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  1. #26

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    RE: Lithium Ion batteries


    ORIGINAL: FILE IFR

    ORIGINAL: FenderBean

    I think ions are safe and will not worry one bit about mine.

    Now if that is not a troll post, then I don't know what is.
    What is it with you? Do you have to attack anyone who makes a comment that you feel is different from yours? Inotice that you do that a lot. The guy voiced his opinion, that's all! Don't get your panties in a wad!

    Is it your time of the month?
    Sincerity ... Once you are able to fake that, there will be no stopping you.


  2. #27

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    RE: Lithium Ion batteries


    ORIGINAL: tsymonds

    Fender,

    Did it ever occur to you that nearly every thread you post in turns into a pissing match between you and everyone else? I figured with your self implied Apache IP superiority you would have been able to figure out that the common denominator is you. You say your open to discussion but it always seems to be an open discussion as long as it's your way being the better one. I don't post here much at all but read a lot and can honestly say seeing you leave the forum will probably help the rest of us out a lot. BTW is there anything left of your F-16 to grind off or is all in the DustBuster already?
    The only thing I notice is that the "in' crowd of jet girls want to echo their self-imposed egos and rhetoric amongst themselves without being challenged. So they immediately go on the attack if anyone newhas ideas of their own. This sickens me, and any on-lookers to no end. It's not the money that keeps some people away from jets ... It's the ignorance and cattiness of many of the jet 'girls' that keep new people away. Who in their right mind wants to be a part of that, or associated with the BS!

    Yes, I fly jets, both real and these toys. I would never treat or talk to anyone in the manner I see here.
    Sincerity ... Once you are able to fake that, there will be no stopping you.


  3. #28

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    RE: Lithium Ion batteries

    + 1

  4. #29
    MrQweeksdraw's Avatar
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    RE: Lithium Ion batteries

    Well,whew. If the government says so it must be true.
    My mission is to comfort the afflicted and afflict the comfortable.

  5. #30
    eddieC's Avatar
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    RE: Lithium Ion batteries



    Stknrud, your quote:
    Lithium-ion batteries are somewhat different. They can exhibit the same thermal runaway as lithium metal batteries, but the FAA says Halon 1301 is capable of suppressing lithium-ion battery fires."  
    Following text is from : http://www.fire.tc.faa.gov/pdf/10-31.pdf
    The results from these tests confirmed that Halon 1301 is effective at suppressing open flames from lithium-ion cells in thermal runaway. The halon, as expected, was totally ineffective at stopping the progression of cell-to-cell thermal runaway. Even in the presence of Halon 1301, all cells in the shipment were consumed. Data was collected showing the propagation rate between adjacent cells as well as cell temperature while in thermal runaway.  
    While Halon can extinguish the open flames, it cannot stop the thermal runaway which is much more destructive.

    We conducted an experiment at our field with a 3S 2100 pack that was damaged in a crash (bent, but otherwise uncompromised). Cells were shorted with pliers, ignition occurred in about 3 seconds. Pack 'vented with flames', a Halon extinguisher was used to extinguish the fire. While it knocked out the visible fire, the cells continues to vent and produce much black/grey smoke. The extinguishing was in open air.  Extinguisher was exhausted in about 20 seconds, cells continued to smoke and produce small flames. The thermal runaway event was not stopped. Cells were consumed.

    While stopping flames for Halon is significant, it does nothing for the thermal event itself.



    I might not be very good, but I'm fun to watch!

  6. #31
    Moderator j.duncker's Avatar
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    RE: Lithium Ion batteries

    Hey guys keep it polite please!

    I don't want to have to wade in here deleting stuff right left and centre.
    The dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act their dreams with open eyes, to make it possible.

  7. #32

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    RE: Lithium Ion batteries

    EddieC,

    Now you agree! You used the results of a test on Lithium Metal batteries to say Halon was not effective on the fire and declare my post wrong. The use of Halon on both tests and the results were with respect to FIRE..not the chemical reaction. Halon works on the FIRE from Ion...not Metal which is what I quoted.




