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Masking Tape and Painting Help Please!

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Old 04-15-2014, 08:47 AM
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ravill
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Default Masking Tape and Painting Help Please!

So I've decided since I'm putting so much working in building my F-100, why not give painting a go?

I have big questions for all you painting gurus out there!

What masking tape? Can you please post a pic?

And PLEASE, where to get it?!

I'm going to make a paint booth with my EZ up in my back yard. I will use that clear plastic for the walls and floor and have a square fan pushing air OUT of the booth. Eye, nose and bunny suit protection ofcourse as well. I plan on using a mix of my airbrush and trusty ole rustoleum when appropriate!

Any tips will be appreciated as well!

First tip I saw right here on RCU:

1. Spray clear, or the previous color, on the masking tape line to "seal" the edges before applying a color.

Here is my color scheme. Mr. Wright, your F-100 is fantastic! I won't be doing flite metal though, I'm too rough when I transport my jets.

Old 04-15-2014, 08:54 AM
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Raf- Its called HVN models. Best you can buy.Surrender to the dark side. Scotty

Seriously, if you are insisting in banging your cranium with a brick:
1-3M fine line tape-The green for straighter lines
2-The blue vinyl for curves.
3-Make sure you run your finger nail down the edges to seal the edge.(or use a burnishing stick)
4-If you are using any 2 part paint you MUST use an air fed respirator -the canister type just make the poision smell better.
5-In you booth right before you start to paint spray a piece of cardboard with the paint -this sometimes attracts some of the dust to that surface via static electricity.
6-ALWAYS wear gloves wheneve you touch the model after cleaning. ("liberate" some from work)
7- Call HVN models.

Last edited by GSR; 04-15-2014 at 09:03 AM.
Old 04-15-2014, 08:56 AM
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ravill
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Hi Scotty!

Ha! I had to google that! LOL!

Yeah, I'll go to Henry if I mess it up too bad!

But since I'm doing all the work, why not feel the full pride of building this beast if I can!
Old 04-15-2014, 09:36 AM
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Originally Posted by GSR
Raf- Its called HVN models. Best you can buy.Surrender to the dark side. Scotty

Seriously, if you are insisting in banging your cranium with a brick:
1-3M fine line tape-The green for straighter lines
2-The blue vinyl for curves.
3-Make sure you run your finger nail down the edges to seal the edge.(or use a burnishing stick)
4-If you are using any 2 part paint you MUST use an air fed respirator -the canister type just make the poision smell better.
5-In you booth right before you start to paint spray a piece of cardboard with the paint -this sometimes attracts some of the dust to that surface via static electricity.
6-ALWAYS wear gloves wheneve you touch the model after cleaning. ("liberate" some from work)
7- Call HVN models.
Scotty, can you post some pics of those masking tapes please? Can you find them easily, say at homedepot or your average hobby shop?
Old 04-15-2014, 09:57 AM
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rcjets_63
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Rav,

You are overthinking it. All you need is some good old fashioned masking tape or painter's blue masking tape available from any Home Depot/Lowes, Sherwin Williams, or other paint store. If you have a bunch of curves, you can get some 3M fine line tape (3/16 or 1/4 wide) or blue vinyl tape which is typically available at auto paint stores. These tapes are plastic and can easily bend in gentle curves. After putting it down on the plane, you can use the masking tape over it to mask off a wider area.

Spraying the edges isn't necessary, just run your finger nail or a burnishing tool down the edge. Try not to angle the spray gun to blow the paint directly into the masked edge.

When all else fails, call Henry. It's easier.

Here is a link to the blue vinyl tape: http://3mcollision.com/products/tape...lue-36405.html

Link to 3M fine line tape: http://www.uline.com/BL_6096/3M-218-...e-Masking-Tape

Regards,

Jim
Old 04-15-2014, 10:04 AM
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ravill
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Originally Posted by rcjets_63

.....

When all else fails, call Henry. It's easier.

Here is a link to the blue vinyl tape: http://3mcollision.com/products/tape...lue-36405.html

Link to 3M fine line tape: http://www.uline.com/BL_6096/3M-218-...e-Masking-Tape

......


I talked to Henry in January and I quote: "Yeah, I'll make it so pretty you won't wanna fly it. If I can fit you in."

LOL!

Thanks for those links and the tips Jim. And for the reality check.
Old 04-15-2014, 10:14 AM
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JackD
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I will help you... we paint your plane and go surfing (or backwards)
Old 04-15-2014, 10:40 AM
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Hey Raf,


What paint system do you plan to use (automotive? Hobby?) I use all PPG just because that is what I was taught. Anyway, one of the first things you need to figure out is where to buy the paint. I have not tried mail order so I buy the stuff from a local person (auto paint jobber). They will have a lot of the stuff you need, basically all of it. My average stop in there costs US$350 BTW. Just consumables (paint, reducers, cleaners, tape, paper, tack rags, buckets, etc) will run maybe 500-750 on your plane?


