Ground Collision at BITW 2013
01-11-2014, 09:13 AM
#178
The lawyer should be ashamed of himself for attempting to take this frivolous matter into litigation. Were has common sense gone? Small claims court is the furthest it could go. Warning about "punitive" damages... LOL.
01-11-2014, 09:49 AM
#179
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I'm an American who spends a lot of time in other countries as part of my job. Every country has it's issues ... as you learn when you really get to know people. But you have to admit, we in America seem to have a corner on litigation ... and it sucks. As much as I love this country, I've got to side with the Aussies and Brits on this one.
Greg
Greg
Last edited by essyou35; 01-11-2014 at 09:52 AM.
01-11-2014, 10:42 AM
#181
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Regards,
Gus
01-11-2014, 10:50 AM
#182
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I'm not an expert jet pilot but I would consider myself a very well educated jet spectator having been to many, many events, flying some and watching a lot more. All the pilots I know and hang with would have been very cognizant of the impending landing and would have gone out of their way to either remain at the end of the runway until absolutely sure it was clear to taxi back or stuck to the edge of the runway to leave the maximum amount of room available for other aircraft to land, emergency or not, another plane on final or not. IMO the accident didn't happen until the two planes hit and you have to ask "which one shouldn't have been there", period. Forget the F-22 possibly taking another go-round or landing earlier or one of them staying home that day or never being born, the accident occurred when one plane that should have been held up at the end of the runway or on the side, was in-fact ON THE CENTERLINE taxiing back. I don't see why this is so difficult to call or why the nasty back-and-forth is even occurring.
As for honoring the agreement, I am split on that, the other guy isn't deserving of that agreement being honored given the way he's acted and his refusal to pretty much accept full responsibility (the lawyer really doesn't help his case either, all we need is more litigation in our hobby!) but at this point I think actually coming through on the agreement, despite most agreeing he shouldn't makes him the bigger man, sets a great example and maybe will make the other guy realize he's simply acting like a child here and is quite frankly the cause of the accident...
Jack
As for honoring the agreement, I am split on that, the other guy isn't deserving of that agreement being honored given the way he's acted and his refusal to pretty much accept full responsibility (the lawyer really doesn't help his case either, all we need is more litigation in our hobby!) but at this point I think actually coming through on the agreement, despite most agreeing he shouldn't makes him the bigger man, sets a great example and maybe will make the other guy realize he's simply acting like a child here and is quite frankly the cause of the accident...
Jack
01-11-2014, 11:00 AM
#183
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8WYIqMIRwAQ
this brings back one particular memory from FL jets years ago ... in this case it was mismanagement by the ground crew and spotters when the euro was allowed to taxi onto the runway as i was coming in for landing. I did not become aware of the euro until it came into my view .. lol
~V~
~V~
01-11-2014, 11:26 AM
#184
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8WYIqMIRwAQ
this brings back one particular memory from FL jets years ago ... in this case it was mismanagement by the ground crew and spotters when the euro was allowed to taxi onto the runway as i was coming in for landing. I did not become aware of the euro until it came into my view .. lol
~V~
~V~
Are we going to see you at farview this year?
01-11-2014, 11:34 AM
#185
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OK I’ll keep this short, given what I do for a living, dealing with near misses, runway incursions, and general air and flight line rage and the law suits that arise from them. If this case was on my docket I would dismiss the case involving the model aircraft and severely lecture both parties about wasting the court’s time and resources and that they should be happy that no one was injured or worse. I would further instruct the bailiff to detain Mr. Ron Regwan and his client until a complete investigation into the attempted extortion / blackmail charges could be finished. Having read the letter sent to Barry, I believe that any average first year law student could successfully prosecute and win the case against Mr. Regwan.
This is just my informed opinion.
This is just my informed opinion.
01-11-2014, 11:38 AM
#186
, not hobby accidents/mistakes, even if it is someones fault or not... On that landing I realized the bobcats can "drift" lol .. I started going 180 drifts on landings, and my tires would be pretty much square after a few dozzen and the plan would rumble/wobble around until i put on new tires
. I will be at all the Farview events this year. Our new baby daughter kept things very busy last year, and starting up All-Scale Models took a lot of time and energy as well. This year there will be more play time for me ~V~
Last edited by wojtek; 01-11-2014 at 11:41 AM.
01-11-2014, 11:56 AM
#187
What he said on the previous post.
Seriously, who in the world allowed this modeler to fly jets in a busy environment where it is understood by all the participants that at any time an urgency to land may happen, it is so obvious to all model jet pilots that at any moment specially at an event someone is going to need to land ASAP.
Does this modeler understans his responsabilities to safety when operating a model jet? They were fortunate to come out of that unharmed.
