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Talk to me about fuel filters

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Old 12-03-2011, 06:37 PM
  #1
Dr Honda
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Default Talk to me about fuel filters

Hi Guys,

OK... right now, I'm running a plastic Festo fuel filter on the pressure side of my Falcon 120 with an AT-180. I have been told they may leak... and I pulled up a few old threads where people have had failures with them. SO... what do you guys use on the pressure side? I know the UAT is an excellent filter... but I want something after my fuel pump.


Thanks in advance.
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Old 12-03-2011, 06:54 PM
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Default RE: Talk to me about fuel filters

Hi. I have been using KAvan maxi filters for 3+ years on my p80 without any problems.

Installed between pump and fuel solenoid.
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Old 12-03-2011, 07:49 PM
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Default RE: Talk to me about fuel filters

Tony,
I have run only 6mm festo filters on the supply side of the pump of all my AMT's. I tried other filters awhile back and the Mercury would not run correctly. I then went back to the Festo, and everything was good again.

Ron
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Old 12-03-2011, 08:46 PM
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Default RE: Talk to me about fuel filters

No filter on board for me. Filter in my filler jug, in line filter at fill up, no flame outs, ever!
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Old 12-03-2011, 10:36 PM
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Default RE: Talk to me about fuel filters

I use the air trap as a filter. Never had a filter downstream the pump. Never had clogged injectors in 15 years flying turbines.
I guess that the only risk that the filter may trap in this position is a fuel pump failure sending big chunks of bronze into the engine. But I've never seen or heard of this kind of problem happening.
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Old 12-04-2011, 05:18 AM
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Default RE: Talk to me about fuel filters

Last year my Festo seperated on the seam causing the fuel to pump in to the fuselage during flight. Upon landing the airplane caught fire and was destroyed. I use the Kavan filter ever since.

Jim
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Old 12-04-2011, 05:55 AM
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Default RE: Talk to me about fuel filters


Quote:
ORIGINAL: racer8297

Last year my Festo seperated on the seam causing the fuel to pump in to the fuselage during flight. Upon landing the airplane caught fire and was destroyed. I use the Kavan filter ever since.

Jim

Yep... that's what I don't want to happen. The local CD (causeitflies) had a leak on a Festo filter, (found it before a total failure) and he was the person who said I may want to use something different.

That Maxi filter looks good, and it uses a polyester mesh screen like the Festo filter.
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Old 12-04-2011, 05:58 AM
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Default RE: Talk to me about fuel filters

Tony, use my CAT then you don't need a filter ;-)

marcs
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Old 12-04-2011, 06:13 AM
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Default RE: Talk to me about fuel filters

I've been successfully using the Dubro Final Filter.
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXD742&P=7

Do not mount an in-line filter horizontally. Mount it vertical with fuel entering the bottom and exiting the top. Also do not hard mount it, leave it free to move a bit. This will prevent it from trapping any air bubbles. When you first install it and purge the fuel lines tap the filter a few times until you're sure all the air is out of the it, then you're good to go.

Joe
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Old 12-04-2011, 06:31 AM
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Default RE: Talk to me about fuel filters

the filter after the pump is to filter the little particles of wear from the pump its self, these particles can and do get trapped in the fuel solenoid and prevent it closing, if you are one of those who doesn't close your manual valve (and you should be closing it) then you have a VERY good chance of a wet start.


i like the JetCat aluminum filter myself, i have used and still have a Festo type and never had any issues to date.
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Old 12-04-2011, 06:34 AM
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Harley Condra
 
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Default RE: Talk to me about fuel filters

Safety Note:
For you JetCat owners, page 12 of the instruction manual shows the filter location.
This does not just pertain to JetCats, but should apply to all engine brands as a safety item. I am sure that there are some newbies out there that could use this information.

A high quality filter installed in the pump outlet line between the pump and solenoid valve will prevent debris from fuel pump gear wear from entering the solenoid valve, possibly sticking the valve in the open position at shutdown.
A stuck solenoid valve will allow fuel into the engine during fueling, which could start a fire during engine start.
The filter should be mounted in the vertical position to eliminate the possibility of trapping an air bubble in the filter housing.