Do you have a paint gun? Compressor? Lights?

BTW that tip of spraying clear around the tape before color can help but I use an airbrush to go over it.

Get one of these gizmos for sure
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Old 04-15-2014, 10:44 AM
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Raf-Dont even think about using the 3M blue painters tape (like you would get at home depot) for anythingother than gross coverage. (use it to hold the paper over the fine line tapes) If you try and get a fine line with it you wont like the results. S
Old 04-15-2014, 10:47 AM
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Originally Posted by JackD
I will help you... we paint your plane and go surfing (or backwards)
Lets do it then! Don't forget a good motorcycle ride or a lil dirt-biking! Ha! LOL!
Old 04-15-2014, 11:09 AM
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Ravil,
Personal opinion, Exhaust fans cause more problem than anything I know in a paint booth. If you force the air out, where does it come from? it comes from leaks, most of the time near the floor or ground, where the dust is. I have painted several antique autos at home and I have always had better luck forcing " filtered" air into the paint booth. I really don't care where it goes after that, but I like high volume low speed filtered air in my booth My recommendation is to build you a filter pack around the inlet of your fan, A home heating return air filter will work fine. seal the fan/ filter to a wall on your booth. and let the air escape where it will ( you can cut some slits in the plastic to help if necessary. This really keeps the dust down . Also wet the floor of the booth before you paint. Other than plenty of light and very close monitoring of your temperature and you are ready to go.
other hints
1 never dry sand anything. always wet sand. this keeps the dust from blowing out of the cracks and corners
2 always wear gloves
3 don't alow any silicone spray, ( wd40) or anything similar in the same area you are spraying
4 wash parts with one of the " prep-sols" available, even denatured alcohol works great for final cleaning ( always wear gloves)
5 if you are using a two part paint check the temperature recommendations for the reducer you are using. follow the mfgs recommendations ( always wear gloves)
6 do not touch the part with your bare hands did I mention, always wear gloves. lol
7 Whatever paint you decide to use, stay with the same manufacturer for everything.
8 practice painting on some disposable pieces to learn the correct air pressure/paint flow/distance from part/and spraying speed ratios
BTW I use sign vinyl for my fine edge masking following up with regular masking tape and masking paper This allows me to cut sharp turns instead of bending the tape. Do not use plastic sheeting for masking paper. The dryed paint will not stick to the plastic and will blow off on your part ( ask me how I know)
There is really nothing to painting, however getting ready to paint is a real pain and where 90% of the work is.
Just my opinions but maybe some things to think about

Glenn
Old 04-15-2014, 11:35 AM
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I love those tips!

Filtered air in...

Wet the floors....

Paint a piece of cardboard first....

And all the PPG stuff, thinning, two parts, cleaning guns in between shooting....etc, etc....ugh....

Ok, I'll put myself on the firing line. Confession time.

I've been testing with rustoleum metallic paints with all sorts of paints, white gloss underneath, black gloss underneath, clear coat, no clear coat, different types of masking tapes, on these extra parts.



I have to admit, I've been liking the results so far. Dust has been the worst part. But I haven't tried in my ad-hoc paint booth.

No, it doesn't look like flite metal, no it doesn't look like metal kote.

But I don't want to spend thousands on paint, paint gun, etc.....

I'll wet sand a bit, mask off, use my airbrush with a compressor (I already own these) especially on the "hot section", I'm even going to build a little paint booth, but a "top gun" paint job... I ain't got in me.

Know thyself.

And I know I'll get too frustrated with all the equipment to do a PPG, top gun style of paint job.

Ok, shoot me now, I'm ready.

Old 04-15-2014, 11:51 AM
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Raf, Finishmasters around the Bay Area have 3M green tapes in 1/8" and 1/4" widths that are great for masking lines and not expensive. There is one in San Carlos. -> 1021 Howard Ave, San Carlos, CA ‎
I highly recommend these tapes. They make a sweet line. Then use any other masking tape for covering what you don't want painted.

And if you decide to shoot PPG with catalyst you should get a fresh air respirator.

Last edited by dbsonic; 04-15-2014 at 11:54 AM.
Old 04-15-2014, 12:10 PM
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Originally Posted by rcjets_63
Rav,

You are overthinking it. All you need is some good old fashioned masking tape or painter's blue masking tape available from any Home Depot/Lowes, Sherwin Williams, or other paint store. If you have a bunch of curves, you can get some 3M fine line tape (3/16 or 1/4 wide) or blue vinyl tape which is typically available at auto paint stores. These tapes are plastic and can easily bend in gentle curves. After putting it down on the plane, you can use the masking tape over it to mask off a wider area.

