Xicoy Electronic C.G. Balancer
06-04-2016, 08:12 AM
#251
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Here is a partial quote that I received from Gasper a while back regarding the Correction point not showing in the right direction on the Tail Dragger Mode.
"Hello Randy,
Yes, we have found that some taildraggers need to enter correction aft of the main wheels, it is needed to enter a negative value for the correction point that current software don’t allow. This will be solved on next software release."
This why I asked about an update on a release.
It doesn't keep a person from using the machine but it's nice to have everything working properly.
"Hello Randy,
Yes, we have found that some taildraggers need to enter correction aft of the main wheels, it is needed to enter a negative value for the correction point that current software don’t allow. This will be solved on next software release."
This why I asked about an update on a release.
It doesn't keep a person from using the machine but it's nice to have everything working properly.
06-04-2016, 07:21 PM
#252
Join Date: Jun 2006
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No that is a bug and he was right to ask. A bug means it does not work correctly. Not working correctly is certainly not a missing option. Quite frankly I am glad he asked and we should all be aware of this if you buy or are thinking of buying.
Come on. Software not working properly is an option. Who is paying you?
Come on. Software not working properly is an option. Who is paying you?
06-05-2016, 04:23 AM
#253
I hadn't thought of this issue at first either but since you can only enter positive value, while it still gives you an answer, as I recall it tells you the plane is tail heavy when it's actually nose heavy, etc.. By looking at the values you can pretty easily tell whats going on and get the job done but since it displays incorrect information I think that qualifies as a real bug. Not a major one but a bug none the less.
06-06-2016, 04:03 AM
#255
This may be a solution for weighing warbirds inverted.
The cones comes in different lengths
Last edited by bcovish; 06-06-2016 at 04:08 AM.
06-06-2016, 01:49 PM
#256
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I can understand wanting to balance with the gear up. On the other hand nice to have the CG right for landing. With the cones you can see what the effect is. Most every plane is built so that the gear do NOT highly affect the CG. If they did then we would have some planes that one couldn't land. Yes, some retracts do change CG. But most of the time they move the CG slightly forward.
All our planes have a safe margin for CG movement. Go look at the recommended CG ranges for even fairly small aircraft. Then look at the range for larger aircraft we are putting retracts into. All you need to be is close for the first flight and then adjust from there. The only times I have seen a problem with CG is when the manual had it wrong and the guy putting it together did not do his own check. If you are close to the correct CG you will have a flyable aircraft and that is all we are doing with this system or any other that helps us set the INITIAL CG.
On balancing upside down. I believe this started from one; the gear interfered with the balancer and two; the plane is less stable on the balancer with the weight above the pendulum point. But I see no reason that putting the aircraft upside down or right side up will affect the CG point. When the plane is balanced the CG is merely the point at which you have the same amount of mass forward or backward of that point. I.E. inverted or not the CG stays the same. Have you ever heard of a full scale aircraft that had its CG set while upside down?
All our planes have a safe margin for CG movement. Go look at the recommended CG ranges for even fairly small aircraft. Then look at the range for larger aircraft we are putting retracts into. All you need to be is close for the first flight and then adjust from there. The only times I have seen a problem with CG is when the manual had it wrong and the guy putting it together did not do his own check. If you are close to the correct CG you will have a flyable aircraft and that is all we are doing with this system or any other that helps us set the INITIAL CG.
On balancing upside down. I believe this started from one; the gear interfered with the balancer and two; the plane is less stable on the balancer with the weight above the pendulum point. But I see no reason that putting the aircraft upside down or right side up will affect the CG point. When the plane is balanced the CG is merely the point at which you have the same amount of mass forward or backward of that point. I.E. inverted or not the CG stays the same. Have you ever heard of a full scale aircraft that had its CG set while upside down?
06-07-2016, 09:28 AM
#258
Join Date: Jun 2006
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I have a number of warbirds up to 100cc. I just received the Xicoy. Going to have some fun testing and will let you know how the measurement is affected. Will take me some time but I will get back on this. Anyone faster than me go for it.
