Jetkopter

My Feedback: (1)

Lee Buskirk and Jim Ellis I don’t have good news for youyour karma bucket is full. I will not be able to help you guys out with thelies you want me to tell or truths that you think need bending. On Thursday night 1/1/2015 I got an emailthat was not intended for my eyes. I was from Jim Ellis, VP of Farview. It wasto six members who he thought he could trust not to share it with me. The mailsays please guys now is the time to put up or shut up I know you don’t want tohurt Erik but Don is out of line on RCU and I need support. This confirms thatall of the behind the scenes, back door cronyism is what’s sucking the life outFarview Flyers. Later on that eve. I got a call from Lee Buskirk, the presidentof the Farview Flyers. It’s was not to wish me a happy new year, it was toexpress his extreme discomfort about my prior posts here on RCU about myaccount of why the Club has problems with losing the club field. Lee tried to intimidate me and strong arm meinto changing my post about the facts I posted and if I didn’t I would be downthe road. Lee wanted to have Jim post that there was misinformation about thebanning of jets from Farview and wanted me to come here and say that I acted onwrong information and the Lee only made a few mistakes that he was now sorryfor. I can’t believe I actually consider doing it for a minute! Jim Ellismisled the jet flyers at Farview and wasted our time, effort and money byhaving us attend these zoning meetings. He discounted our opinions and wishesand went against us without any prior warning, a fact he has stated here onRCU. I don’t always have the best memory so I have a have a habit of saving mytext and emails to substantiate the claims I made. Jim forgot everything wetalked about, the Jet guys did not. I told all this to Lee, he told me I am nota core member of the club and I already knew that but I have been an advocateof the club, and advocate of model aviation in general. A couple of years ago afounding member of the club had a problem with the board and tried to have thelandowner break the lease with Farview Flyers, I went to the board and gavethem a heads up as soon as I had knowledge of it so they could squash theproblem before it even got started. Looking back now I wonder if I did theright thing. That member was complaining about excessive speed and unsafepractices at Farview, He had the ear of the AMA, BV and several others. He warned that board that if something tocurb this was not done they would lose the field sooner than later. Theyignored him and protected the rule breakers in the club and overlooked safetyconcerns at events. When Erik was ejected this past summer for his breaking ofevery rule you could possibly think of pertaining to model aviation and goodcommon sense, I came to his defense and stuck my neck out for him. Not becauseI approved or condoned anything Erik did. I told Lee other members broke therules lust like Erik and those where the same people that spotted for him andegged him on by telling him “Awesome flight Dude” They saw Erik getting awaywith it and they thought it was ok because lee allowed it to happen. Lee andErik where good friends. I told Lee, you created this monster by allowing therule breaking and now that you’re under the microscope you no longer want toown it, so you get rid of him and make it look like you did the right thing forthe club. Lee the club is not fair and balanced, almost anyone else would havebeen down the driveway years ago. Lee now agrees with me on this point and alsothat the fireworks at the giant scale where an error in judgment on his part.So now after Lee’s confession that he makes mistakes just like all the rest ofus the conversation turns to we need to fix what you posted on RCU so the wrongpeople don’t see it and so we can save face because it’s embarrassing. I remindLee that Jim has insulted the people who were rallied around him and supportedhim and the board. He has to admit he gave us misleading and in accurateinformation and then based on l will figure a way to sugar coat this mess. Itwasn’t 5 minutes before I hung up the phone with Lee that I said what am Iabout to do? If I edit, lie, and twist the truth well I’m just as bad as therest of them. I can’t believe I ever considered doing it. I reached out topeople I respect about this for some input to get there opinion if this willbenefit the club. The people range from CD’s to my connections at the AMA. Theresounding answer I got was why would want to fly with guys from a club thatconduct themselves this way. That was from the AMA. I asked what has been yourexperience with clubs that find themselves in this situation of losing a fieldwhen the club is not well structured and has complaints against it. Not verysuccessful is what I was told. So what is the procedure for helping a club withlegal matters? We do an investigation into all of the facts before hand to makesure our money is spent wisely because our funds are limited because we had tohire a PR firms to help with the drone issues. So at the end of the day thetruth about everything will eventually come out and the chips will fall wherethey may. The lesson learned here is start your club out on the right foot withcommon goals. Do not unfairly favor one person over another and run yourorganization for the benefit of all members not a select few. It will add yearsto the years to the longevity of your flying sight, your club and yourfriendships. All of these things are hard to replace one you lose them.