Spraying the edges isn't necessary, just run your finger nail or a burnishing tool down the edge. Try not to angle the spray gun to blow the paint directly into the masked edge.

When all else fails, call Henry. It's easier.

Here is a link to the blue vinyl tape: http://3mcollision.com/products/tape...lue-36405.html

Link to 3M fine line tape: http://www.uline.com/BL_6096/3M-218-...e-Masking-Tape

Regards,

Jim
Ex-automotive re-finisher here.....

PLEASE, PLEASE,PLEASE DO NOT USE REGULAR MASKING TAPE!!!!!

Regular masking tape by 3M, HD, Lowes and the like are crepe paper cored. This means that they have an upper and lower skin, and the center crepe is accordion folded between. Think of corrugated cardboard, same concept. These are ok (not great) for Latex type paints, but not at all suitable for Urethane or any solvent based paints. The paint will seep underneath it! It should never be used to mask a direct paint line. The others linked (3M blue & green fineline) are what you want to use for that purpose. Regular masking tape is for covering holes and holding paper in place.
Old 04-15-2014, 12:14 PM
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Originally Posted by dbsonic
Raf, Finishmasters around the Bay Area have 3M green tapes in 1/8" and 1/4" widths that are great for masking lines and not expensive. There is one in San Carlos. -> 1021 Howard Ave, San Carlos, CA ‎
I highly recommend these tapes. They make a sweet line. Then use any other masking tape for covering what you don't want painted.

And if you decide to shoot PPG with catalyst you should get a fresh air respirator.
This.....
Old 04-15-2014, 12:22 PM
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This thread has made me appreciate even more that I have a good friend who paints well. Maybe you should paint a bobcat or something before that gorgeous F100?
Old 04-15-2014, 01:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Lownverted
Ex-automotive re-finisher here.....

PLEASE, PLEASE,PLEASE DO NOT USE REGULAR MASKING TAPE!!!!!

Regular masking tape by 3M, HD, Lowes and the like are crepe paper cored. This means that they have an upper and lower skin, and the center crepe is accordion folded between. Think of corrugated cardboard, same concept. These are ok (not great) for Latex type paints, but not at all suitable for Urethane or any solvent based paints. The paint will seep underneath it! It should never be used to mask a direct paint line. The others linked (3M blue & green fineline) are what you want to use for that purpose. Regular masking tape is for covering holes and holding paper in place.
I agree that the fine line tape does a nice job with the edges but it does have some limitations particularly when overlapping. It is possible to get a nice line with masking tape but you have to be careful. Henry showed me how to do it without getting seepage and he must have done a good job as that particular plane finished 2nd at Top Gun last year. I just finished painting the white wingtips on my Rafale a couple of weeks ago with urethane paint and didn't get seepage. I don't doubt your skills as a car painter. Maybe we just don't put as much paint on planes. Spraying towards the edge (rather than over it) will tend to result in seepage. Not trying to get in a flame war here; I also use 3M tape in some areas.

I guess that the take-away here is to test your method on a spare piece, not the plane!

Regards,

Jim
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Old 04-15-2014, 01:41 PM
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Be careful using newspaper for masking.

If the overspray landing on it is 'dusty' it will be ok but if the paint
builds up on it the paint solvents can activate the ink which can
bleed through onto the underlying surface of your model. - John.
Old 04-15-2014, 01:41 PM
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I've had great success with this brand and type. Haven't pulled up a flake of paint using it..
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Old 04-15-2014, 01:51 PM
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Originally Posted by dbsonic
Raf, Finishmasters around the Bay Area have 3M green tapes in 1/8" and 1/4" widths that are great for masking lines and not expensive. There is one in San Carlos. -> 1021 Howard Ave, San Carlos, CA ‎
I highly recommend these tapes. They make a sweet line. Then use any other masking tape for covering what you don't want painted.

And if you decide to shoot PPG with catalyst you should get a fresh air respirator.
Thanks Darren, I'll go after work today.

Originally Posted by DrScoles
This thread has made me appreciate even more that I have a good friend who paints well. Maybe you should paint a bobcat or something before that gorgeous F100?
I'm gonna give it the good ole college try. If I fail, I'll grab my ankles and give it to Henry.

Originally Posted by Boomerang1
Be careful using newspaper for masking.

If the overspray landing on it is 'dusty' it will be ok but if the paint
builds up on it the paint solvents can activate the ink which can
bleed through onto the underlying surface of your model. - John.
Thanks for that heads up. I've used newspapers lots of times with various paint projects, but haven't had that problem. I'll keep an eye on it.


