Joe Westrich

My Feedback: (95)

Has anyone compared the cortex and the new 3e? It looks like Powerbox wants a piece of the Cortex action. Besides price, I cannot see a difference. Anyone using a 3e?

siclick33

They are different and it is probably worth downloading both manuals to compare their capabilities. It is hard for me to comment without being impartial but here are a few things that I have picked up during a very quick glance at the igyro3e's web page:

• Cortex has serial input - igyro3e doesn't appear to.
• Cortex can be used with just Spektrum/JR remote receivers with no 'main' RX required.
• igyro3e may require button presses to set up whereas the Cortex just uses a bind plug and a simple TX setup routine for even the most complicated configurations.
• 5 channels can be stabilised with the Cortex on any axis. The igyro3e appears to have pre-defined stabilised outputs (e.g. 2 aileron, 2 elevator and 1 rudder?).
• The igyro3e is cheaper

I've had a look at the igyro3e manual and it is a little unclear in places. For example, their webpage says that it can be installed in any direction whereas the instructions say that it should be installed in the 'standard orientation shown'. The web page also mentions integral delta and v-tail mixers but the manual doesn't mention these or say how to set them up.

I'm not sure what fine tuning is available in the Powerbox Terminal software but it's worth a look to see what it can do compared to the Bavarian Demon software (it could be better or worse - I don't know).

I'm sure the igyro3e will be a good product, as is the Cortex, but there are differences between the 2 and what suits one person/application might not suit another.


EDITED TO ADD: The igyro3e 'manual' I refer to is actually just the quickstart guide so info on the Powerbox unit may become more clear when the full manual is released.

Len Todd

I was looking at several of these. Obviously the PB 3e is a lot cheaper. But it is not available yet. The Cortex looks a bit more refined. But I like the top access of the PB. I am going to wait on this for a while. I would like to come up with something similar for the Checkmate.

CraigG

My Feedback: (40)

The Bavarian Cortex has been "in the field" for over a year and there is a lot of experience and knowledge about it's operation and reliability. As importantly, they have a robust group of helpful reps who are available here on RCU and at most of the bigger jet-flys. Both of those factors go a long way for me to favor the Cortex.

Pepperpete

The fact that I've never needed help from the helpful reps on the cortex speaks volumes to me. It's dead simple to use. It works flawlessly. Nuff said.

Joe Westrich

My Feedback: (95)

Yes, I know the cortex is very easy to use and set up. I own two of them.

I was just curious to see what PB had in their version.

Thanks siclick for the insight. I do like the bind and radio program setup on the cortex vs a push button programming. I also like the fact that the cortex doesn't define the servo to a specific control. If I could add to the cortex... I would like 6 undefined channels. It would be nicer for a dual rudder jet.

lightningmcnulty

My Feedback: (11)

I have 4 cortex's right now and I love them but after seeing the igyro version I figured i'd order one and see how it is so I should get one in december and i'll let you guys know what I think, i'm really interested to see what the misc opening does, maybe its for the second rudder?!

Kim

heraldoboldrin

Igyro3E has 2 modes, heading mode off Range A, and in Range B heading mode on for elevator and aileron.. can someone explain the difference in flight please?

BarracudaHockey

My Feedback: (11)

Heading mode will correct and stay there till you move the stick and tell it otherwise. Say you roll inverted and establish your line, it should stay there.

Normal mode, if the plane wants to arc toward the ground inverted like most do, normal mode won't stop it. It will be smooth and controllable and unperturbed by gusts, but it will eventually arc over unless you hold some down elevator.

erbroens

My opinion : Cortex and Igyro.. both good, and its all up to you how do you set up them.

Heraldo:

Regular rate works like a damper, this means the gyro reacting to angular changes in the airplane, filtrating quick movements of the airplane caused by gusts and turbulence. This mode is the one I like because it only filtrates this undesired oscillations that naturally occur in smaller models, or in the big ones in windy days.

The heading hold mode is different because there is a software algorithm included in wich the gyro "remembers" the position the airplane was and fights back to return it to the original position.. this is often used to do hovering, knife edge passes and slow rolls without any input of the pilot at all.

I dont like this mode because with it you loose the natural flight rules of your aircraft wich are dictated by its shape and cg. ..

For example, if you slow to a stop a plane flying horizontally with the heading hold mode on, this mode would not let the nose drop near the stall and it will fight to keep the plane level.. wich is no good.