Mike06659

Let me know if you guys would consider our location for a Jet Rally. I can get the ball rolling. You can check Pegasus R/C Modelers Club out on Facebook as well to see a few pics of our field. I have attached one picture to give you an idea. We have hosted many events and were a great success.

Thanks,
Mike

flyinwalenda

My Feedback: (5)

"...and the award for the longest paragraph so far goes to ...."

afterburner

My Feedback: (18)

Don, you really summed up the right attitude for any group trying to start up and maintain a flying site. The one thing I have noticed in the limited number of clubs I've been in, is to watch out for the individuals who are very controlling as they usually jump at the chance to get the President or V.P. positions in a club and since most members don't want to volunteer for those positions anyway, they are more than happy to keep them year after year and like you said if they don't have the club's best interests in mind, things can go bad quickly. I'm not implying that is what's happening at Farview as I'm just an outsider reading the posts in this thread. I'm just making a general statement on what members of any club should be aware of.

I really hope you guys can get past the internal issues and focus on working with your neighbors to preserve the field.

rhklenke

My Feedback: (24)

Mike,

A couple of questions I would ask are:

How long is the runway?

What crops are planted in the surrounding field? (corn is somewhat problematic - especially at either end...)

How smooth is the runway surface?

Does the club have a problem with the occasional "brown spots" from running turbines on jets like Kingcats?

Bob

Ron Stahl

My Feedback: (12)

Mike,
Bob beat me too the same questions. I'm running for the district 4 rep position in the JPO. We are lacking not only flying sites but a place to hold a rally in MD. When is your next meeting, I live in Reisterstown which is about 1.5 hours away on the northwest side of Baltimore? I would like to come and see the field and speak to your members about jet flying. Does your club have any memebrs flying turbines?

vinnyjet

My Feedback: (39)

Originally Posted by Jetkopter The lesson learned here is start your club out on the right foot with common goals. Do not unfairly favor one person over another and run your organization for the benefit of all members not a select few. It will add years to the years to the longevity of your flying sight, your club and your friendships. All of these things are hard to replace one you lose them.

well said don

as722

My Feedback: (1)

Don,

As a member of farview I would have thought you would want to help save the club. You're not helping in any way.If you have issues with Jim or Lee that's certainly fine and I respect that but please keep it between you and them in a private manner. Have you thought what your post can do to the club if the wrong person gets a hold of it? Please think before you post anything that can hurt the club.

Thank you
Albert Santiago

racer8297

My Feedback: (13)

Dirty laundry was here!

racer8297

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Removed due to flu.

smchale

My Feedback: (67)

Jim,
this is the first I've heard about a club meeting, will there be a formal note sent out to the membership with an agenda and topics for discussion? Will there be a call in line available for those that can't make it in person so they can also be included in this discussion?
thanks for your consideration.

racer8297

My Feedback: (13)

Hi Sean,

An email will go out next week. For those that can't make it, you can send any questions or comments to me via email and they will be read at the meeting.

The purpose of the meeting is to advise all members of the status of the zoning issues and to answer any questions and entertain any ideas that the membership may have.

Unfortunately we will not be entertaining any phone in questions during the meeting.

Jack28

My Feedback: (19)

What a shame. This was my favorite place to fly jets and the events were awesome. My local club banned turbines this past year and Fairview was the only other field close (1.5 hrs.) to me that was great for jet flying. It seems to me that many more clubs will face the demise of turbine jet flying unless you are in a desert somewhere with no one around. Maybe time for a new hobby as the opposition we face as turbine flyers is gaining traction. I still don't see a difference in a 200 mph turbine jet verses a 200 mph electric jet they both over lots of ground. Very frustrating, Jack George.

afterburner

My Feedback: (18)

Jack,
Just curious why your other club banned turbines as I was discussing this today with a flying buddy. As I searched on the AMA's site for clubs near where I might be relocating in the future, I was very surprised at the number of clubs that restrict them and we couldn't conclude if it was mostly a safety issue, a noise issue or just club leadership that want's nothing to do with them.

wojtek

My Feedback: (73)

Unfortunately many ( not most but many ) clubs restrict them so the club hot shots cant be one upped by something they font do or have .. I visited fairly a local club once in NJ and had a jet in the trailer, though I was there to fly a prop warbird. After all the guys wanted me to take it out to just see it as this was their first time seeing a RC jet , i had the club president try and tell me that I was not legally allowed to even take my plane out of the vehicle .. lol .. some places just roll like that.

