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First Impression of new I gyro 3E ( Flying )

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First Impression of new I gyro 3E ( Flying )

Old 04-29-2015, 07:37 AM
  #151  
rcjetsaok
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I am fixing to install my 3E in a Viper, and had a question that might be stupid... Is it possible to marry up the gains to flight modes? Example being, The E-flight F-4 we just got flying with the help of David Payne at Mississippi Jets, The Spektrum 636 Rx/Gyro has flight modes we assigned to the Flap switch. That being, Flaps up- normal fight we have 35% gain, Takeoff/Approach flap we have 50% gain, Full Flap we have 70% gain... Is this possible with the 3E or even the Cortex for that matter. It seems to give you the best of all worlds if it can be done. Again, this may be a dumb question, but I haven't seen any discussion along these lines... Just wondering.

Danno
Old 04-29-2015, 08:02 AM
  #152  
BarracudaHockey
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Sure.

The gyro works by the signal on the gain channel, how you get it there is up to you. On my Habu I have more gain when the gear is down because the speed will be lower and the gain can be higher.
Old 04-29-2015, 09:11 AM
  #153  
rcjetsaok
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Originally Posted by BarracudaHockey
Sure.

The gyro works by the signal on the gain channel, how you get it there is up to you. On my Habu I have more gain when the gear is down because the speed will be lower and the gain can be higher.
That would be great !! But my problem is between my ears... I'm not seeing it. How do I get there ? In the gain channel you have Zero ( off ) and two gain choices.. How do I get that to the flap switch and will that eliminate the " Off " choice. Your cutting, but I ain't bleeding... Beat the hell out me with the knowledge stick !!! I'm using JR12x if that is any comes into play...

Thanks !!
Danno
Old 04-29-2015, 10:11 AM
  #154  
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I'm not sure how to do it with that radio, though I could probably figure it out if i had it in my hands.

Look at your monitor and note what the 3 position switch is doing.

Now make your flap switch do the same thing to that channel with a mix, or to the values you wish to achieve using a mix.
Old 04-29-2015, 10:55 AM
  #155  
rcjetsaok
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Originally Posted by BarracudaHockey
I'm not sure how to do it with that radio, though I could probably figure it out if i had it in my hands.

Look at your monitor and note what the 3 position switch is doing.

Now make your flap switch do the same thing to that channel with a mix, or to the values you wish to achieve using a mix.
Roger that !! I'll give it a try. Thanks fot the insight !!!

Danno
Old 04-30-2015, 10:54 AM
  #156  
JimBrown
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Danno,

I followed Dustin's excellent video to set up my gyros on my 12x using either their own switch, or flight modes. The video is for the JR 370A, but can be applied to pretty much any gyro that uses a gain channel. So far, I've set up an Eagletree Guardian, BlueLight Iceman and two Cortex gyros using the methods described.

For fine tuning, I assign the gain channel to the left slider first. Once I'm happy with the gain setting, I then change the gain channel to the gyro sens as Dustin describes and transfer the gain setting to the gyro sens.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpp7tjJGH_Y The nice thing about using this with flight modes is that you can have five different gain settings, each attached to a specific flight mode.

Have fun!
...jim
Old 04-30-2015, 11:15 AM
  #157  
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I followed this video too! It's excellent I've attached the gain settings to my flap so with more flap I have more gain.
Old 05-02-2015, 04:13 PM
  #158  
rcjetsaok
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Huge help for me !!! Thanks Jim for the video and Dustin for the brain work !!!! I've had this radio since is came out, and I still have no idea what it can do. What could't figure out was how to get 2 or 3 position switch to work on the + side of the gyro. I an not interested in heading hold at this time. I am on Aux 2 now, off in the middle and high and lower gains up and down on the switch. In the gyro screen ( function 44 ), To work in the + side ( non-heading hold ) you have to adjust from 51-100% for your gains ( 50% being off ) . So I conclude that the % you go up is really double because you only have a 50% window to work in instead of 100 in the non-heading gold side. Because 49% and below is in the heading hold mode of the gyro. Therefore, if you want 30% gain you would set that value to 65% ( 1/2 of 30%) ... 50% being 0% and 65 being 30% of 50 to 100 of the non heading hold window. ) Am I correct on my conclusion ?? Something's burning... I think it's coming out of my ears....


Danno
Old 05-05-2015, 03:35 AM
  #159  
larshkj
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Originally Posted by larshkj
A question regarding this sentence in the quickstart guide:
"Always carry out a check of the control surface movements, taking care to move the sticks to both end-points."
Is this step for calibrating the gyro's end points? Should you put the radio in high rates before this step?

Lars
OK, I have installed one of my iGyro3e's. The answer to my questions are yes and yes. It seems that the gyro forgets the end points every time it shuts down.