Originally Posted by Radical Departure

I've had great success with this brand and type. Haven't pulled up a flake of paint using it..
Looks great and thanks for the pic! I'll look for a roll and give it a try.
Old 04-15-2014, 02:11 PM
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Originally Posted by rcjets_63
I agree that the fine line tape does a nice job with the edges but it does have some limitations particularly when overlapping. It is possible to get a nice line with masking tape but you have to be careful. Henry showed me how to do it without getting seepage and he must have done a good job as that particular plane finished 2nd at Top Gun last year. I just finished painting the white wingtips on my Rafale a couple of weeks ago with urethane paint and didn't get seepage. I don't doubt your skills as a car painter. Maybe we just don't put as much paint on planes. Spraying towards the edge (rather than over it) will tend to result in seepage. Not trying to get in a flame war here; I also use 3M tape in some areas.

I guess that the take-away here is to test your method on a spare piece, not the plane!

Regards,

Jim
Jim,

You probably hit the nail on the head. It can be made to work with light coats, unlike painting a car. However, with a first time painter, I still wouldn't recommend it.
Old 04-15-2014, 02:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Boomerang1
Be careful using newspaper for masking.

If the overspray landing on it is 'dusty' it will be ok but if the paint
builds up on it the paint solvents can activate the ink which can
bleed through onto the underlying surface of your model. - John.
Just to add, there are also holes in the edge that will let overspray through...
Old 04-15-2014, 02:12 PM
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Ravil
Good to see you are getting some good tips here. I agree with most of these. Never use regular masking tape for the paint edge. Use the fine line 3m tape for that then use the regular masking tape for the paper. Also never use Newspaper for masking , Boomerang is 100 percent correct. The paint will penetrate the newspaper and either soften the ink or transfer the paint. Masking paper is cheap , which is good, cause you need a lot of it. lol Try Home Depot.
Now to paint. As I said in previous post, there is not much to painting, the work is in the prep. regardless of what type paint you use or its cost. The work, filling, sanding, cleaning, masking , etc is the same regardless of the paint you use, So my recommendation is to use the best paint you can afford. You will soon forget the cost of the paint but not the results.
PPG makes an excellent two part paint called " Concept" that requires no clear coat. Two coats and your done. However it is expensive. They used to make another called " Omni" that was much less expensive and almost as good. It does not require clear coat either.
Dupont, makes some exceptionaly good paint also their Nason line is not that expensive and many O"Reilly auto parts stores sell it and will mix to order.
As to Paint guns. The last car I painted " just front fenders" I used a cheap " Trim" gun I bought at harbor freight for less that $50. The cup holds about 8 oz which is more than you will ever need. The beauty is the spray is adjustable from round to flat which can be pretty handy when trying to keep a " wet edge" to your painting. My airbrush does not have this feature.
Another hint, Don't use a rattle can auto primer and then two part paint over it. It may look good when you paint but over time the primer will dry more and shrink leaving all your sanding marks showing through the finish. Again don't ask how I know. lol
experiment with air pressures , paint flows and reducer , to get the best coating.
I only have experience with conventional spray guns and know nothing about hvlp ( high volume low pressure) painting techniques.
In any event, keep us posted on your results and " Good Luck"

Glenn
Old 04-15-2014, 02:42 PM
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The primer is a good point. If you go with automotive urethanes then go with a urethane primer. I like the Transtar 2:1 white urethane primer....some good stuff and Omni goes great over top... now if I could find a nice water based clear that doesn't use isocyanate based catalyst I would be set.
Old 04-15-2014, 03:47 PM
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Hi ya Raf. Good call to paint your Hun. You will really “own” this jet when it’s done. And I reckon you will make a good job of the finish, just like you have of the build. Painting is really not so difficult if it’s approached in a methodical manner, and you have some patience.

My paint experience is limited to sport finishes, which is a bit different to a scale finish, but the principals are the same. (I’m hoping). I use automotive base coat/clear cote systems, (similar to PPG) which gives a fantastic extremely high gloss finish.

Lots of good advice above, a couple of things I will add.

1) Don’t sand through BVMs grey gel coat finish where ever possible!!!
2) Use the best tools and materials you can afford (or borrow).
3) Don’t be too critical of your own work. YOU will see every single blemish, dust spot and orange peel ripple. No one else will!!! If you get caught up trying to achieve a perfect finish, you will never get done.
4) Once the paint has been applied, especially the clear coat, WALK AWAY. For at least 48 hours or longer..
5) Preparation is the hard part.

I don’t use a spray booth and paint inside, except the clear coat which is done outside on a still day. I hang parts to keep surfaces vertical which I think helps reduce dust. Photos of fine line tape with 3M masking tape to seal it to the masking paper, or vinyl.

Painting is fun.. Really.

BTW, what the hell are those dogs doing???

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