I really am not happy seeing were this is going, not just with Farview, but everywhere. Unfortunately this means more and more of us will be taking the fox hole approach to flying sites .. private, and not open clubs :\ many guys are talking of jets and big warbirds fields only being sought after.




Voy

jofunk

I would appeal to state or county leadership that the community is in need of a public flying site where every type of RC aircraft can be flown. It would be state or county property, ideally with the overfly area being public property also. If you can get something to take root you could use that as an example to show the neighboring state or county what is being done. Cook county here in the Chicago area has 9 RC flying fields. You can literally drive past one every 15 or 20 minutes as you drive through the Chicago metro. area. Heck, I would take what Cook county has done to any county board in this country and say "We only need one flying site in this county to serve the community". Could you imagine the number of RC flying sites we would have if every county in this country installed one RC flying site?

RCFlyerDan

My Feedback: (54)

In Florida, it is the same, that is, having flying fields on State, county, city public land. Everything from trash dumps, city parks, Florida Green space, etc. Would be something for the Officer's of the Club to look into.

It is also ashamed to see a Club's "dirty laundry" being aired this way. Grow up boys! You aren't in middle school anymore.

TUMBLER

My Feedback: (13)

This is my field as well. They were banned because of the close proximity to a small full scale airfield and the land owners complaints about us flying over it. It was never an issue before but due to FAA involvement last year, the club did not want to run the risk of losing the field. So without even a warning or support from the club president, we lost the ability to fly jets. So even though giant scale warbirds and even some smaller .40 size planes are guilty of the same infraction, only turbines were banned.

I called around to local fields big enough for jets and found at least 2 that had no turbines currently flying there so weren't sure how to answer my question, but they checked and said they don't welcome them at this time.

Mike06659

I sent a few of you guys a private message responding to your questions about a turbine friendly field. Check your RCU Inboxes when you get a chance. Let me know if you have any other questions and will be happy to show you the field.
Mike

jofunk

Does anyone know of a public flying field banning turbine flying? If so,what was the reason and who made the call to ban turbine flying? I could see this sort of thing happening on a private piece of land that is exclusively used by a private club.

Ron Stahl

My Feedback: (12)

My lcoal club has not banned turbines. However they effectively have stopped some of us because they have set a sound limt that I can't pass at full power, but the neighbors say they can't hear my plane when I'm in the air (Turbinator P-120) when we test flew it for them two years ago. The locals were complaining on how loud the Jets and big planes were and we setup a test day with jets and large prop planes flying at the same time and they asked when was the jet going to fly and we told them by phone I had just landed after a ten minute flight. They could hear the 40% planes that could pass the sound check over 1/2 mile away from the property but not mine. So I flew it again by myself and they said no problem but the club members refuse to change the sound check procedures for jets. My buddies P-70 powered Shockjet passes so all is good with him.

afterburner

My Feedback: (18)

Unfortunately the AMA doesn't seem to address turbines at all with respect to sound levels and more importantly how they are audibly perceived in the air. Interesting how your club went to the level of testing that they did with the neighbors and then still wouldn't make an exception when it was found the Turbinator didn't bother them.

jofunk

It sounds like they should change the sound check procedures period. A jet engine is relatively quieter in the air. Some piston engines turning a prop on the ground are quieter at full power as opposed to them being in the air and the prop tip breaking the sound barrier when it unloads. We've all been at the flying field when that big gasser comes by down hill and the prop is cracking away. Its cool but sometimes painful to listen to. In these circumstances you could average the fly by sound levels in with the stationary run up sound levels and the jet would probably be quieter. It seems the neighbors would agree. The sound limit rule your club passed was to protect the neighbors peace and quiet. It doesn't "sound" like they are working.

ira d

I think all the new restrictions that various clubs have been coming up with in the last year or so will at some point backfire on them. restrictions like the 400 ft
limit, Also turbines and multiple rotor craft and FPV that have been operating at rc sites for years with few if any safety problems.

In the end I think clubs and also the AMA will start to loose members if this practice continues.

George

My Feedback: (57)

Yes, I know of one.

I was told the "city" made the call; and I believe it was based on the fire potential (in the event of a crash) in a very inaccessible area and the surrounding farms. In their defense, this was many, many years ago.