Seriously, who in the world allowed this modeler to fly jets in a busy environment where it is understood by all the participants that at any time an urgency to land may happen, it is so obvious to all model jet pilots that at any moment specially at an event someone is going to need to land ASAP.
Does this modeler understans his responsabilities to safety when operating a model jet? They were fortunate to come out of that unharmed.
Last edited by CARS II; 01-11-2014 at 12:05 PM.
01-11-2014, 01:53 PM
#188
It has been along time since I flew the real ones. This is what I remember. No matter who said what, once the runway is clear the airplane on final has the right of way. The airplane that has just cleared the runway may not move back onto the runway. This is called a runway incursion. 10,000 buck fine in the real world. This same logic should apply.
01-11-2014, 03:04 PM
#189
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01-11-2014, 05:55 PM
#192
I'd give him his wing back. Fill it with epoxy and beat him senseless with it.
He he is banned from any event I host for sure. I hope comp ARF will see how risky it is to conduct business with this person, their reckless actions and corrosive behave toward this hobby and refuse to sell any parts or airplanes.
Rcu members.....blacklist!
He he is banned from any event I host for sure. I hope comp ARF will see how risky it is to conduct business with this person, their reckless actions and corrosive behave toward this hobby and refuse to sell any parts or airplanes.
Rcu members.....blacklist!
01-11-2014, 06:57 PM
#195
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Landing aircraft only have the right away in a declared emergency. You don't have the right to hit someone already on the runway just because you are landing. It is the responsibility of the spotter/pilot to ensure the runway is clear before they land. In our case the spotter because the pilot can't see it. Did the viper know the F22 was on fumes? Ie emergency. With that being said it sounds like the viper was not on the runway and then came back on. That is the key. Viper on the runway, F22 fault. Viper offthe runway and told to hold and then returns to the runway during an active landing, viper fault.
01-11-2014, 07:45 PM
#196
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Based on the above account, I'm afraid I find fault with the F22 pilot for 1.) landing with another aircraft on the runway, and 2.) not calling out "Landing". I also find fault with your spotter for not telling you the position of the Viper.
I also find fault with Viper crew for not calling out , "on the runway" when the airplane was removed from the rough and placed back onto the runway. This obviously took place prior to your landing.
The F22 crew had the last opportunity to avoid the accident. Therefor the majority of the responsibility is with the F22 pilot/spotter.
I am not associated/affiliated with either party in this case. My opinion is base solely on your account.
I also find fault with Viper crew for not calling out , "on the runway" when the airplane was removed from the rough and placed back onto the runway. This obviously took place prior to your landing.
The F22 crew had the last opportunity to avoid the accident. Therefor the majority of the responsibility is with the F22 pilot/spotter.
I am not associated/affiliated with either party in this case. My opinion is base solely on your account.
Unfortunately the above analysis is more right than not. The spotter failed the pilot twice. First in not loudly and clearly declaring "LANDING!" (which should have been event #5 and would have satisfied David Gladwin's comments more clearly) which secures the runway in most model and rider scale flying and secondly by taking his eyes off the other aircrew who were violating commonly accepted radio controlled model aircraft procedures. When OFF the runway, it is that pilots responsibility to insure all others know exactly what he/she is doing and to wait until no aircraft are on final before entering the runway with body or plane.
Don't let the shark eat...fix the wing and send it back and share ALL of the details of this entire incident far and wide, they have already been documented.
01-11-2014, 08:08 PM
#197
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Unfortunately the above analysis is more right than not. The spotter failed the pilot twice. First in not loudly and clearly declaring "LANDING!" (which should have been event #5 and would have satisfied David Gladwin's comments more clearly) which secures the runway in most model and rider scale flying and secondly by taking his eyes off the other aircrew who were violating commonly accepted radio controlled model aircraft procedures. When OFF the runway, it is that pilots responsibility to insure all others know exactly what he/she is doing and to wait until no aircraft are on final before entering the runway with body or plane.
Don't let the shark eat...fix the wing and send it back and share ALL of the details of this entire incident far and wide, they have already been documented.
Don't let the shark eat...fix the wing and send it back and share ALL of the details of this entire incident far and wide, they have already been documented.
01-11-2014, 09:02 PM
#198
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Just another example of some individuals only caring about themselves. It is painfully obvious that this extremely self-centered individual with the Viper cares little about others. I mean, think about it.......every single person I've ever flown with is aware of their surroundings and would NEVER do something as careless and inconsiderate as taxiing back down the centerline of the runway when he KNOWS someone is landing and low on fuel. Dude has no business flying jet aircraft, let alone a foam trainer. At least if he hits someone with that foamy it won't hurt as much.