With normal mode, the nose will gradually drop, like it should.

Hope this helps!

heraldoboldrin

Enrique..
I bought 3 powerbox srs for my 3 big models and after doing the setup of it.. I am confuse about the difference from igyro and igyro3e
In the igyro (powerbox royal srs) the igyro assistant.. tell that you have default 2 modes..FM2 and FM3…
FM2 normal mode and FM3 heading mode (just for rudder).
And they assume heading mode (1/2 gain of the normal mode for all channels) on FM2 and FM3 except for the rudder that you have heading gain just in FM3

In the igyro3e is different… the default is normal mode or heading mode.. and in heading mode the default is for aileron and elevator and rudder always is normal mode.

Can someone explain why the difference?

And I need some tips..
In the igyro.. I have to trim de model before start to setup the igyro? I should use the elevator trim with flap?
And in the igyro3e, I do the same?

BarracudaHockey

My Feedback: (11)

I've never messed with an SRS

If you bank the plane with the ailerons the plane starts to turn. Banking the plane will turn off hold mode. If the rudder was using hold mode as well it would be fighting the turn and the plane will keep going straight giving that "fighting the gyro" feeling so thats why they don't use hold mode on yaw.

Yes, trim the model and yes use your mix.

erbroens

Heraldo, FM1 (flight mode 1) FM2 and FM3 are the thee positions of the three way switch.

Usually FM1 is the gyro off, FM2 is normal mode (the one I fly) and FM3 usually is heading hold mode that can be optionally set in two ways: With the rudder gyro response on or off. On if you want to do hands off torque rolls, or Off in you want to fly in this mode but without the inconvenience of doing manual coordinated turns with rudder that would be required to fly with heading hold in three axis..

To sum it up, the powerbox srs , the igyro and the 3E are quite the same..the difference with the 3e is that it is much easier to set up.

My suggestion is to set the three position switch FM1 with off, FM2 with normal mode with smaller gain for regular flying, and FM3 with normal mode too but with a slightly higher gain for days with stronger winds.

If you are not confident on how this works, just use a small foamie plane to play around with the settings and see how the gyro feels with each setting... no risk and fun too.

JSF-TC

My Feedback: (2)

With the Cortex, I just resolved something which may be part of the comments about 'Fighting the Gyro'.


I have had a Cortex fitted since first flight of my SM Xtreme Hawk. After a few flights trimming it out, setting the gains and generally settling in and learning the model, I realized that I was struggling with the simple task of flying a level pattern. In straight wings level flight I loved the solid feel of the plane, but in the turns, after applying bank and then a little aft stick as normal to keep it level in the turn, the model would always start climbing and I would end up having to push it back down again. The patterns were very untidy and a simple description would be that I was continually 'fighting the plane'. After a few more flights thinking this was just how this plane was, I flew a couple of flights just dedicated to looking at what was happening.

I found that to stop the plane climbing in the turn, I would have to hold in a significant amount of proverse (into the turn) aileron. I think what was happening was that the plane was trying to continually roll out of the turn but at the distances involved the reduction in bank was not apparent, and the aft stick was resulting in a climb. With the proverse aileron and aft stick, I could fly a level turn, but it certainly didn't feel normal.


I use both banks of the Cortex, one for gear down and the other for gear up where I disable the NWS servo to prevent the nose wheel moving because of gyro inputs. Both banks were set to the rate mode on all axes (Norm in the PC s/w), but by chance, the gear up bank was Bank 2, which by default is the Heading Hold mode. I had switched each axis to Rate mode (Norm) in Bank 2 and turned off the NWS channel in the Rudder axis, but I had not changed any of the other advanced settings, for Gyro Gain, Stick Priority or Latching. These were left at their default HH mode values.

Once I realized that the gyro may have been causing the issues, I completely reset both banks to factory settings and then copied the Bank 1 (Rate Mode) to Bank 2 before disabling the NWS. You have to do the reset to each bank individually. That way I completely removed any residual Heading Hold settings.

My next flights were completely different. After setting up the gains again, the model was perfect. It was a calm day but I could honestly say that I could not detect the gyro beyond the plane was rock solid. There was no climbing in the turns or any other effect that could be attributed to the gyro. I even noticed that in the 45deg down lines of a Cuban 8, that normally a plane would start to pull up as the speed increased, but in this case it stayed at the original dive angle and I had to positively ease it out of the dive.