Lars
Old 05-05-2015, 05:55 PM
  #160  
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Does the Gyro have to be in the Center Line or can it be off to one side slightly?
Old 05-06-2015, 04:06 AM
  #161  
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It can be anywhere you want it as long as its flat.
Old 05-29-2015, 06:54 PM
  #162  
essyou35
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I got my gyro installed today. I am glad I got the programmer because the gain is 100% default, and I can also change the orientation of the gyro for how I want to mount it.
Questions: I know gain is based on air craft but what is a good gain to start with? 30% barely moves stuff and 70% has a lot of movement.

To counter a cross wind on landing, do I need to use heading hold mode or will rate mode work fine? That is 90% of the reason I got it.

Thanks and looking forward to joining the gyro club so I can know for sure what effect they have!
Old 05-29-2015, 10:21 PM
  #163  
Eddie P
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The best way to get used to the gyro is use it first on a well known aircraft. Just go with Rate mode first to keep your life and understanding simple and enjoyable. If the model is a 70 mph model, like a smaller lighter warbird, and your flight controls are set for smooth flying (not outrageous throws) then you could probably get away with 100 percent. But when I say "probably" I mean it is all relative. Each model is different depending on how your flight controls are set up, how fast you fly and what type of model we are talking about. A fast model or a model that has high control throws on the other hand may need as little as 10 or 20 percent gain.

The reason you want to use it on a well known model is you will get used to using a gyro first and don;t want to worry about learning the model too at the same time. I assume this is your first gyro like this based on the setup questions. Nothing wrong with that, just allow yourself some short learning curve to get up to speed and it will happen fast, it's pretty intuitive.

On faster jets the gain needs to be lower in general, especially if the control throws are also be large for aggressive flight. On that 150 mph jet I mentioned, it's also is set up for sport flying and aggressive aerobatics. I take off and land at 35 percent gain and fly at max speed at 10 percent gain or less... and do most of my aerobatics at mid speed at about 25 percent. The effect is very good yet gracefully presents itself when needed without being too much of a worry of over correction from the gyro.

I started out "learning" what sorts of gains work with what types of planes and speeds by using the gyro via having it on a slider switch. I used the "up" position of the slider mean no gain (off) and "full down" on the slider mean full gain (relative full gain as limited by my programming). I limited the "gain" in the transmitter end point programming feature so that on the initial warbird, for example, full gain was 100 percent. On the faster aerobatic sport jet full gain was 30 percent. Then slider positions toward "off" were obviously less on a linear scale.

You explore the flight envelope of the plane by setting a gain and then aggressively "bumping" a flight control then neutralizing it to check the response of the plane to the upset. If the "bump" on aileron for example leads to a soft stop of the upset, you are good "for that speed on that plane" at "that gain", etc. If you get an oscillation after the bump upset test, IOW, the plane waggles a bit on that axis while correcting for the upset, your gain is "too high" on "that plane at that speed". Etc. If, while flying, your plane starts to oscilate on it's own for any reason, your gain is clearly too high for "that plane at that speed". You need to know how to stop this sort of uncommanded oscilation. The cure is throttle idle, pull up to bleed speed. Once flying safely turn off your gain to zero and then when you take a breath or two re set your gain to a lower setting.

After a few flights you can get a really good "approximation" of what gains will do what for what plane at what speeds.

After testing each plane - takes a couple flights to do it right - then you can take your gyro control off the slider and put it into a general radio mix. For example, gear down means full gain (let's say full gain on this plane is 40 percent, then gear down get's you full 40 percent gain). Gear up means mid gain (let's say 25 percent. Like a gain you'd like while scale flying a routine). Then if you have a flight model switch that softens up your controls a little or another switch that you can slave, that might set you up for "high speed". IOW, gain might go down to 10 percent, for example, in this "mode". There are a million ways to do it but that's how I have my gyros set up now that I tested the planes on the slider setup way first.

I don't want to write a novella about it but those are the main points.
Old 05-29-2015, 10:31 PM
  #164  
Eddie P
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PS crosswind flying with a gyro uses exactly the same techniques and skills as flying a plane without a gyro. Using "rate" mode, you do not alter any flying techniques at all with or without crosswinds.

What a well set-up gyro system will do for you is reduce the overshooting upsets, oscillations, wing rocks, dutch rolls, pitch overshoots, PIO's, etc. Those tend to be more present in windy conditions. The gyro will be working hard for you in those conditions to make the plane "appear" like it's flying in calmer winds than it is. Ground speed visual perspective vs real air speed visual illusions not withstanding. Also, down drafts, up drafts and other heavy wind effects will still greatly effect your models relative distance form the ground and will still present hazards to flight so respect the limits of your own skills and the limits of the airframe in winds. In other words it changes nothing for what's required of our pilot skills but makes everything "look way better" and makes the model much less touchy to correct for in order for you to have more mental capacity to accurately manage flight path control and energy management. Your plane flies like it's bigger and is more enjoyable to fly and watch fly.
Old 05-30-2015, 06:19 AM
  #165  
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Great response Eddie!! I am pretty new to gyros as well and my limited experience with some of the older style gyros which the gain effected the control travel were not enjoyable... I have the Igyro 3e getting delivered today and am very excited to give it a try and had already planned out the same method for setting it up. The gear switch mix is a great idea!