Just my .02 worth.....
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Old 12-04-2011, 02:26 PM
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Default RE: Talk to me about fuel filters

Should always use a mechanical fuel shut off like the Festo ball valve as a secondary precaution

Ted
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Old 12-04-2011, 04:22 PM
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Default RE: Talk to me about fuel filters

Thanks for all the input guys.
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Old 12-04-2011, 05:08 PM
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Default RE: Talk to me about fuel filters

Avoid that festo at all cost! I had one fail on my F-15. Lucky it was on the ground during startup. Had a couple of fail startups with a "SLOW ACCELL" read out on GSU....then my wife noticed fuel pouring out the bottom of the jet! It was a failed Festo Filter. I believe they are designed to be in the vacume side of the line...not the pressure side. Some people have had luck smearing the joint with hysol! Good luck. BTW I have had good luck with Sullivan "crap traps" up to P-80 class turbines! After that I use Jetcat filters!
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Old 12-04-2011, 07:09 PM
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Default RE: Talk to me about fuel filters

Quote:
ORIGINAL: olnico

I use the air trap as a filter. Never had a filter downstream the pump. Never had clogged injectors in 15 years flying turbines.
I guess that the only risk that the filter may trap in this position is a fuel pump failure sending big chunks of bronze into the engine. But I've never seen or heard of this kind of problem happening.
Ive flown AMT for years using UAT only. Filter the fuel on your Fuel jug before it gets in your jet and you should have no worries. As far as my Jet Cat and Jet central turbines I use their filters on the pressure side of system between pump and solenoid. Has anyone actually had a restricted filter on these setups when also using a UAT? I would imagine that the only debris possible to get in filter would have to be pump matter. Scott
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Old 12-04-2011, 07:57 PM
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Default RE: Talk to me about fuel filters


Quote:
ORIGINAL: S HARRIS
I would imagine that the only debris possible to get in filter would have to be pump matter. Scott

That't the worry. As the pump wears, that will go into the engine. It may not be a problem on a bigger engine, but on a smaller engine, it could plug up the fuel needles, or the oil port to the bearings.
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Old 12-14-2011, 06:50 AM
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Default RE: Talk to me about fuel filters


Quote:
ORIGINAL: marc s

Tony, use my CAT then you don't need a filter ;-)

marcs
I have just installed one of your CATs. Is it really a valid option to do without another filter? I am thinking especially on the pressure side of the system to pick up anything shed from the pump? It would make for a much simpler installation to rely entirely on the filter in the CAT, but I am nervous that this may not be enough.

Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Andrew

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Old 12-14-2011, 07:10 AM
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Default RE: Talk to me about fuel filters

Quote:
ORIGINAL: wearypanda


Quote:
ORIGINAL: marc s

Tony, use my CAT then you don't need a filter ;-)

marcs
I have just installed one of your CATs. Is it really a valid option to do without another filter? I am thinking especially on the pressure side of the system to pick up anything shed from the pump? It would make for a much simpler installation to rely entirely on the filter in the CAT, but I am nervous that this may not be enough.

Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Andrew


Marc's CAT's are nice bubble traps... and they are a excellent fuel filter... but there is a real issue with the fuel pump sending junk into the engine.

After I made this post, I found out that my MW44 has a filter in behind the FOD screen. It looks like Kavan filter with threaded fittings. I bought this engine used, and I know on it's last service the fuel pump was replaced. And guess what I found inside of it???? Yep... it was full of brass from pump gears that gave out. If that got into the engine... it would have caused a lot of other issues.

As far as I know... the Flightworks and the AMT pumps use hardened steel gears, so they should last longer.

Since I've now seen this first hand... I will not run a turbine without a filter after the pump and valve.


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Old 12-14-2011, 08:10 AM
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Default RE: Talk to me about fuel filters

It makes no difference on the size of the engine. We had an inflight shut down on a citation 3 TFE731 turbo fan engine because of the engine driven fuel pump starting to let go sent metal down stream clogging the FCU. I would always use a filter after the pump.
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Old 12-14-2011, 11:06 AM
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Default RE: Talk to me about fuel filters

Thanks for your replies chaps. I am looking to use a Jet Munts VT80 and the manual only shows installation with a festo (style) filter before the pump, nothing between the pump and the turbine. That is unless the VT80 has a built in filter hidden inside the front of the unit with the ECU etc. I think I will rely on the CAT filter on the low pressure side and then a Kavan filter between the pump and the turbine.
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