If you are feeling that you are fighting the gyro, I suggest that you try the above. It certainly worked for me.


Paul

PowerBox-Systems GmbH

@erbroens:

You really should try out the iGyro heading mode for aileron and elevator. You don´t stall - not more than without heading. This is the special heading feature only this gyro offers!



@JSF-TC
The iGyro doesn´t fight against you :-). What they meant above was: if you turn on heading on rudder- then the gyro will fight against you in a turn.

erbroens

Sure, why not? A experiment is worth a thousand technical words. If you say that this heading hold is different from others I will give it a try on my "base" plane in wich I tried 4 brands of gyros.

cycross

I have one question for the PowerBox team, but not specifically only so. I own an iGyro3E so I have vested interest on knowing PowerBox's reply.

I noticed that, other than the EagleTree Guardian, I am not aware of any gyro out there which accepts a direct flap radio input and provide an internal mix for Flaperons.
Some scale model aircraft like the F-16, F-18 types can definitely benefit from this mix's availability.

I understand that any Flaperon input mixed prior within the radio(output as AIL1, AIL2) will be interpreted as a position command, but surely if the aileron and flap outputs are distinct and input to a gyro then Flaperon mix can be implemented within the gyro itself without interfering with the gyro's ability.
Likewise for Ailevator (AIL/ELE) coupling mix, without losing the ability to still have separate ailerons output. I have not tried elevon mode whether there is still separate availability of aileron (with gyro effect on).

Can this be considered for a future software update, if not already in the pipeline of things?

PowerBox-Systems GmbH

Hello,

for a F16/F18 I can recommend you make the gyro to the ailevator with the integral delta mixer. The aileron/flap mixing remains in the transmitter. For the gyro it doesn´t matter if it is correcting to a ailevator or aileron/elevator seperate.

HarryC

My Feedback: (1)

Question for Powerbox -
I am buying an igyro 3e for my English Electric Lightning. The Lightning has big elevator trim changes when using the retracts or the flaps. These are dealt with by big changes to the elevator trim values in flight modes. Would these big changes in the trim value fool the gyro into thinking I have moved the elevator stick and so it disengages the gyro?
There is, or there was in the past, some problem using Jeti radio with the igyro SRS. Is there any problem using Jeti radio with the 3e?

BarracudaHockey

My Feedback: (11)

Well it won't disengage the gyro but it will take it as stick input and turn off heading hold if you're using that, and revert to rate dampening mode.

gunradd

My Feedback: (9)

You can do flapperons on all 3 as far as a know. I have crow on my F22 and that also works fine on all 3. IMO this is spot where the cortex shines though. During the learning process if it sees you are using ailerons and tailerons and will automatically work like that.

I still have the eagle tree on the big F16 and it is very limited in this regard. I have it hooked up to the tailerons and rudder only. I find that gyro corrections on the roll axis do not work well when used on tailerons only and dont really like it. Hope to switch it out for a cortex soon so it can be ailerons and tailerons doing the corrections.

erbroens

I like tailerons and ailerons working together for roll control like in full scale but only use gyro dampening in the wing. Works very well for me this way..

HarryC

My Feedback: (1)

So if I removed the elevator trim changes and put the gyro in HH mode, presumably the gyro will do the trim change for me?
Is it safe to leave it in HH mode during take off?

BarracudaHockey

My Feedback: (11)

You can fly in HH pretty much whenever you want with a 3e. As soon as you give stick input it reverts to rate dampening.

Here's the problem, you rely on the gyro for compensation, you're in hold mode with the flaps out, hold mode is doing its thing, you make a correction with the stick and you turn hold mode off. What's going to happen? Whatever it is will be manageable because the gyro won't let it do anything violent but it will try to move slowly, then you let go of the stick and that becomes your new established hold attitude.

Personally I'd go with the trim that way you don't have to worry about what mode the gyro is in, I never changed the elevator comp on any of my planes when I played with the gyro.

gunradd

My Feedback: (9)

Harry you need to trim out your plane like normal. If you need elevator trim for flaps then put that in like normal. With the mix with flaps down the gyro wont have as big as effect because of what is called stick priority. The further out of center you move it the less it does. So a way to help compensate you should have a mix to increase gyro gain with flaps down.

For me personally I would not use the heading hold. I have used it on the 3E and while it works I like the feel of rate mode better.