    ORIGINAL: eddieC



    Stknrud, your quote:
    Lithium-ion batteries are somewhat different. They can exhibit the same thermal runaway as lithium metal batteries, but the FAA says Halon 1301 is capable of suppressing lithium-ion battery fires.''Β*Β*
    Following text is from : http://www.fire.tc.faa.gov/pdf/10-31.pdf
    The results from these tests confirmed that Halon 1301 is effective at suppressing open flames from lithium-ion cells in thermal runaway. The halon, as expected, was totally ineffective at stopping the progression of cell-to-cell thermal runaway. Even in the presence of Halon 1301, all cells in the shipment were consumed. Data was collected showing the propagation rate between adjacent cells as well as cell temperature while in thermal runaway.Β*Β*
    While Halon can extinguish the open flames, it cannot stop the thermal runaway which is much more destructive.

    We conducted an experiment at our field with a 3S 2100 pack that was damaged in a crash (bent, but otherwise uncompromised). Cells were shorted with pliers, ignition occurred in about 3 seconds. Pack 'vented with flames', a Halon extinguisher was used to extinguish the fire. While it knocked out the visible fire, the cells continues to vent and produce much black/grey smoke. The extinguishingΒ*was in open air. Β*Extinguisher was exhausted in about 20 seconds, cells continued to smoke and produce small flames. The thermal runaway event was not stopped. Cells were consumed.

    While stopping flames for HalonΒ*is significant, it does nothing for the thermal event itself.



    I didn\'\'\'\'t say it was the plane\'\'\'\'s fault. I said I was blaming the plane.

  8. #33
    eddieC's Avatar
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    RE: Lithium Ion batteries

    Stknrud,

    So it's most important that someone agree with you?

    I'm NOT agreeing, and not trying to agree or not, just trying to correct your misrepresentation.

    My point is Halon is ultimately ineffective on ALL Lithiium fires. Misleading to state otherwise. The thermal runaway can't be stopped, but can be suppressed by copious amounts of sand.
    I might not be very good, but I'm fun to watch!

  9. #34

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    RE: Lithium Ion batteries

    EddieC

    Your quote: "That's incorrect...." Halon 1301 is ineffective in suppressing a lithium battery fire."

    I don't think I was misrepresenting anything... You simply quoted the results from Metal Lithium to declare my statement as "incorrect". Neither you nor David noted the distinction between the tests on Metal versus Ion Lithium batteries that was contained in same test you were both quoting from to make the statement that Halon was ineffective.

    I didn\'\'\'\'t say it was the plane\'\'\'\'s fault. I said I was blaming the plane.

  10. #35
    FILE IFR 's Avatar
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    RE: Lithium Ion batteries

    ORIGINAL: BobbyMcGee


    ORIGINAL: FILE IFR

    ORIGINAL: FenderBean

    I think ions are safe and will not worry one bit about mine.

    Now if that is not a troll post, then I don't know what is.
    What is it with you? Do you have to attack anyone who makes a comment that you feel is different from yours? IΒ*notice that you do that a lot. The guy voiced his opinion, that's all! Don't get your panties in a wad![img][/img]

    Is it your time of the month?
    That's too bad for you MaGee.
    If you didn't like it, you shouldn't have read the whole post.

    ... It's as simple as that.

    Mike * Intercepting The Localizer* AMA# 365566
    Bud Nosen C-310 Club #32 * J.P.O. Member 2302

  11. #36
    VF84sluggo's Avatar
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    RE: Lithium Ion batteries


    ORIGINAL: j.duncker
    I don't want to have to wade in here deleting stuff right left and centre.
    I'm still looking for the "centre"...
    The FAA is nothing more than a carbuncle on the ass of progress and has set aviation back at least 20 years - William "Bill" P. Lear, of Lear Jet fame


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