If if you go to powerbox's website you will find a pdf of an article from a magazine that describes the same setup process Eddie mentioned, it's a very good read and can help really describe what you might expect from the gyro.

As for the crosswind scenario Eddie is correct if using rate mode but according to the article headlock mode (which is specifically designed for fix wing) will help with the crosswind landings. Most of us don't like that term head lock since the past use of gyros that were designed for heli's in head lock mode usually meant a white knuckle expierence! In this case I have talked to a few pilots using it and it works very well but does take a flight or two to get used to it!

Cant to wait for mine to arrive!! If all goes well I might be ordering up 3-4 more of them
Old 05-30-2015, 08:15 AM
  #166  
gunradd
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For me I like having the gain mixed with the flap switch. Sometimes I like doing slow passes with the flaps down gear up so that's why I do it that way. But either way it helps take the workload of the pilot which is a good thing.
Old 05-30-2015, 08:49 AM
  #167  
essyou35
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This jets getting more advanced all the time. I have two unknowns now, a bigger turbine and a gyro. Its been 6 months since I've flown, its been 20-30MPH winds for over a month, today its 55 degrees with 20mh winds so its cold. I may just have to move to fly this jet! If the gyro helps I may put one on my mig-29 as well. I got my IGyro sticker on it so people know I'm using a gyro.
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Old 05-30-2015, 10:20 AM
  #168  
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Originally Posted by essyou35
I got my gyro installed today. I am glad I got the programmer because the gain is 100% default, and I can also change the orientation of the gyro for how I want to mount it.
Questions: I know gain is based on air craft but what is a good gain to start with? 30% barely moves stuff and 70% has a lot of movement.

To counter a cross wind on landing, do I need to use heading hold mode or will rate mode work fine? That is 90% of the reason I got it.

Thanks and looking forward to joining the gyro club so I can know for sure what effect they have!
I don't understand this statement, are you talking about the iGyro 3e? Because the gain is changed by connecting the gain channel and setting the end points in your transmitter.
Old 05-30-2015, 10:22 AM
  #169  
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Originally Posted by bri6672
Great response Eddie!! I am pretty new to gyros as well and my limited experience with some of the older style gyros which the gain effected the control travel were not enjoyable... I have the Igyro 3e getting delivered today and am very excited to give it a try and had already planned out the same method for setting it up. The gear switch mix is a great idea!

If if you go to powerbox's website you will find a pdf of an article from a magazine that describes the same setup process Eddie mentioned, it's a very good read and can help really describe what you might expect from the gyro.

As for the crosswind scenario Eddie is correct if using rate mode but according to the article headlock mode (which is specifically designed for fix wing) will help with the crosswind landings. Most of us don't like that term head lock since the past use of gyros that were designed for heli's in head lock mode usually meant a white knuckle expierence! In this case I have talked to a few pilots using it and it works very well but does take a flight or two to get used to it!

Cant to wait for mine to arrive!! If all goes well I might be ordering up 3-4 more of them
Eh, that Fly RC guy doesn't know what the heck he's talking about
Old 05-30-2015, 11:21 AM
  #170  
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Hmm well I know of someone that set one up that way and it worked great! Not sure what the discrepancy is, can you elaborate? Would love any additional info!
Old 05-30-2015, 11:23 AM
  #171  
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Originally Posted by bri6672
Hmm well I know of someone that set one up that way and it worked great! Not sure what the discrepancy is, can you elaborate? Would love any additional info!
I think he is being self-deprecating
Old 05-30-2015, 11:31 AM
  #172  
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Ahhhhhh now I get it
Old 05-30-2015, 12:28 PM
  #173  
essyou35
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Originally Posted by BarracudaHockey
I don't understand this statement, are you talking about the iGyro 3e? Because the gain is changed by connecting the gain channel and setting the end points in your transmitter.
What I mean is that each channel is 100% of the total gain, meaning they are all the same gain. You need the programmer to set relative gains for each channel.
Old 05-30-2015, 12:42 PM
  #174  
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Oh! Yea, ok thats correct. Sorry I misunderstood what you were saying.
Old 05-30-2015, 01:44 PM
  #175  
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All,

i know now what heading hold is but what is rate? I think it is when the gyro will try and maintain the current condition. So when you turn the gyro would try and maintain each set movement. Is that even close? If it is why would you use rate and not always use heading hold?

thanks for any explination

scott

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