06-07-2016, 09:55 AM
#259
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Arenys de Munt- BARCELONA, SPAIN
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Version 1,4 is available to download here: www.xicoy.com/downloads/CGMeter1_4.zip
The only change from version 1.3 is that now is possible to enter negative numbers to define the position of the correction point in the tail (aft the main wheels). So in the parameter "Distance from mains to weight placement" , if you enter a positive number, means that the correction point is located forward the main wheels (nose), and if you enter an negative number, the correction point is located aft the main wheels, in the tail.
Haven't changed anything else, and I have been fully testing the new maths, but at this moment this new release has not been cross tested by anyone else than me, so if you find any issue, let me know ASAP.
Gaspar
The only change from version 1.3 is that now is possible to enter negative numbers to define the position of the correction point in the tail (aft the main wheels). So in the parameter "Distance from mains to weight placement" , if you enter a positive number, means that the correction point is located forward the main wheels (nose), and if you enter an negative number, the correction point is located aft the main wheels, in the tail.
Haven't changed anything else, and I have been fully testing the new maths, but at this moment this new release has not been cross tested by anyone else than me, so if you find any issue, let me know ASAP.
Gaspar
06-07-2016, 11:26 AM
#260
Version 1,4 is available to download here: www.xicoy.com/downloads/CGMeter1_4.zip
The only change from version 1.3 is that now is possible to enter negative numbers to define the position of the correction point in the tail (aft the main wheels). So in the parameter "Distance from mains to weight placement" , if you enter a positive number, means that the correction point is located forward the main wheels (nose), and if you enter an negative number, the correction point is located aft the main wheels, in the tail.
Haven't changed anything else, and I have been fully testing the new maths, but at this moment this new release has not been cross tested by anyone else than me, so if you find any issue, let me know ASAP.
Gaspar
The only change from version 1.3 is that now is possible to enter negative numbers to define the position of the correction point in the tail (aft the main wheels). So in the parameter "Distance from mains to weight placement" , if you enter a positive number, means that the correction point is located forward the main wheels (nose), and if you enter an negative number, the correction point is located aft the main wheels, in the tail.
Haven't changed anything else, and I have been fully testing the new maths, but at this moment this new release has not been cross tested by anyone else than me, so if you find any issue, let me know ASAP.
Gaspar
Web site updated.
Last edited by olnico; 06-07-2016 at 11:29 AM.
06-07-2016, 05:32 PM
#261
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Just did the update. Wish that this unit had the mSD slot that pops the card back out. My card was flush with the box when in and had to use the tip of a small knife to get it back out.
Otherwise the update is quick and painless.
Otherwise the update is quick and painless.
06-08-2016, 02:40 PM
#264
My Feedback: (41)
no that is a bug and he was right to ask. A bug means it does not work correctly. Not working correctly is certainly not a missing option. Quite frankly i am glad he asked and we should all be aware of this if you buy or are thinking of buying.
Come on. Software not working properly is an option. Who is paying you?
Come on. Software not working properly is an option. Who is paying you?
06-10-2016, 02:31 AM
#265
And this is why this machine is so handy. You can establish a baseline for your first flights, record your CG to the mm and keep a record of it in the machine.
CG modifications are super easy to characterize after the maiden. Once the CG is nailed, it is just a matter of checking the plane within a few seconds.
Why would you need to re-check the CG once it is perfect?
New batteries fitted
A different engine fitted
Bigger tanks fitted
Addition of ordnance, scale cockpit, or other scale refinements
Re-painting to a new scheme
Crash and repair with adding fiber cloth on one end of the plane...
By the way, the method used with the CG machine is exactly the same as the one used on airliners, private planes and fighter airplanes for airworthiness. If it'd be dodgy, you would see planes falling out of the sky all the time.
We use this machine for professional UAV certificate of airworthiness. Our certification body does not allow pendulum methods any more after having seen and purchased on of these. The CG machine is becoming the norm in the professional World.
CG modifications are super easy to characterize after the maiden. Once the CG is nailed, it is just a matter of checking the plane within a few seconds.
Why would you need to re-check the CG once it is perfect?
New batteries fitted
A different engine fitted
Bigger tanks fitted
Addition of ordnance, scale cockpit, or other scale refinements
Re-painting to a new scheme
Crash and repair with adding fiber cloth on one end of the plane...
