14oz. ) - including starter
Maximum RPM: 145000
Thrust: 8618 g @ 21.1° C. ( 19 lb. @ 70° F. )
Idle: 45000rpm
Exhaust temperature: 650° C ( 1202° F )max
Fuel consumption: 239 g / min ( 8.46 oz / min )
Fuel: Diesel, Jet A1, Kerosene
Lubrication: 5%, 3 to 5% for Diesel
Maintenance cycle: 25 hours

Kingtech K100
Diameter: 3-3/4" (95.25mm)
Length: 10" (254mm) - including starter
Weight: 2 lb. 14oz. (1300 g) - including starter
Maximum RPM: 142000
Thrust: 22 lb. @59° F. (10 KG @ 15° C.)
Idle: 43000rpm
Exhaust temperature: 1202° F (650° C) max
Fuel consumption: 11.84 oz / min (350 g / min)
Oil: 5% Turbine oil
Maintenance cycle: 25 hr


Anyone running K100 in the Dog and how do you find it? all other turbine opinions welcome also.

red76ta

The K100 kero start is what I put in my dog, but I haven't flown it yet. I believe that it has the same footprint as the K80 so installation is same. Fuel use may be an issue as there is a sizable consumption difference. I will post my thoughts once I maiden her.

Have a great holiday weekend,

Quandry

Very nice Bill, best of luck for the maiden!

Geoff

Pull Up Now!

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I don't know about the jet, but I like mission coffee tables.

Pull Up Now!

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Sid, super nice job on the speed brake install. Very clean and modular, making the install very straightforward.

Pull Up Now!

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Mission orders came through last Sunday, time to get this Dog into the air after 2 years of learning, building, kit fixing, testing, and weathering.

Here are some pictures, video links to follow. They're already on Youtube right now. I have never flown a turbine before in my life. So this "mission" was planned to the T. I practiced quite a bit with a H9 Habu, with telemetry. Level flight 107 mph. The landing behavior is identical to the Saber Dog. This was a good decision.

The maiden was textbook. No surprises. It handles perfectly. A bit of right aileron trim was all that was needed. I am going to shamelessly drop a name here--I maidened the F86 at Joe Grice's private field. Thanks to Joe for all the advise given over the last 2 years.

The maiden flight had specific goals. Get it airborne, get it trimmed. Fly a couple circuits at 3/4 throttle max to establish initial reliability and controlability. Gears down, slow the model at 2 mistakes high altitude, landing flaps, and reduce throttle until stall. Note the telemetry airspeed at this moment. 35mph. OK, now we know the landing profile better. Turn final at 60 mph, slow her down and cross the numbers at 50. Bleed speed to flare at 40-45mph. The radio is reporting speed every 5 seconds. It's all timing now.. A VERY brief flare and a perfect nose high touchdown.

The rudder gyro completely eliminated any dutch roll tendency on approach. Don't put in too much gain. Shaking the tail back and forth should give no more than 1/4" defection max either direction.

The K80 ran flawlessly, on diesel fuel. This is plenty of power for any vertical maneuver. In my opinion, the K100 is not necessary.

A note about the model's finish. This kit is rough, and not very accurate, so I opted to weather the finish as though the Saber has been sitting in a boneyard for 40 years. You will see dark streaks all over it. This removes the "arf" look while avoiding getting into aspergers type detail modelling. All in all, a very rewarding project for the budget minded jet aspirant.

Links to Youtube of maiden. Sorry about the shaky cam!
http://youtu.be/Oczju2WAhdQ
http://youtu.be/1-BAArn_HXE

Pull Up Now!

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It would be nice if someone made a reasonably priced cockpit kit for this Modellbau F86. Maybe they do, but I haven't been able to find it.

Quandry

Very nice, congrats on the maiden flight - looks like it was a lot of fun and that's a very nice strip!

mtnflyer14

Check my post #384 from Feb 2012. I got the cockpit from Hobby King and got it in with minimal mods.
Regards,
Gus

sidgates

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Pull Up,
Congratulations, very well done and planned. What radio and air speed set up are you using? Did you modify the flap hinging for more flap travel?

readyturn

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Nice flight and as Sid said, well planned. Nothing bothers me more than for a maiden flight not to look at the low speed handling prior to the first landing.

Well done... now to finish mine.

Rick

Pull Up Now!

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Yes, Gus, I read that post. About 6 months ago, I checked HK and they don't sell that anymore. To be thorough, I'll check again. Can you look back over your order history and get a part number? Sometimes, with HK, that's the only way to find something. Thanks!

Pull Up Now!

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Sid, thank you and everyone else for the congrats extended. People probably don't know how much this means after you put so much effort into something over a 2 year period. This is not a toy, and the checklist before flight is pretty long. Or it should be. Even so, after being so careful and thorough, I still forgot a couple things. I had used math to calculate the stall speed, and long ago set the DX9 radio telemetry alarm to start reporting airspeed at that 35 mph calculated number. I just put it in there to remember what I'd calculated, knowing the real alarm should go off at least 10mph faster than stall. At the time, I was testing the pitot tube and telemetry and didn't want to turn blue blowing into that thing just to test. Well, I forgot about that, and wondered why I wasn't getting any audible reports until after touchdown. Dumb. Fortunately Joe was calling out my airspeed looking over my shoulder so I knew my approach speed.
As I said, the radio is a DX9 with telemetry. Hobby King receiver. .....ha ha, just kidding. It's a 12ch Spektrum. I did NOT hinge the flaps at the bottom. But the landing configuration is still 45 degs down. With a verified stall speed of 35mph, I really don't see the need to hinge at the bottom. That is plenty slow. Also, the wing tanks add a lot of drag. The telemetry is a straight Spektrum TM1000 with their airspeed module. One note, binding the TM1000 is done totally different from what the manual says. This is one thing about Spektrum that bothers me...they don't explain much in their documentation. For example, the books says nothing about what "one time" means in the SD card data logging section of the book. They also don't say what to expect about the file adding to itself every time you fly. They also don't mention anything about the Spektrum and the aftermarket file Viewer that is out there. For binding, one must get 4 hands going and power up the TM1000 with it's own separate battery at the same time you bind the main receiver. Do NOT have any hard wired connection to the receiver because the TM1000 won't bind. Yes, there is some crazy workaround to that, but a separate battery is much easier to remember. I don't know what they were thinking. I know documentation must be written in parallel to the product design and production, but they never go back over and fix the errors. Spektrum! You're making tons of money with great hardware. Finish the job!

Pull Up Now!

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Yeah, that airstrip is the best. Dead flat, and no background clutter on either approach. There was no wind that day either, so the airspeed you report is the ground speed ya get!

jetjockey

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Hey Guys, I need some replacement parts for my Saber Dog. I tried to contact Modellbau at the Florida phone number listed, but the person answering the phone said they were out of business and changed the phone #. Anybody know about this, and is it true? Anybody know how to contact them?

Thanks, Les