By the way, the method used with the CG machine is exactly the same as the one used on airliners, private planes and fighter airplanes for airworthiness. If it'd be dodgy, you would see planes falling out of the sky all the time.
We use this machine for professional UAV certificate of airworthiness. Our certification body does not allow pendulum methods any more after having seen and purchased on of these. The CG machine is becoming the norm in the professional World.
06-10-2016, 02:55 AM
#266
My Feedback: (41)
and this is why this machine is so handy. You can establish a baseline for your first flights, record your cg to the mm and keep a record of it in the machine.
Cg modifications are super easy to characterize after the maiden. Once the cg is nailed, it is just a matter of checking the plane within a few seconds.
Why would you need to re-check the cg once it is perfect?
New batteries fitted
a different engine fitted
bigger tanks fitted
addition of ordnance, scale cockpit, or other scale refinements
re-painting to a new scheme
crash and repair with adding fiber cloth on one end of the plane...
By the way, the method used with the cg machine is exactly the same as the one used on airliners, private planes and fighter airplanes for airworthiness. If it'd be dodgy, you would see planes falling out of the sky all the time.
We use this machine for professional uav certificate of airworthiness. Our certification body does not allow pendulum methods any more after having seen and purchased on of these. The cg machine is becoming the norm in the professional world.
Cg modifications are super easy to characterize after the maiden. Once the cg is nailed, it is just a matter of checking the plane within a few seconds.
Why would you need to re-check the cg once it is perfect?
New batteries fitted
a different engine fitted
bigger tanks fitted
addition of ordnance, scale cockpit, or other scale refinements
re-painting to a new scheme
crash and repair with adding fiber cloth on one end of the plane...
By the way, the method used with the cg machine is exactly the same as the one used on airliners, private planes and fighter airplanes for airworthiness. If it'd be dodgy, you would see planes falling out of the sky all the time.
We use this machine for professional uav certificate of airworthiness. Our certification body does not allow pendulum methods any more after having seen and purchased on of these. The cg machine is becoming the norm in the professional world.
06-10-2016, 06:47 AM
#267
We don't use that method anymore on real aircraft, its essentially the same as the xicoy. I think this tool is pretty nice for the large planes and jets that don't allow for a single person balancing without build some crazy balancing setup. The only part I don't like is having to do the measuring which is why I started a database over on the GJC thread when I was with them. Wish I could get it moved to this forum and stickied to the top. I also finally used the throw meters and this tool, is just that another tool to make things more precise and easy. The first version I had sucked but once I got the new hockey pucks it is accurate and well worth the money.... Like most things that cause a change, there will always be those who voice anger over change.
06-10-2016, 01:32 PM
#268
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Gaspar "It does, you should push the card to release."
I am aware of that type of slot. However, mine does not do that. No big deal. Small tweezers will work for the few times we will have to do this.
BTW since we have a microSD slot will we see an update that allows us to save aircraft data to the microSD card? I ask that because I have over 80 flyable aircraft. It would be nice to keep a record of control surface throws and CG info. That way if a plane has been in long term storage I can do a quick check to see if anything has changed. It would be a shame if that slot will only be used to update the unit.
I am aware of that type of slot. However, mine does not do that. No big deal. Small tweezers will work for the few times we will have to do this.
BTW since we have a microSD slot will we see an update that allows us to save aircraft data to the microSD card? I ask that because I have over 80 flyable aircraft. It would be nice to keep a record of control surface throws and CG info. That way if a plane has been in long term storage I can do a quick check to see if anything has changed. It would be a shame if that slot will only be used to update the unit.
06-30-2016, 08:46 AM
#271
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I seem to be the odd man out. I got one delivered yesterday and it is DOA out of the box. You can see the display power up, it changes illumination very slightly. But then nothing. It just stays the same dimly lit blank screen.
I've tried 3 different batteries and confirmed that all the plugs are in correctly.
Waiting on Chief to contact the manufacturer to see what's up. Kind of bummed. Right now I have a $300 paper weight!!
06-30-2016, 11:40 AM
#273
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